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[Odyssey Feedback Request] Team Super Friends - Probe Scanning and You

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Absolon Echerie
Roving Guns Inc.
Pandemic Legion
#1261 - 2013-05-21 08:14:27 UTC
So use faction cruisers if they still fit.. a gila can do a very fast as well.

i am happy i moved to null
Mr Dynamic
Isk Ready
#1262 - 2013-05-21 10:15:29 UTC
MY PERFECT PROBE ALT HAS WASTED SP

nobody will have isk ready. fu sisipee

every other bid in this thread is an alt of mine, pick the cheapest one and I'll pay that much. 
Lokitoki81
SniggWaffe
WAFFLES.
#1263 - 2013-05-21 10:54:54 UTC
I hear winter expansion is called "World of EVEcraft", or was it "Mists of New Eden".

PATCH NOTES.

1) New 1-click function will launch your probes, get the target pinpointed, warp to target, point target and ping your IRC channel of choice. (You will also be able to configure your ship to automatically make a fleet, autoinvite and light a cyno for you)

2) New feature will make suggestions on what target to shoot based on your and the target ships velocity, transversial, range and many other factors. You can also configure your ship to auto-attack when these factors are optimal for an attack.

3) CAP (Combat Auto Pilot). This feature will navigate your precious ship through the fears of battle, minimizing your incoming damage. Only one-click and you will be as safe as mathematics allow. Can also be configured to warp out if you risk losing your ship to a premade safespot made by CAP at an earlier stage.


STOP DUMBING DOWN EVE!!!

1) We dont want it to be easy
2) We dont want it to be wow-friendly
3) We dont want everything automatic
4) We dont want ALL players to be able to do ALL things

These changes to probing are horrible, there was NO NEED TO CHANGE it.
And who came up with the idea of always launching 7 probes at first? Does he even play the game?
Launching probes in fixed formations? Are you serious? It got to be a troll.
Probes magically gets back to your ship on system change? Orly?

Everything that took some sort of skill with probing is now gone.

Having to launch probes 1 by 1 and put them in formation under pressure was a big part
of pvp probing and a good prober was the diffrence between a really nice fight and failure.
Sylvia Nardieu
Super Serious Fight Club
#1264 - 2013-05-21 11:30:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Sylvia Nardieu
Lokitoki81 wrote:
Launching probes in fixed formations?
...
Everything that took some sort of skill with probing is now gone.
...
Having to launch probes 1 by 1 and put them in formation under pressure was a big part
of pvp probing and a good prober was the diffrence between a really nice fight and failure.


Out of all bad design choices they made, you are complaining about probably the only one remotely resembling what people were asking for (ability to launch more probes then one and having formations) and which - with a bit of tweaking, could be useful. The implementation is flawed atm, but please, don't tell me that you consider clicking eight times and distributing probes in whatever your favourite pattern is to be a skill.
Galphii
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1265 - 2013-05-21 11:41:13 UTC
I'd like to see another button next to the 'launch pinpoint formation' button.

For starters, 4au is hardly 'pinpoint'. The extra button to be added would be a 1au spread and would gain this esteemed title, while the 4au button would be called something along the lines of 'broad formation'. This would minimise the tedious repositioning of 7+ probes as you move below 4au to do actual pinpointing Smile Otherwise the system looks pretty good.

"Wow, that internet argument completely changed my fundamental belief system," said no one, ever.
Rob Crowley
State War Academy
#1266 - 2013-05-21 11:43:50 UTC
The new coloured bar for scan results looks nice, but the font is too big so I can't see what type of site I scanned without making the scanner window rediculously wide. I couldn't find a way to resize single columns of the results.

On a related note you used to be able to see the name/type of a site when you moved your cursor over the green icon on system map once the site was scanned to 100%. This doesn't work anymore, the name (or any rightclick options) only appears on system map now after you chose some action on the site from the scanner window, like warping to it. I'd like to see the site type on the map again before I choose an action.
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#1267 - 2013-05-21 11:44:05 UTC
Sylvia Nardieu wrote:

The implementation is flawed atm, but please, don't tell me that you consider clicking eight times and distributing probes in whatever your favourite pattern is to be a skill.


