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[Odyssey] Tech 1 Battleships - Gallente

First post
Author
Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#241 - 2013-04-08 19:21:00 UTC
Mithrantir Ob'lontra wrote:
Tell that to the Neutralizers that will land on you the second they target you.

It doesn't take 100 to kill your cap.


True, but this argument is applicable to any active tanked (non-ASB) ship. With dual cap boosters you can stay up against a fair number of neuts, but not an overwhelming amount.
Jureth22
State War Academy
Caldari State
#242 - 2013-04-08 19:21:09 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
First

Edit:How about the Dominix gains some extra drone bay to set apart for the Armageddon, as they have identical drone bandwidth and drone bay.


15% damage to drones for domi :D.that should settle it
Cambarus
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#243 - 2013-04-08 19:24:12 UTC
Jureth22 wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
First

Edit:How about the Dominix gains some extra drone bay to set apart for the Armageddon, as they have identical drone bandwidth and drone bay.


15% damage to drones for domi :D.that should settle it

Replace damage/hitpoint bonus with +1 drones/level, make it a REAL drone boat :)
Jureth22
State War Academy
Caldari State
#244 - 2013-04-08 19:26:09 UTC
Cambarus wrote:
Jureth22 wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
First

Edit:How about the Dominix gains some extra drone bay to set apart for the Armageddon, as they have identical drone bandwidth and drone bay.


15% damage to drones for domi :D.that should settle it

Replace damage/hitpoint bonus with +1 drones/level, make it a REAL drone boat :)


thats even ******* better.


NOTE : guys need to relax,this is a very earlier stage for new expansion,a lot of ships will need rebalance so these changes wont look bad compared to x and y.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#245 - 2013-04-08 19:28:16 UTC
Oh wow the changes to the Hype and the Mega make me glad I fly minmatar and Amarr. Those are going to be some useless lumps.
Mithrantir Ob'lontra
Ixion Defence Systems
#246 - 2013-04-08 19:28:46 UTC
Adriel Malakai wrote:
Mithrantir Ob'lontra wrote:
Tell that to the Neutralizers that will land on you the second they target you.

It doesn't take 100 to kill your cap.


True, but this argument is applicable to any active tanked (non-ASB) ship. With dual cap boosters you can stay up against a fair number of neuts, but not an overwhelming amount.

Great.
With 4 mid slots and the apparent need for a MJD and a secondary propulsion mod, adding 2 cap boosters really helps the Hyperion to do something at least equal to the other 3 tier 3 Battleships.

I think not.
And even if you don't use a MJD. You still are left with one (1) mid slot to fit what? A web? An eccm? A scrambler?

Somehow I can't rejoice trying to solve this dilemma.
Burseg Sardaukar
Sardaukar Merc Guild
General Tso's Alliance
#247 - 2013-04-08 19:29:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Burseg Sardaukar
Quote:
+1 drones/level, make it a REAL drone boat :)


This I'm fine with. Even if you have to drop turrets to balance it. They are unbonused anyway, so **** it.

Can't wait to dual box my Dust toon and EVE toon on the same machine!

TijsseN
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#248 - 2013-04-08 19:30:01 UTC  |  Edited by: TijsseN
My thoughts about the galente rebalancing:

The Dominix re - balance towards a dedicated drone boat makes it specialized as a mini carrier, but it is not as effective as for example the new Armageddon with its neut bonus. I would recommend to give it more dronebay than the Armageddon, to make the difference between Galente and Amarr consistent. (Galente more DPS / Drone capacity) vs Amarr (More tank / neut bonusses). From destroyer up to carrier (pick your style).

