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Star Citizen v EVE

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Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#381 - 2013-09-07 11:51:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Alpheias
raven666wings wrote:
Alpheias wrote:

It is using the CryEngine3 for certain, but it is still a trailer with animated characters and animated objects so I disagree with you that it is ingame footage, as as you claim, and what should be common knowledge to anyone following this project, Star Citizen is still in development.

Pray tell how you think segmented scenes from a trailer is ingame footage when anyone with a good understanding of 3D modelling and animation can, using the assets, put something together. By your own logic, the old Evolution video is a ingame video when it is clearly not.


Hum... so by your rationale, the trailer is using Cry Engine 3 but the footage is not ingame footage because the characters and assets are animated?!?! Interesting. I thought this was what the graphic engine did to them... You're suggesting then that they should have simply put them static in the trailer? Sorry again I don't follow... you seem rather confused. Oh yes.. that video you linked there is another example of an EVE trailer using EVE assets in some animation software other than EVE's graphic engine. I agree with you on that.


You must be one of those that goes to great lengths to argue with his own reflection. For hours, literally.

raven666wings wrote:
Alpheias wrote:

You mean 'finished' like this? :p


It's not finished, is it? Hold on.. aren't you from the "CCP please fire the Carbon developers or we throw a tantrum, because EVE is only about spaceships" crowd? And you're complaining that it's not finished?!?! .... The contradiction is strong in this one.


I was then and still am strongly against Incarna. My post was to gleefully rub some more salt into the wounds of all those that still want Incarna because I am a colossal vapid tool.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#382 - 2013-09-07 12:00:50 UTC
Alpheias wrote:

You must be one of those that goes to great lengths to argue with his own reflection. For hours, literally.

I was then and still am strongly against Incarna. My post was to gleefully rub some more salt into the wounds of all those that still want Incarna because I am a colossal vapid tool.


More verbal diarrhea? You're still in denial of your evident uncoherent thought? I think you should consider getting professional help. Acceptance of one's problems is the first step towards treatment. Though i'm not sure they will find one efficient enough for your condition.
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#383 - 2013-09-07 12:02:23 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
Alpheias wrote:

You must be one of those that goes to great lengths to argue with his own reflection. For hours, literally.

I was then and still am strongly against Incarna. My post was to gleefully rub some more salt into the wounds of all those that still want Incarna because I am a colossal vapid tool.


More verbal diarrhea? You're still in denial of your evident uncoherent thought? I think you should consider getting professional help. Acceptance of one's problems is the first step towards treatment. Though i'm not sure they will find one efficient enough for your condition.


No, I am just having popcorn and reading your posts. Please do continue to sperg some more.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#384 - 2013-09-07 12:17:37 UTC
oh yeah? would you like a fine SC gameplay video to go with it? well here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzcelfmiRMg enjoy Lol
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#385 - 2013-09-07 12:26:31 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
oh yeah? would you like a fine SC gameplay video to go with it? well here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzcelfmiRMg enjoy Lol


I really do hope you, and everyone else, who are passionate fans of Star Citizen get exactly what is mentioned about in that video. I really do.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Tanesha Kring
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#386 - 2013-09-07 12:46:45 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
Alpheias wrote:

It is using the CryEngine3 for certain, but it is still a trailer with animated characters and animated objects so I disagree with you that it is ingame footage, as as you claim, and what should be common knowledge to anyone following this project, Star Citizen is still in development.

Pray tell how you think segmented scenes from a trailer is ingame footage when anyone with a good understanding of 3D modelling and animation can, using the assets, put something together. By your own logic, the old Evolution video is a ingame video when it is clearly not.


Hum... so by your rationale, the trailer is using Cry Engine 3 but the footage is not ingame footage because the characters and assets are animated?!?! Interesting. I thought this was what the graphic engine did to them... You're suggesting then that they should have simply put them static in the trailer? Sorry again I don't follow... you seem rather confused. Oh yes.. that video you linked there is another example of an EVE trailer using EVE assets in some animation software other than EVE's graphic engine. I agree with you on that.

Alpheias wrote:

You mean 'finished' like this? :p


It's not finished, is it? Hold on.. aren't you from the "CCP please fire the Carbon developers or we throw a tantrum, because EVE is only about spaceships" crowd? And you're complaining that it's not finished?!?! .... The contradiction is strong in this one.


To be fair I think the implication was that the it was a scripted scene where the objects interacted and moved only by being scripted to do so. In that case, there would not really be any gameplay elements being utilized (no physics, no players, no damage mechanic, no AI and so on) and the entire scene constitutes scripted cinematics like an ingame movie. Prototype engines are often used to pitch games, but they are not used for preview trailers like the one for SC very often, though in this case since the trailer is also the pitch...
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#387 - 2013-09-07 13:24:05 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
As per lore, that's exactly what was done in the earlier stages of capsule technology, before clones existed. It was quite risky, though.


