Ships & Modules

I have flown the succubus, and the phantasm a fair bit due mainly too my love for shield tanking and lasers.

The Succubus in my opinion has good cap, it seems to be just as good as every other frig I have flown however it seems to be slow, and lacking in dps.

The Phantasm on the other hand has horrible cap, I cant put two adaptive invun fields on it without it going below cap stable. It also seems to be lacking in dps, and tank.

I think a decent fix for Sansha ships would be to remove the Caldari bonus and combine it with the role bonus for a total of 125%(150%) increased damage and add a shield resist bonus. Another suggestion could be to add another turret slot on these ships and again remove the caldari bonus and add the resist bonus, but keep the role bonus at %100. A final change i can think of is just buff the 5% dps bonus to 10%.

Every other pirate faction seems to have a defined role such as 90% webs. To me the role of Sansha ships is dps and currently you can get cheaper ships that fill the role of the phantasm/succubus so in order to make them worth flying they need to do this role better.

It's true, but let's be honest, I would fly the **** out of the phantasm if it had another turret, and so would you

He said put that bonus in with the hull bonus. It would be closer to 150 extra DPS, which would definitely be nice.

Maybe my math is a bit off, but doesn't the nomen have 8 effective turrets vs the 10 that the phantasm would have with an extra turret? You could squeeze a bit more dps from an extra damage mod, but surely not enough to give the nomen better damage?

The NOmen gets more lows (3 HS) and a bigger drone bay. A Phantasm with 4 HPL/2 HS deals less damage than a NOmen. It also has less capacitor and requires cap for its hardeners.

-Liang

Yeah looks like I had my implants in the NOmen and not the Phantasm. 536 vs 519 DPS @ 23km (Scorch), pretty sure that's not good enough DPS for it to be the "Sansha Shtick". I stand by my original suggestions earlier in the thread.

-Liang

If you're just looking for an excuse, we have periodic Phantasm Fleets in Amamake. ;-)

-Liang

Ed: Also, my experience with the Phantasm is a bit more recent than yours. Although, looking at it, I have more experience in a Scythe Fleet than the Phantasm...

I think that can't be emphasized enough.

I never post on the forums but this thread really made me do it: The Phantasm is an affair of the heart. It's almost steam/tesla-punkish/20.000-leagues-under-the-sea-like-design makes it one of the most beautiful hulls in the game, and yes, that's why I pimp my Phantasms to around 400 mill because I just want to make those asthetic jewels work somehow.

For PvP (I won't address PvE in my post) the dedicated shield-laser-combination (please don't refer to shield Harbingers or Zealots...) was one of my main goals when I started this game almost 3 years back, and it hasn't lost any of its appeal. But as it is now, I don't even look at the sad little dung beetle that is the Succubus, and while I love the Nightmare and the Phantasm per se, as brawlers (and IMO that's their natural role, after trying different options) they rely completely on crystal implants, drugs and - most importantly - on a very thick wallet when you optimize their stats with faction/DED-mods. Sometimes when siege links were available it became apparent that all they needed was that resitance boost to make them viable even with a standard T2 fit, tank-wise. The cap however is still a major problem: Even when using two small DED-nos's permadraining a locked drone, a Phantasm will have major trouble MWD'ing while shooting/tackling/tanking. And that's w/o having 1+ med neuts on you, as is commonplace wherever one goes.

I find it troubling that I can fit a Rokh/Moa (specialties of mine though at least up until recently not commonly considered to be good solo PvP choices... ;) ) to outperform a Nightmare/Phantasm in both tank AND dps with better cap life for a fraction of the ISK.

Hence, as some others have stated before, I'd also strongly vote for changing the Caldari cruiser bonus into a 5% per level shield resistance bonus while making it a fixed 167 % damage role bonus (only then I won't complain about its drone bay...) on the Phantasm. Tweaked speed/agility to at least resemble the T1 cruiser rebalance and hugely better cap life should be self-explanatory. These modifications would be enough for a start w/o having to adjust fitting specs or slot layout atm.

There really is no reason not to pull the Sansha hulls out of the dark place in which they are now tomorrow. Don't tell us it's so complicated it takes years - one thing I know for certain from my professional life is this: Everybody everywhere puts on his/her trousers one leg at a time, and still everybody exclaims that his/her job is the hardest of all. ;)

Cheers,
Tilo R.

I don't think it was stated in this thread so far (i'm deeply sorry in the case i missed it) but the new Sansha rookie ship on Sisi has a 22.5% bonus to shield boost amount, among other things.
Though that does not adress the cap issues when firing, i would be perfectly okay to see that on the whole sansha fleet :)

That logic doesn't hold up, 99% of ships in EVE that use a damage control use the T2 varient which is only 1% better than the meta 4. Does that mean Damage controll is OP, or just the best choice of all the options.