The Megathron can now be used as a large Talos in a shield gank configuration for dps, or a armor based support bs conifguration with a reduced damage output. Specfic fits for specfic roles will emerge, but the mega will likely become the swiss army knife of battleships instead of the current Dominix. (preferred weapon blasters)

The Hyperion needs some love, one good looking BS is never fielded, because CCP apparently does not want Galente to have an armor fleet battleship. It seems that the current version is mirroring the Maelstrom (long range rail fit), but details for fitting need to be worked out. Make it so it can have a buffer tank and large guns.
Edd Nicholls
Basgerin Pirate
#249 - 2013-04-08 19:31:26 UTC
I think these changes make Gallente have a pretty bad line-up. The Dominix is now clearly inferior to the proposed Armageddon. I never had issues with range or tracking of drones and it will lack drone control range to make much use of the range bonus to sentry drones. The Mega I guess will fill the hole left by the hype as a shield gank ship but I still think there is room for a buffer fit armour ship which the new look mega will not perform as well in. The hype is now pretty much good for nothing in my eyes. It will almost certainly underperform dual ASB Rohks and Mealstroms and offer pretty much no utility in its mids now to compensate. If you are going to persist with making it an active armour ship then at the minimum it needs more PG.
MaverickScot
Diminishing Returns.
#250 - 2013-04-08 19:33:38 UTC  |  Edited by: MaverickScot
Oh, and please return the Megathron hull back to the iconic shape that it one was. It looks like it was stood on then melted.
Gauro Charante
Vile Duck Pond
#251 - 2013-04-08 19:34:54 UTC
I think the armor reps should have another bonus than just repping part, like when active adds 10% armor hp or something. And Gallente boats Repping Bonus should be 10% effectivness, thus rep more and ad 15% armor hp at full skills. This would give Gallente boats large armor pool wich could be good even in fleets (just put a small rep for the armor bonus).
EndersChild
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#252 - 2013-04-08 19:35:55 UTC
Gallente Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% Large Hybrid Turret damage
+7.5% bonus to Remote Sensor Dampener effectiveness per level

Slot layout: 7H(-1), 5M, 7L(+1); 7 turrets(-1) , 0 launchers(-1)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 (+25) / 125 (+25)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 110km / 110 / 7

Drop the rep bonus. Give it a new clearly defined role like with the proposed changes to the Armageddon
Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance
#253 - 2013-04-08 19:36:55 UTC
Keep the Dominix bonuses as they are. There is room to play with a pure drone boat in the form of the Navy Issue Dominix. I think everyone is happy with the Vexor and excited by the prospect of the Navy Issue Vexor....

The Armageddon is also too strong by comparison. I'd move a high slot on it somewhere else and limit the dronebay to 250m^3.
Rysis Vyvorant
Wormbro
The Society For Unethical Treatment Of Sleepers
#254 - 2013-04-08 19:37:13 UTC
Burseg Sardaukar wrote:
Quote:
+1 drones/level, make it a REAL drone boat :)


This I'm fine with. Even if you have to drop turrets to balance it. They are unbonused anyway, so **** it.


Pretty much. I see no point in the ship for PvE.. It has basically gained a bonus that adds nothing to the ship at the cost of losing turret dps.

CCP Rise. For PvE whare are the mid and high slots suppose to be?

4 x drone links + ??
1 x omni/1 x sensor booster (I can make do with 1) + 3 x ???

Lows remain the same as usual.

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#255 - 2013-04-08 19:37:27 UTC
Mithrantir Ob'lontra wrote:
Great.
With 4 mid slots and the apparent need for a MJD and a secondary propulsion mod, adding 2 cap boosters really helps the Hyperion to do something at least equal to the other 3 tier 3 Battleships.

I think not.
And even if you don't use a MJD. You still are left with one (1) mid slot to fit what? A web? An eccm? A scrambler?

Somehow I can't rejoice trying to solve this dilemma.


If you read my first post in this thread, you'll see that it is my opinion that the Hyp absolutely needs 5 mids to be effective. Though I much rather run dual cap, scram + web, and either MWD or MJD, rather than dual proping it. The web is just far too valuable to the ship's ability to actually apply its damage to remove.