Having to click 8 times yes I agree. Distributing probes however is really the only thing that resembles a challenge in regards to probing. Its the only thing that players can be unique in and improve upon. So unless they redo the entire concept of probing, adding in preset formations only dumbs the current system down almost to a state of pointlessness.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden
Sylvia Nardieu
Super Serious Fight Club
#1268 - 2013-05-21 11:44:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Sylvia Nardieu
I would like to see 2-3 slots for saving custom formations consisting of whichever number of probes one finds to be adequate to his/her needs and then - when clicking those formations, I'd like probes to launch instantly. That's pretty much it for tweaks needed.
Although revamped system of resizing and moving probes annoyed me initially, I now find it to be quite good, so no changes needed there.
Sylvia Nardieu
Super Serious Fight Club
#1269 - 2013-05-21 11:57:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Sylvia Nardieu
Brooks Puuntai wrote:

Having to click 8 times yes I agree. Distributing probes however is really the only thing that resembles a challenge in regards to probing. Its the only thing that players can be unique in and improve upon. So unless they redo the entire concept of probing, adding in preset formations only dumbs the current system down almost to a state of pointlessness.


Well, ye all veteran players will be crying about dumbing down the game due to preset patterns, but let's be realistic here for a second - wouldn't most people have one of those diamond shaped patterns saved anyway if we were provided ability to make custom patterns. I mean, yes it makes things easier for newbies but its far from rocket science. The problem is not the availibilty of preset patterns, problem is the fact that someone had the bright idea that we need 7 probes and 7 probes only, thus reducing options in probing immensly.

For me the beauty of probing is mainly in combat department - combining d-scan and probing to get a warp-in on people without them ever seeing your probes out in the first place. As for pve and navigation purposes, everyone will have their preferences (dobule squares, cubes, what not) and that's why I think that ability to have custom patterns + to launch whatever number of probes you want should be returned (the latter will happen from what I understood).
Otto Jaeger
Black.Hole.Sun
#1270 - 2013-05-21 16:36:02 UTC
Lokitoki81 wrote:
I hear winter expansion is called "World of EVEcraft", or was it "Mists of New Eden".

PATCH NOTES.

STOP DUMBING DOWN EVE!!!

1) We dont want it to be easy
2) We dont want it to be wow-friendly
3) We dont want everything automatic
4) We dont want ALL players to be able to do ALL things

These changes to probing are horrible, there was NO NEED TO CHANGE it.
Probes magically gets back to your ship on system change? Orly?

Everything that took some sort of skill with probing is now gone.

Having to launch probes 1 by 1 and put them in formation under pressure was a big part
of pvp probing and a good prober was the diffrence between a really nice fight and failure.


Agreed.
Was it really nesessary in order to "open" exploration to masses to make it so f*cking easy? Actually probing down things can be done all in one click - why not do it that way?

right now, when I tryed scanning, i had to fiddle a bit with scanning range of the probes not moving the porbes at all to find the site. 32 AU -> 8AU -> 4AU -> 1AU. And my skills aren't that good!!! In this case i owuld rather have "Probe it all in 5s" button because this non challenging task looks pretty stupid thing to do. Whatever it is it's not that exciting Exploring CCP promised us. It's half done piece of crap.

Also why do you need to change the names of sites. Whats wrong with those fancy names like Magnetometric, Gravimtetric.. what so exciting and "cool" about radar site, ore site... ?

On EVE i like that fact that you can be good at somehting as player. In PvP, Trade, Grinding missions, Scanning,... regardless your character skills (as long as you have the minimum requirements). By simplifying the scanning so it's open to masses - you took all the challange from it. What is there now is just mechanical scaling down the probes range. And quite frankly, as launching 7 probes in predefined formation, this could be done by computer too.

So far, what i do like about new exploration: New scannign UI, Jump effects (stargate jumps, wormole wanna-be-jump-effect sucks.)

