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I assume nothing. if you choose to stay in a hole after it had dried up, that is your choice.

It is a well known fact that a WHer can make far more isk than any other profession in the game. And that is as it should be, considering W-space also has the highest risk. 500M/hr is an accepted baseline with the WHers I know. I know WHers that claim to make far more than 500m/hr, but that is irrelevant to my point.

My post was about the damage changing grav sites over to anomalies will do, not about how much isk a WHer makes.

Mining in W-space after this change will make grav sites the highest risk, lowest reward of all W-Space activities. If you are mining in an anomaly you will have zero warning of a coming attacker unless you managed to catch them at the hole on there way in. A cloaky ship in your hole will be able to find the belt you are in, using the basic ship scanner and warp right to the site, while cloaked, no probes on D-scan, no ship on D-scan, as they are cloaked. Zero warning. D-scan will be useless.

Any ship capable of using a cov-ops cloak will be able to land on grid and tackle your mining ship before that mining ship can even think about warping off. In fact any cloaky ship will land on grid cloaked and not decloak until they are within tackle range. You will have zero chance of escaping any cloaky ship. You will not know they are there until they decloak and tackle you. Cloaked ships do not show up on D-scan only there probes do. Since they will no longer need probes to find the site you are mining in you will have no security. If you mine in W-space you will be a sitting duck for anyone that can get into your hole undetected.

Considering the most common roaming ship in W-space is a cloaky T3, this will be the most common scenario.

This is precisely what worries me.

Call me old fashioned, but I believe that (and others will without a doubt disagree with me) if you as a small group or as a solo miner (with maybe an alt or two) are taking the proper precautions when mining in w-space, whoever wants your pod should at least put a little effort into it.

Also, where's the fun in ganking miners (we have hisec suiganks for that) when you can hunt them down with probes, creep up to their barges, uncloak right off their bow and scram the sucker while the gunboats warp in.

And they never knew you were there to begin with.

Now I am no PvP war machine -I mostly get blown up- so I really don't have any say in the matter, but personally, I would at least want to work for my kills and, if on the receiving end, know that I am hopefully giving my pursuer more trouble than my sorry ass is worth.

Anywho! mining and industry in HS/LS/NS/WH has its own little quirks and what might work for one security region might not be the best option for the others. So please CCP, see how these coming solutions/features/changes affect the various corners of space before applying them to every part of the galaxy and beyond.

It's good to see that goonswarm is already getting a leg up on potential greifing, they're back attacking ice belts with high sec suicides. Gee, I wonder what they'll do when it's much easier to do?


That said, I find CCP declaring that they're not trying ot herd people out of high sec, they're just making high sec harder to make profitable so that people will go to low and null.


Doublespeak much?


I hate to point this out to those blindly worshiping mittens and/or accepting everything that CCP says as the truth, but as someone who's been around here long enough to know that CCP does not always think things through and tends to bend the truth just a tad when it suits them, I have to point out that, like everyone else who's done high sec scan sites will tell you, it's a god damn foot race when they appear and considering it talked on average 60-70 units of ice to power one small POS for one month, 2500 units is not a whole hell of a lot.

Funny, they've been saying it for years.

But based on recent demands from nullsec, they're not doing it fast enough. James 315 writes on themittani.com that highsec should be done away with to force players into low and null sec.

Should I ask if they'll be allowed to keep their ships, or do you want their pods delivered, pre warp scrammed and webbed, to your optimal range?

It never occurs to the writer that, perhaps the culture of null sec is what is driving players back to high sec, not the 'risk'.

Your really aren't an industrialist are you? While some like to destroy, others like to create.

ok i have a quistion

on this 80% of ice from high for eve does that count wh space as well im thinking the post said 80 of k space if thats the case that leaves a lot of wh corps high and dry and as a small corp i will have to pull up my pos and go to high and i dont like high sec also i live in a c1 high sec static the changes to mineing graves will force me to look else where when there is nothing else to do in the c1 did you guys think this all they way thure i look forward to the ansers ccp fozzi has to the quistions i have read all tho i give up at about page 19

After reading through most of this thread, it would appear that the proposed changes to mining are causing some friction.

Whilst I can fully understand the desire to make life difficult for bot miners, the proposed changes also make things more difficult for 'kosher' ice miners. To my mind, the bot miners got a huge boost by adding large ore holds to mining barges/exhumers.

If the intention of the proposed changes is to curtail bot mining, wouldn't it just be simpler to reduce the capacity of ore holds than making sweeping changes that affect the 'genuine' miners as well as the botters?

Also, I seem to remember reading that the new expansion was intended to make POS ownership a more pleasant experience. How can placing limitations on the availability of resources needed to fuel these POS's be reconciled with the intended more pleasant experience?

Maybe I'm misunderstanding or not seeing the big picture but I think if the availability of ice is restricted too much (or even concentrated in the hands of too few people), the consequences could make POS ownership/maintenance a more difficult prospect.

From another thread:



So, no. These changes have nothing to do with botting.

To make ice mining somewhat competitive and engaging but valuable, instead of leaving it as something utterly uncompetitive and nearly worthless to do that only requires a few mouse clicks and button presses every twenty minutes.

So, why didn't CCP put ice in grav sites and make it more challenging than the proposed change? That'd made it even more of a "challenging" profession and would not screw up WH miners.