Player Features and Ideas Discussion

--> The fact that a Naga can out damage a rokh is hilarious and the rokh is just sitting sadly in the deep dark corners of a station hangar.

While it is true that Rokh dps is kinda crappy, I wouldn't agree it sucks - it is designed to be fleet ship and it works good as one - what is lacks in dps, it makes up for with massive buffer and resistance bonuses that make it even tougher in logistics heavy environment (for example large scale fleet combat). While naga might be better dps wise and in small gangs, rokhs should perform better in large fleets simple due to their ability to outlast incoming damage much better.

It is raven that bugs me however - torp fitted, it is direct competition to blaster naga or talos and cruise fitted it is direct competition to rokh or other long range battleships; and imo it fails miserably in both situations - vs blaster naga, it produces similar dps (with much worse damage application and similar range) while fielding similar tank and much worse mobility while vs rokh or other long ranged bs, it does project ok dps at massive range (after cruise buff), but its damage application is still kinda poor (especially with furies and it needs them for decent damage) and its tank is severely lacking vs fleet battleships

You don't fly Caldari ships do you? The Raven has always had a crap-tank. This is further pronounced when you throw the terrible damage application of missiles in too. The unacceptably poor tank-gank characteristics of the Raven resulted in its glaring lack of use in PvP.

As to your comparison, I would hope that the BS had a larger tank than a 'glass-cannon' ship like the Naga. The issue that we are talking about is damage application. The Raven's cruise and torps do not apply damage nearly as efficiently under any realistic situation. Even with a buff to the base damage of cruise missiles, the damage application is still crap.

Remember missiles are affected by both the velocity and sig radius of the target in ratio with the missile's explosion velocity and radius. These two factors inherently put missiles on a sub-par ground compared to turrets. Either a high enough speed or a small enough sig and missile applied damage is negligible.

The naga doesn't have these issues. Hybrids have instant damage application. If it hits the damage applied will always be full-damage for the turrets that hit. Turrets only have to worry about their range and tracking. Missiles for comparison have to worry about range, target speed, target signature size and delayed alpha. Doesn't look very even now does it?

The Raven needs bonuses or a role bonus that enhances damage application. Which would set it apart and give it a niche role over the Typhoon.

The rohk really needs an increase in damage, its already taking a tank loss because CCP got this crazy idea to do a wide spread ridiculous tank nerf and a few of the ships it will affect are already not worth flying.

Hmm so many pages of comments and concerns, yet no CCP response.

Pretty disturbing that the people who play the game most and constantly use these ships and weapons on a daily basis are not being responded too about their concerns.

I see people on the other topics concerning battleships are generally happy with the changes of their non broken ships, yet almost no one here is.

Wonder when these insufficient changes go through, how long will it take for them to go back over and and fix the real problems and not band aid them to calling it a job well done. More thank likely years again.

Looks like Caldari pilots will be using the Phoon to get their missile drug fix.

Glad to see ccp stick to the old style keeping caldari battleships useless for pvp,thou the rokh nerf is so awesome ,but it seems too little to make the ship useless, you can do it better Fozzie. It has too much pg for a caldari boat what about -1500 base pg?

I doubt any devs are still reading these (especially the Caldari thread) but might as well post something to at least vent a little.

Scorpion: Terrible. Ok so we can armor tank it now with an extra low slot. Do we really need a BS-sized ECM boat? With the increased mineral cost I don't see the Scorp getting used. Instead turn the Scorpion into a missile based combat BS with a resistance bonus and missile bonus (not range!). Will need balanced with the SNI in mind.

Raven: Clearly an inferior hull to the Typhoon. The adjustments to tank and mobility don't seem sufficient. And no CCP response to any of the concerns. Awesome. A couple things can be done: add a launcher hard point or change the range bonus to a damage bonus. Again needs to be balanced with the CNR in mind (the SNI and CNR could either be changed now or left for a later pass).

Rokh: Not sure. The 1% might make a big difference or suck hard. My biggest issue with the Rokh is that it isn't 150m better than the Naga. Which leads to...

ABCs: An utter failure of balance. Couple things can be done: remove two turrets or remove their ability to fit large turrets and boost other stats appropriately.

I dunno. People may hate these ideas. Those that love the Scorpion or ABCs in their current state or even love the fact that you can make a sandwich before the first cruise missile volley hits your target at max range when using a Raven.

But this statement bothered me:
'I've been watching the other threads as well, there just doesn't seem to be as much to comment on in the others. I'll go do a lap through them now to make sure I haven't missed anything big.' -CCP Rise

The Caldari BS line arguably needed the most work with only the Rokh seemingly in any sort of balance with the other races. Yet the changes were weak and the dev communication the least of any of the threads.

People stopped posting and discussing anything because they knew no one was paying attention.

I started learning missile skills on my main in hopes caldari would get a well needed buff, but it seems i will be learning Winmatar BS to fly the phoon.

Cause I just wasted 2 months learning torps and cruise to t2

Least I can use bombers better now. Though I wish they would be able to use cruise missiles again. I rather liked the old version, aside from not being able to warp while cloaked.

With the new cruise, they would be awesome.

omg
the clueless...

I never liked the Raven's looks, while the 'Phoon, while definitely unbeautiful, has a certain brutal charm. This being the case, I'm not too upset, but I'd be a lot happier if the Raven was equally attractive (statistics-wise) - that way I'd have a shield boat option if/when armour was a poor choice.

Just ckecked Duality, Scorpion has 75mm Scan Resolution.