That's about it. I have this strong feeling that Odyssey is half done expansion at best. With the todays Launcher deployment fiasco I'm getting this feeling, that CCP is slowly pooping big piece of .... on player base in order to attrect new playes bored with theme park MMOs... Also that expansions are done like exams on university - in hurry and with the "lets see how it ends" approach.

I really hope that feedback from players is so important as des say and not only to have some "alibi" while ignoring most of it.

I really really hope Odyssey, when it ocmes out, will be great as CCP promised.. but so far i DO have bad feeling about it.

Prove me wrong in it. At least in exploration, the main issue of the whole expansion.




Jack Ogeko
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1271 - 2013-05-21 19:17:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Ogeko
i think one dev wich play 30min per day, decide to leave jove space, and do something that normal ppl do, and on ded 4/10 t3 take from him lot from plex, and this is revange, it is awsome that people wich play 6h+ per day give feedback and devs do what they wish thats way or another, i think next expansion be great, in hi sec only level 1 curier missions, in low only level 2 curier at wh level 1 mining at low level 3 curier, anything else only in jove space

there are psychiatric hospitals more normal then this changes
Zeradn
Last Cartographers of Abyss
#1272 - 2013-05-21 21:05:27 UTC
Well, the changes do reduce the tedium of PvE probing. At the same time it also has the potential to change the balance of a PvP engagement. Especially with the probes automatically repositioning when you mouse-drag to resize the scan range, this has become frustratingly easy. Probing went from one end of the spectrum to the other end with just one expansion. Say good bye to high sec exploration. Every player and their 1-day alts will be running sites there from now on. Just pop in a scanning mod and rookie ships will be usable for scanning. But, overall, looking forward to the next expansion.

PS: Sadly, from what I have read here, it seems some people haven't realized that the probes also reposition themselves when you drag to adjust range. Most of those people, as I have seen from a youtube video linked to a blog, might be right clicking on the scanner window to change the probe range, in which case, the probes won't reposition themselves.
SFM Hobb3s
Perkone
Caldari State
#1273 - 2013-05-21 21:38:10 UTC
I think we should just stage a protest in Jita for all this. The probing, the t3 nerfing, the whole deal.

How about we all start trying to rep the broken statue in Jita as protest? I could think of no better use of the hundreds of pithum c-type medium shield transporters I have piled up. Twisted
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1274 - 2013-05-21 22:41:59 UTC
So there has been no official word on T3 getting banned form 3/10 & 4/10, does this mean CCP plans to change this regardless of what people have to say about it?

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1275 - 2013-05-21 22:43:54 UTC
Zeradn wrote:
Sadly, from what I have read here, it seems some people haven't realized that the probes also reposition themselves when you drag to adjust range. Most of those people, as I have seen from a youtube video linked to a blog, might be right clicking on the scanner window to change the probe range, in which case, the probes won't reposition themselves.


Which just shows that its broken, they should be linked at a fundamental level in the code.

Maybe if they had actually mapped out the all of the current details for reference before they started to rewrite everything they would not have designed this horse that looks more like a hippo the closer you look at it. Poor planning and releasing what is a first draft, not even alpha version on Sisi does not confidence in the development team give, its all shiny, shiny visuals and sod all underneath.

already dead, just haven´t fallen over yet....
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1276 - 2013-05-21 22:51:45 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So there has been no official word on T3 getting banned form 3/10 & 4/10, does this mean CCP plans to change this regardless of what people have to say about it?


If you need a Tengu to do a DED 3 or 4 site, you may want to purchase an " i win" button because that´s what you are using, no effort or thought required, leave them to cruiser and battle cruiser pilots with crap skills, that´s who they were designed for and with the new probe mechanic any month old will be able to find and run them.

already dead, just haven´t fallen over yet....
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1277 - 2013-05-21 23:01:59 UTC
Brainless Bimbo wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So there has been no official word on T3 getting banned form 3/10 & 4/10, does this mean CCP plans to change this regardless of what people have to say about it?


If you need a Tengu to do a DED 3 or 4 site, you may want to purchase an " i win" button because that´s what you are using, no effort or thought required, leave them to cruiser and battle cruiser pilots with crap skills, that´s who they were designed for and with the new probe mechanic any month old will be able to find and run them.


