Player Features and Ideas Discussion

This module would require a balance to be in place, in order to not shift the advantage against cloaked play entirely.

I would recommend that since this is a boost to intelligence gathering, in the form of allowing cloaked vessel detection and subsequent predation, a counter be placed to reduce the intel aspect, whose combined effect with this, would otherwise trivialize cloaking.

That being, Local Chat no longer displaying cloaked vessels, whether specific to them or as part of a larger set of changes.

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Now, as to details how this works:
The hunting craft activates the painter module.
This activates an enhanced sensor decryption mode, which like cloaked vessels works better on certain hulls. The covops hulls themselves work better for this for many of the same reasons they work so well for cloaking devices. They can control and limit their own sensor emissions to a greater degree.
You can launch probes prior to activating this module, and use them and or D-Scan / active scan.
While in this operating mode, cloaked vessels appear to your sensors as if they were not cloaked, allowing you to detect them using normal means.
The only device you can use beyond sensors / probes, is the painting function. Locking onto the vessel using this takes an amount of time determined by the difference between your skills and equipment, and the cloaked pilot with their vessel.
Once you are locked on, they become visible to everyone, and can be locked and attacked normally.

Keep in mind, in hunting mode you can use your sensors, (including your probes), as if they had no active cloak.

The skills of the hunting player, with bonuses for ship and modules
Compared to
The skills of the cloaking player, with bonuses for ship and modules

This comparison of skills creates a lock time. Now, the range of this painter would basically be anywhere on the same grid.
EDIT for clarification:
(The hunter can see the cloaked ship the same as a normal uncloaked one)
The limit for it to actually lock onto the target in order to decloak it, would be the lock range of the hunting ship itself.
It would not be directly painting a laser image like the regular module, but rebroadcasting a decoded version of the telemetry the cloaked vessel would have if it were not cloaked.

To evade this effect, the cloaked vessel needs to get off grid from the hunter. Very difficult to do, if you are not in a covert ops type craft, since warping then requires you to drop your cloak.

If you ARE in a covert ops style craft, you are not as much of a direct threat, but you are harder to catch if you are alert to being hunted. A fast locking tackle will probably be desirable to back up the hunting craft.

Is this design practical, or simple enough to make sense?
Simple indeed.

I took the basics of a cloaked vessel, and used that as the basis for it. I just substituted the painter module for the cloak.

For ships that could not mount a covert ops style cloak, this gives you vessels that have better combat ability, but poorer hunting capability. Still, more than enough to chase any cloaked ship to the point it cannot do much more than keep running away.

For ships that could mount the full covops cloak, we are describing a vessel balanced to pay for stealth abilities, so obviously it cannot fight better than it's cloaked counterpart. Great for teamwork, however, since it gains greater hunting ability in exchange.
You CAN catch the non covops cloaker far more easily, just make sure you have friends with you. He probably wanted to be able to fight, or else he might have chosen the covops ship instead.
You can match and possibly catch the covops cloaker too, pilot skill being a major factor here. At the very least, you can chase him enough so that he can do little else but run from you. This is a decent counter, and worthy of the effort invested.

Consider the time involved to lock. It will be balanced to make sense.

At a gate, the gate cloak effect is not considered, since that would be OP and expose too many to unintended risk.
Ships exiting the cloak, and switching to their own, are not exposed long enough to be at risk. They are normally warping away ASAP.

If there are bubbles, then they need to use something to get past the bubbles quickly. Effort dictates what is needed to counter it, in each case.

Also, a cloaked ship won't be handing out free intel about being in system. People need to figure out it is there in the first place, or else make routine sweeps of the entire system to be sure it is clear.
How much effort is worth it to them? They set the bar on what a cloaked vessel must do in order to beat their efforts.

Who said anything about cloaky nerfs?

In order for this to occur, local must not display cloaked pilots as being present.

Many cloaked pilots have indicated interest in trading this free intel in exchange for being able to actually hunt.

The only thing stopping PvP on both sides is local itself. If local goes fully delayed, or really any variation where cloaked vessels are left out, then this is the trade off for that.

Now, instead of instantly knowing a cloaked pilot is present, but being unable to do anything about it... (current situation that results in a stalemate until one side gives up and logs / leaves)
People will never know a cloaked vessel is present, unless it does something to draw attention to itself. Then, they can hunt for it, on the assumption it has not left and is still present to be found.
They can also perform routine hunts, on the off chance a cloaked vessel succeeded in sneaking in without being seen.

All aspects require effort, noone is being broadcast for free.

This game aspect would finally require effort, not dumbed down into ending in a predictable stalemate.

The decloak ping imo should be a feature for covops and exploration frigs. See it as science stuff.

so the 'painter' can only reveal one ship at a time?

personally am in favor of:

-scan with 'anti-cloak' probes (bonused on T2 class)
-short range 'anti-cloak' pulse that deactivates cloaks within a specific range for a specific time (range/time/cap use bonused on T2 class)

the pulse decloaks more targets and does not require a lock, but requires close proximity. much like a depth charge forcing a sub to surface. Basically built for gate camps in null, but hunting out in the open becomes tricky and gets u gate gunned low or concordokkened in high.

scripts could be used to send longer ranged pulses in a limited field in front of u (much like d-scan) or send a projectile a certain distance in front of u that explodes with an AoE much like a bomb.

all currently existing mechanics.

If someone is truly AFK cloaking, then getting rid of local will help the victims, not the cloaker.

That, unless the cloaker says something in local before going AFK.

This comment fails to consider any PvE pilot making any effort to adapt.

Of course, those who cannot adapt will simply return to high sec. They had absolute dependence on Local to tell them when to hide, and when to come out and PvE again. Such one trick ponies will not be missed, as they were never really outside of high sec in their hearts.

Now, with pilots willing to make more effort than looking at a chat roster, whole new avenues open up. They get to compete with each other for who makes the better effort.
PvE pilots will be using proactive system sweeps with ships able to detect cloaked vessels. Sure, they could wait for the cloaked vessel to announce it's presence, but more effort like this brings better results.
PvE pilots, in an effort to compete with each other in this aspect, will have teamwork open to them for sharing intel. The pilots who hunt them will instinctively seek out the groups who make less effort, as this will bring hunters more kill mails.

"Lets go hunt some ratters in system XX, they don't share intel, and you can usually catch em unprepared"
-- Don't be those guys in system XX, make an effort to be prepared.
When dealing with predators, you don't need to outrun the predators at all. Just outrun the next hunted guy instead. This is a competition.

As to those hunting, how exactly will they know where you are? Local won't tell them.
Checking maps to see who is active? maybe, but clever pilots can do this too, and avoid hot spots.

Being smarter, and making more effort, simply replace the dumbed down watching local chat for free warnings.

oh. cool then

It is sad to see this tired argument being so often repeated.

Wormhole space is NOT the same as null without local.
Please do more research before posting such claims.

For those who may not be aware:
How is Null different from a WH:

Live and stable gate connections to other sections of space, and between internal systems.
Outposts, NPC and player built both. This includes the sub category of med clones and jump clones as an additional difference.
The Market. Present in all it's glory, even if only stocked by player activity and some minor NPC items.
Cyno capability, both covert and regular.

Please don't be THAT guy. We're all here for the same reason, to try mash ideas together to make EVE more fun. It's got nothing to do with balance, risk, reward or whatever; this is a game and it needs to be fun.

Personally I hate local chat. It's game breaking to watch a chat channel for intel rather than scanners/probes.