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Keep "Unknown"

It makes finding wormholes much cooler. Though I guess by now technology will have advanced to recognize a trillion ISK industry

As many already stated i DISLIKE the "never lose your probes" and "removed DSP's". You are removing consequences and an aditional layer of gameplay (knowing how to use DSPs, and training for them as advanced probing).

It's like only PvEers did this changes and NO PvPer looked at this stuff....(pointing at the CSM....). I can't beleive you didn't see these problems during developement.

If you want to help noobs give them a set of "basic probes" you never lose, but not regular stuff. Since when is this an accepted mechanic in EvE to NOT lose anything? How about we apply this to drones, ammunition, containers....

And who ever agreed to remove DSPs? They are a perfect game-mechanic. You use them for scanning a system (pve and pvp), but they are not made for pinpointing. They need advanced skills to use and thus are "the next level" for probers.

I'm all for "make it a entry level profession", but that does not imply removing advanced gameplay.

The skill changes + scanning modules + default probing layout makes is easier for a new player to learn how to probe.
I would say that this qualifies for a lower barrier.

For specific other things i still want to use my other probe layout.

AbsoluteHavoc, Mara Rinn's post was 102% sarcasm.

Here are a couple of points that have not been adrressed in either the SISI feedback threads nor the dev blog, and about which I am worried about:

1) Scanning modules.

They seem to be rather overpowered, compared to the current mechanics, despite the introduction of the stacking penalty. While you took care of the acquisition module by allowing only one, we still have pinpointing modules that when stacked can allow to find almost any site/ship in two scan cycles, and rangefinding modules that when stacked allow to find "unscannable" ships without need of virtue implants. Both situations imply a rather severe change in the gameplay. Reading the dev blog it seems that those changes have been overlooked, since they have not been addressed at all by a single dev. Any comments?

I also question the choice of making them passive modules. It stands to reason that if you really want to introduce such powerful modules they should at least be used only when you are uncloaked, thus adding an element of risk to the reward they give.

Finally, the fact that those modules are all for midslots probably means that anathema and cheetah are going to become almost useless. Do you plan to rebalance those two ships?


2) Lack of customizable formations.

While I don't mind the introduction of noob probe formations, what I really don't understand is why there is no way to save your own formations, and what is worse, why do you make even harder than it was before to deploy your own formations. There is really no reason to punish advanced explorers like that. I read that you have some vague plans to introduce it, but I urge you to put this very high in your priority list.


Additional observation

Honestly, the autorecovery of probes seems a real dumb-down of the game without any reason to exist, and is affecting lots of emerging gameplay. Seriously, why? For anything else, you have explained your reasons, and while I could not agree with all of them I can at least understand. But this? There is no sesnsible reason that I could see to kill gameplay that is already existing... At least allow to turn off the safeties.

Overall Impression

My general impressaion of this expansion is that while the vision is there, the design phase has been severely hurried, since so many changes have not been thought out as much as they could.

My 0.02 ISK:

Was the pre-Odyssey scanning system un-intuitive? Yes.
Was it broken? No it was not.

The system works, all the framework needed was already there, it just needed improvement and optimization.
Not a complete simplifying rebuild.

It was a solid mechanic that operated in a realistic and variable way.
The new changes feel very gimmicky and arcade-like.

On top of rebuilding most of the scanning interface as it is now, you are straight up denying the people who pay for this game emergent gameplay, which is the point of the entire game. It is literally taking the point out of eve.

Not literally as in destroying the game as a whole, but it blatantly contradicts the player driven nature of the game.

From the devblog:



This is what CCP is doing to EvE in the last years in a nutshell.

They could improve the game, they could add new content and even "newbie friendly content" (no, torturing new players with level 1 no reward missions is not "newbie friendly").

But no, the chosen path is to dumb EvE down to WoWtard levels.

When are we going to see EvE for Facebook, some now Korean owned cheap and boring title once owned by an Icelandic company?

"Ah, yes, but we tripled our revenue!". Ah, sure, so you just switched from the 10 years+ steady growth model to the crappy, basic MMO "big flash for 2 years then slowly die model".


Yes EvE was thematically strong.

One day they'll change "EvE" name to "E" because typing the whole name was too hard.



Awaiting for the promising time when the shiny new launcher will embed a Facebook page with the whole EvE (now reduced to a 20 lines script) fumbling inside.

my 2c:
- new modules: well... neutral on this one, I am slightly worried it will make probing difficult sigs too easy, therefore devaluating training of probing skills, but it might be fine. It gives us option of heavily specializing ship for probing what is both good and bad - good because extra options are good, bad because it gives even more incentive for using dedicated scanning alts and devalues all-in one ships (such as exploration tech 3s); while EVE is about more ships > all-in-one ship, I am not sure that "moar alts" is good approach to things

- skill changes: neutral on this one; slightly worried that training these skills to V will be even more pointless howeever - they take forever to train, so some use of them might be nice, currently they are just pointless time sing and will be even more pointless after expansion

- auto-launch and formations: don't like: sure, it is tedious to deploy them one by one, but it has its uses - do I want them out fast and cloak asap? Then I launch 4 or 5; do I want more scanning strength? I launch 7 or 8. Also it makes catching scanning ships even more difficult (not good); I get it that idea was to make scanning easier, but it was never hard in the first place. Simplifying it makes it more and more redundant mechanic, and these simplifications make probing borderline unneeded mechanic. Imo if anything, it should be made more difficult and tricky (though not necessary tedious):
- for example: you have random spots in system that screw with probes. You have special probes that discover these and special probes that can nullify them if you put them right on top. Alternatively, you can just compensate for it yourself by checking signatures, phantom signatures and similar.

- dsp removal: neutral:
if removal is due to dps not working as intended and therefore bordered as 'exploit', I support removal; I can understand devs don't want us to judge all sigs in system with one scan; however if it is made to simplify probing and make it 'more accessible', then I am heavily against it - while not perfect, mechanic has its place, has its use and is far from being mandatory - I just recently started using them and while really good in wh space, they are not nearly as game-breaking as some people claim - sure they make your life easier if you have 20 sigs in system, but if you have few (and know you will have few sigs only), I am better off just launching normal probes to save time

- auto return probes: big don't like:
- what if I want to leave combat probes in 'hostile' wh to annoy people who dwell inside and let them wonder if I sit cloaked and scan? It is perfectly good tactical option and this change is removing it.
- losing probes is annoying, but it is more complicated thing then just pushing 'return probes' - what if I come under attack at wh with my probes out? Will I sit there and get pounded before they return or jump through? What if I don't have reserve probes and therefore risk getting stranded in wh space? Also don't count on everyone remembering to return his probes when **** hits the fan; getting stranded in wh space should be real risk and this significantly reduces it

Final notes:
- more convenient is not necessary good: look at what WoW has become; put too much 'quality of life' improvements and you go to point where you break basic concepts of the game. While EVE is still holding its own against this effect, I am starting to smell changes in that direction - not good.
- simplifying EVE won't attract new players just as simplifying scanning won't attract more people to low-sec, 0.0 and wh exploration

It's called "Goonification", that is the act of catering only to zergs and blobs, screw everybody else.

Sorry, not hugely impressed.

It appears you have spendt a lot of resources on reinventing the wheel and have come up with a lesser product than the origional. I do not understand who could authorize you to spend so much effort on a system that was already working fine before, while we have systems like PI who could seriously have needed the attention instead.

It also appears you have aimed this new design towards people who do not play Eve (yet). Why do you people never learn that attempting to bring in new customers is wasted if you alienate your existing customers in the process?