No, I like T3s so I can do, complexes (3/10 - 6/10) Data Sites, Relic sites, and WH. Now you are looking at 5/10 & 6/10 meaning finding a combat site that you can do is even rarer than it is now.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1278 - 2013-05-21 23:19:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Brainless Bimbo
Sylvia Nardieu wrote:
[.. but let's be realistic here for a second - wouldn't most people have one of those diamond shaped patterns saved anyway if we were provided ability to make custom patterns. I mean, yes it makes things easier for newbies but its far from rocket science. The problem is not the availibilty of preset patterns, problem is the fact that someone had the bright idea that we need 7 probes and 7 probes only, thus reducing options in probing immensly..


Realistically, i´ve never used so many probes to get a target, 7 or 8 is overkill and just shows lack of dimensional awareness and basic geometry.
Pre-set patterns are cookie cutter and do not really have a place in a sandbox, it screams hand holding and guidance (which should be confined to the rookie tutorials),. i know CCP will not listen to players as they have committed them selves to this shiny, shiny broken poorly developed new way (two teams not talking and working together on a basic common linked interface at the coding level screams trouble), but they can get it right in the next two weeks even if they have to recode some basics from scratch.

Single probe launch is a fundamental requirement in exploration, as i have said before, make Extended Launchers firing base be 1 combat Probe or a set of 8 Core Probes,a.k.a the Super Probe and up the Core Probes mass to 1.25 to bring consistency, its logical, PvP probing requires far more flexible approaches than find a PvE site.

already dead, just haven´t fallen over yet....
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1279 - 2013-05-21 23:22:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Brainless Bimbo
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Brainless Bimbo wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So there has been no official word on T3 getting banned form 3/10 & 4/10, does this mean CCP plans to change this regardless of what people have to say about it?


If you need a Tengu to do a DED 3 or 4 site, you may want to purchase an " i win" button because that´s what you are using, no effort or thought required, leave them to cruiser and battle cruiser pilots with crap skills, that´s who they were designed for and with the new probe mechanic any month old will be able to find and run them.


No, I like T3s so I can do, complexes (3/10 - 6/10) Data Sites, Relic sites, and WH. Now you are looking at 5/10 & 6/10 meaning finding a combat site that you can do is even rarer than it is now.


T2 variants work equally well, but you have to think sometimes on how to work the site, but you can fit every thing you need on them, but again that takes thought and game play.

already dead, just haven´t fallen over yet....
Tzu Wu
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1280 - 2013-05-21 23:40:29 UTC
Brainless Bimbo wrote:
Sylvia Nardieu wrote:
[.. but let's be realistic here for a second - wouldn't most people have one of those diamond shaped patterns saved anyway if we were provided ability to make custom patterns. I mean, yes it makes things easier for newbies but its far from rocket science. The problem is not the availibilty of preset patterns, problem is the fact that someone had the bright idea that we need 7 probes and 7 probes only, thus reducing options in probing immensly..


Realistically, i´ve never used so many probes to get a target, 7 or 8 is overkill and just shows lack of dimensional awareness and basic geometry.
Pre-set patterns are cookie cutter and do not really have a place in a sandbox, it screams hand holding and guidance (which should be confined to the rookie tutorials),. i know CCP will not listen to players as they have committed them selves to this shiny, shiny broken poorly developed new way (two teams not talking and working together on a basic common linked interface at the coding level screams trouble), but they can get it right in the next two weeks even if they have to recode some basics from scratch.

Single probe launch is a fundamental requirement in exploration, as i have said before, make Extended Launchers firing base be 1 combat Probe or a set of 8 Core Probes,a.k.a the Super Probe and up the Core Probes mass to 1.25 to bring consistency, its logical, PvP probing requires far more flexible approaches than find a PvE site.


So we are all supposed to be math geniuses like yourself? At the end of the day its a video game,not a job.I see so many people out here that are quick to say "You arent a pro if you dont use 4 probes".Well,if I want to use 7 thats my business.It's worked for me and honestly,why in the world do others care about how others play?