I suppose this "mind transfer" process will only work if there is a receiving clone to where the dying person's mind gets sent to. And the only way that you'll be able to turn someone into a capsuleer without making that person lose his/her consciousness and identity (die permanently) is by implanting the devices on the subject before he dies the first time. Or else the new capsuleer would just be a mindless meatbag.


The burn scanner is a external device, it scans the brain in a very agressive manner that would kill it anyway, so first they kill the brain and take a snapshot right before it dies.

The exact process is that upon hull breach, a neurotoxin is delivered into the brain to "stop" it (kill it), and right then the burn scanner fries it and takes a snapshot of its last functional state. The snapshot is then delivered to a waiting clone, which is reanimated after the brain pattern is engraved on it.

So all in all, transfering to a clone is not the same as becoming a capsuleer. For practical reasons, would be simpler to build a clone around the capsuleer implants and then burn the original brain in controlled conditions and transfer it to the implanted clone, but implanting the original body and don't clone it until it is podded would also be feasible, just more dangerous because of the surgery.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#388 - 2013-09-07 14:10:40 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:


The burn scanner is a external device, it scans the brain in a very agressive manner that would kill it anyway, so first they kill the brain and take a snapshot right before it dies.

The exact process is that upon hull breach, a neurotoxin is delivered into the brain to "stop" it (kill it), and right then the burn scanner fries it and takes a snapshot of its last functional state. The snapshot is then delivered to a waiting clone, which is reanimated after the brain pattern is engraved on it.

So all in all, transfering to a clone is not the same as becoming a capsuleer. For practical reasons, would be simpler to build a clone around the capsuleer implants and then burn the original brain in controlled conditions and transfer it to the implanted clone, but implanting the original body and don't clone it until it is podded would also be feasible, just more dangerous because of the surgery.


Ok I see what you're saying. I didnt read about this burn scanner device before or the brain killing procedure, but to me it looks like a mind copy and not a mind transfer for this reason: to have conscience continuity, the physical means that give origin to it must prevail. If the brain is killed, the consciousness would need to be "sent" instantaneously to a new one. If you are creating an image of it and implanting it in a new brain, it's a copy, not a transfer. Continuity is lost and the first subject's mind is dead. This will even open the possibility that you can give life to various cloned subjects, if its a mind copy and not a transfer, you can recreate as many as you want in new bodies. Maybe I need to read some of the lore and try to understand better what's the deal in it, if there is mind copy or transfer in the capsuleers.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#389 - 2013-09-08 11:14:12 UTC
Alpheias wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
oh yeah? would you like a fine SC gameplay video to go with it? well here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzcelfmiRMg enjoy Lol


I really do hope you, and everyone else, who are passionate fans of Star Citizen get exactly what is mentioned about in that video. I really do.


Yes, I like especially the parts where the guy refers to the "biggest crowdfunded game ever" and "not resorting to any game publishers because they want to make the game their way".
Fala-Berit
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#390 - 2013-09-08 11:22:19 UTC
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#391 - 2013-09-08 11:35:33 UTC
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Promises bought by Players as well.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#392 - 2013-09-08 12:11:07 UTC
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.
Tanesha Kring
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#393 - 2013-09-08 14:43:35 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.


Sort of. The battle arena Alpha will be released. Then it's a planet side social module, then the Squadron 42 Alpha, then the Star Citizen multiplayer Alpha. People keep saying that it's supposed to be released in 2014, but from what I've read the Star Citizen multiplayer will be going Beta late 2014 and the full game will be released in early 2015. However there's nothing set in stone.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#394 - 2013-09-08 14:52:07 UTC
Tanesha Kring wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.


Sort of. The battle arena Alpha will be released. Then it's a planet side social module, then the Squadron 42 Alpha, then the Star Citizen multiplayer Alpha. People keep saying that it's supposed to be released in 2014, but from what I've read the Star Citizen multiplayer will be going Beta late 2014 and the full game will be released in early 2015. However there's nothing set in stone.


Additional features = additional development time, nothing surprising. And then, of course, games that launch within the initial schedule are kind of uncommon.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Tanesha Kring
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#395 - 2013-09-08 15:04:15 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Tanesha Kring wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.


Sort of. The battle arena Alpha will be released. Then it's a planet side social module, then the Squadron 42 Alpha, then the Star Citizen multiplayer Alpha. People keep saying that it's supposed to be released in 2014, but from what I've read the Star Citizen multiplayer will be going Beta late 2014 and the full game will be released in early 2015. However there's nothing set in stone.


Additional features = additional development time, nothing surprising. And then, of course, games that launch within the initial schedule are kind of uncommon.