My point in my previous several posts is that many of the comments in this thread are complaining about how terrible active rep bonuses are. While they are not helpful in large fleets, they can be very effective if used right in solo/small gang fights.
Alice Katsuko
Perkone
Caldari State
#256 - 2013-04-08 19:38:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Alice Katsuko
I'm somewhat ambivalent about the changes to the Dominix, in light of the Armageddon's new role as a neut/drone platform. The new Armageddon renders the neut Dominix functionally obsolete, and heavily infringes on the Dominix's traditional role as a versatile drone boat. The tracking bonus will help the Dominix apply dps, but won't really offset the lost turret damage for gank fits. It seems as though for the Armageddon will most likely replace the Dominix in PvP for most purposes, since it will be a more effective neut platform, and an equally effective gank platform.

I'm also not sure why you think sentry drones need a buff. Sentry drones are often used for PvP by dedicated drone boats and are better in PvE than either heavy drones or fighters. Heavy drones deal marginally higher paper damage, but even with drone navigation computers apply less damage in practice beyond 20km from the ship due to slow flight time, and die very quickly if primaried by anything. Fighters are outclassed by sentry drones because any carrier with drone damage amplifiers now deals more damage with sentries than even a max-skilled Thanatos does with fighters beyond 20km from the ship, and don't have the tank to handle much aggression. For all purposes, the drone damage amplifier has made the Thanatos functionally obsolete, but that is a matter for a different thread.

It also seems as though you are trying to make local tanking viable in fleets. Don't. Unless you add stacking penalties for damage and remote repair, local tanking will never be viable in any engagement involving more than five or so pilots.
Saul Hyperion
Palmetto Galactic
#257 - 2013-04-08 19:40:40 UTC
The other 3 races are very solid throughout, but a near complete swing and miss on Gallente.

The Hyperion completely whiffs. While it desperately needed a low, it did not need one at the expense of a mid. It is completely outclassed on the fleet front by the Rokh and Abaddon due to their resists bonuses, and outclassed by the Maelstrom due to the weapon system. Active armor tanking is still terrible, despite efforts to fix it. I bit my tongue on the BC changes with the promise of the AAR, but now that it's live I am disappointed in armor tanking once again. So I will say I am firmly opposed to active armor tanking bonuses on all hulls until it something DRASTIC changes with it.

At the very least, the Hyperion needs more hitpoints in armor to make up for this wasted bonus. It could also use some sort of range bonus to hybrids, either falloff or optimal, to give it some sort of direction. It's current bonus doesn't lend itself towards blasters or rails particularly well. A good falloff bonus would make it a beast with Null, a good optimal bonus would make it a rail platform. I'd lean towards the falloff because of the precedent of Gallente being a blaster platform and the fact that it's a travesty that the Rokh does blasters better than the current or proposed Hyperion.

The Megathron simultaneously addresses problems and creates problems. The Mega always needed a midslot to come into it's own, but it does not need one at the expense of a lowslot. Yet somehow the utility high slot still exists, despite being one of the least used slots in this game.

Drop the utility high, restore the low and the Megathron is heading down the right track.

As others have said in this post, the new Dominix bonus is pretty awesome, but it kills the utility that the Dominix currently has. I can live with this as split weapons are bad and hopefully drones get changed in the near future to fix their flaws. I maintain that drones are still to vulnerable to being killed/smartbombed and need a better HP bonus on all blaster ships.

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#258 - 2013-04-08 19:43:47 UTC
Saul Hyperion wrote:

Drop the utility high, restore the low and the Megathron is heading down the right track.


But I love the neut on my mega Cry
Nemesis Factor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#259 - 2013-04-08 19:45:27 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:

Dominix:
Gallente Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+10% Drone Damage and Drone hitpoints
+10% Drone optimal range and Drone tracking speed (replaces large hybrid turret damage)


Can I get that second bonus on the Rattlesnake I JUST upgraded to? You monsters.

It's funny because Rattler just BARELY won out to Navy Domi because I liked the new missile effects and hate the Domi ship model. Redesign it and I will consider forgiving you.
Saul Hyperion
Palmetto Galactic
#260 - 2013-04-08 19:47:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Saul Hyperion
Adriel Malakai wrote:
Saul Hyperion wrote:

Drop the utility high, restore the low and the Megathron is heading down the right track.


But I love the neut on my mega Cry


I hate it. Need fitting (and cap, especially with this new RoF bonus) for other things Blink