True. I don't know if I would consider it additional features being added as much as having an outline for the features desired broke down into tiers for crowdsource funding.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#396 - 2013-09-08 15:31:47 UTC
Tanesha Kring wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Tanesha Kring wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.


Sort of. The battle arena Alpha will be released. Then it's a planet side social module, then the Squadron 42 Alpha, then the Star Citizen multiplayer Alpha. People keep saying that it's supposed to be released in 2014, but from what I've read the Star Citizen multiplayer will be going Beta late 2014 and the full game will be released in early 2015. However there's nothing set in stone.


Additional features = additional development time, nothing surprising. And then, of course, games that launch within the initial schedule are kind of uncommon.


True. I don't know if I would consider it additional features being added as much as having an outline for the features desired broke down into tiers for crowdsource funding.


Well, a fourth city port on Earth certainly is an additional feature. As is a new ship class (Corvette). That's additional dev+QA time. Blink

More stuff = more dev & QA time even if it was acounted for in the initial development plan.

In a way, I am glad that the extra stretch goals aren't that much "heavy" because they could easily mean a later relaase date even if everything went OK (but then, complexity is a beech, as CCP might be able to confirm).

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#397 - 2013-09-08 15:50:43 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
again on the subject of EVE's mind transfer, which I think is such an awesome element and one of the trumps CCP should really bet on regarding gameplay development:

raven666wings wrote:

I also don't agree with the view that people would need to die once to become an immortal capsuleer with the use of mind transfer to new clones. The way this fictional mind transfer is supposed to work, as we've seen in a recent Dust514 trailer, is with these implants grafted to the person's brain, which will somehow transfer the consciouness of the person through space into her/his new clone. So this means that these implants could probably be surgically installed in the aspiring capsuleer and transfer his/her mind to a new clone at the very first death, saving his/her consciouness and identity.


The Dust514 trailer I talked about before http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIwekfp3p5Q

at 1:00 - "The implant recovered by the extraction team has fascinating properties, it hints to transfer of counsciousness, even at the moment of death"

also this one about the Templar Prototype Implant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7l7_0ruwxs&list=SPFC7B99173F4DC31F&index=14

I was convinced that these were implanted on the capsuleers and the mercs and that they would retain consciousness at the very first death by getting their minds transferred to the clones. But after looking at them again they don't seem like the kind of device that could be implanted in a living person's brain without destroying it, probably only possible to build from scratch in a clone. And regarding capsuleers, if the only way they get their minds transferred (read copied) is by the burn scan and killing procedure, then probably Rui and Ish were right and I was wrong, meaning that an aspiring capsuleer or merc would need to die before becoming one.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#398 - 2013-09-08 15:52:36 UTC  |  Edited by: digitalwanderer
Main point is that if you're primariy a PVP player in eve that likes to fly different ships in combat, and fit them anyway you want within their technical limits as some ships in star citizen have up to 20 upgrade slots for weapons, power, engines, thrusters, and do it in a first person view with real physics and using the most Advanced graphics engine with VR glass support and joystick support, you'll get a better experience in SC than in eve.



For the people above, all other features in eve are pointless addons that doesn't add to their gaming experience.
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#399 - 2013-09-08 18:01:26 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
Alpheias wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
oh yeah? would you like a fine SC gameplay video to go with it? well here you go http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzcelfmiRMg enjoy Lol


I really do hope you, and everyone else, who are passionate fans of Star Citizen get exactly what is mentioned about in that video. I really do.


Yes, I like especially the parts where the guy refers to the "biggest crowdfunded game ever" and "not resorting to any game publishers because they want to make the game their way".


Fair enough. Still, in my mind, publishers are a necessary evil in many ways.

Prevent game designers from building air castles while burning money on nothing is one.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
#400 - 2013-09-08 19:30:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Tollen Gallen
Tanesha Kring wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
Fala-Berit wrote:
Star Citizen

Player Funded Beta?


Before the beta comes the alpha, which is set to happen sometime in December.


Sort of. The battle arena Alpha will be released. Then it's a planet side social module, then the Squadron 42 Alpha, then the Star Citizen multiplayer Alpha. People keep saying that it's supposed to be released in 2014, but from what I've read the Star Citizen multiplayer will be going Beta late 2014 and the full game will be released in early 2015. However there's nothing set in stone.


Wait..Wot!

Shocked .... Future Players have promised to pay money after a certain stage... or they have handed over cash already?


Nevermind, it does'nt matter it will either do well or fail... if its still going in 2 years i dare say i'll give it a try.

I remember a time when games were released after beta with just a few annoying bugs, these days its now beta with patches and bug fixes rushed out before the player base runs for the hills....

I feel old, and cynical, and this just makes me Grumpy.
Alpha lol.....

Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!