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Greetings

I may have missed a post about this or I am just pedantic.

I have a concern about the wording "Targeting and offensive module against an illegal player target". Should it not read "Activating an offensive module against an illegal player target"? If one has the 'Auto target back', x targets ticked, just being targeted by another player will cause your ship to target theirs, apparently incurring the same criminal flag?

Great ideas though, should ruffle a few gangster feathers

Kit

never mind

I think the general gist was that the person you can-flipped can take his stuff back consequence free if you leave it floating around in space. This would make the general concept of a small ship putting your stuff in a new can very difficult as you could just take it back without consequence while they get the aggression flag. At least that's how I (and apparently many others) have read it.

"Targeting an offensive module" means you shoot. A target lock comes from your ship, not a module.

What happens between members of the same corp doing inter corp duels for fun?
Do they get concorded?
Shot at by gate guns?

Great job. While it doesn't make the system simple it does allow me to see clearly what consequences there are for my actions. It should make low sec fights at gates interesting.

I also like the changes to logi mechanics. No more insta-dock at station when the logi gets in trouble (and I like that even thought I do fly logi upon occasion).

But I do have one question about logi that isn't clear from either the blog or the posts I have read so far. This involves high-sec wars and neutral logi. Its clear that the neutral logi won't be able to dock at will, but will have a weapon and pvp flag that could have a timer of as long as 1 minute (for the weapon) and 15 minutes (for the pvp).

What's unclear is if and when the neutral logi become legal targets for the WTs of the ships they are aiding. Right now (or rather the last time I was involved in a high sec war which was some months ago), neutral logis only became valid targets when they had repped a ship I had already done damage to. This was less than desirable as various ships were only valid targets to a subset of the fleet (and did on at least one occasion result in Concord getting involved).

Uh, What did I just say? You didn't even read my post, did you?

I said 'fixing Maintenence Bays'. That affects every ship with one, Orcas - and all 'future' Orcas.

The scenario that I asked you to comment on didn't even include an Orca - simply an alt bringing a new ship to the mission space and ejecting. I asked you if you considered that scenario to be 'fair or unfair' so I can understand where you are coming from....

Your failure here is that you consider ejecting and boarding a ship to be the 'root cause' of the problem, and eliminating these abilities is a good thing because it eliminates two 'fringe' uses.

I'm trying to demonstrate that eliminating 'ejecting or boarding' while in combat removes a number of tactics which are anything but abusive, for no good reason.

Fix the fringe case, impede the act of scooping an engaged ship with ANY ship with a Small Maintenence Hangar.

Bang, Problem solved. Prove me wrong.

I should clarify, I meant more as a response to aggression where the target is legal. ECMing someone who is not in flagged against you would generate an "S" I would expect (in high sec)

Except that you're now arbitrarily preventing everyone from tactically ejecting just because some players abuse the mechanic above. What's to stop the orca? There are several options:

1. They could be flagged:


• by carrying over/synchronizing the current flags of the ship owner (which hopefully wouldn't require flagging the ship, just tracking the ship's owner), or
• by flagging the ship and syncing its flags to the orca pilot, or
• by giving any SMA ship a W flag for scooping a ship in space, preventing it from jumping through a gate/docking/etc for 60 seconds under any circumstance. (might be harsh, but should be enough to solve the abuse problems and be simple to implement)

They could be prevented from scooping a ship that is being targeted. (probably a good idea regardless)

Personally, even if it takes more work to code, I think any ship scooping a ship that was recently in combat should be flagged as a valid target for whomever was shooting the scooped ship and the offending orca should be prevented from running through a gate (W flagged) to escape penalty. This is clearly an abuse. If you want to fly an expensive ship anywhere you should be prepared to lose it.

While the ejection prevention has wiespread drawbacks argued by others here, you are currently not even adequately addressing the cited abuse by only preventing pilots with a W flag from ejecting for 60s. Some T3s, faction BSs, and other pricey ships can have pretty hefty tanks, esp under remote repair. 60 seconds can be plenty of time for them to deaggress, eject, and let their ship be scooped and saved without any penalty to them when they don't think a fight is going their way. And just to be clear, "solving" this by preventing anyone with a PVP flag from ejecting would be ridiculous and further upset quite a lot of players.

There are a lot of other reasons to want to eject shortly before your ship is destroyed (besides evading SP loss, which is stupid but a risk we take*), especially attempting to save an expensive pod, or any pod living in WH space. Skill plays a part in saving your pod at any time but, unless you have a quality ISP, session change lag is often enough that fast locking ships like double sebo zealots will have already locked and killed your pod before you even respawn on grid (visually). Being able to eject at least introduces uncertainty as to when to try and target you so you have a better chance to escape.



Regarding ejection of T3s, there are 3 scenarios to consider if you decide to eject from one in combat: If you eject too early, the enemy is likely to steal your ship, which is embarrassing. If you wait too long, you blow up and lose SP. It can be tricky to find that middle ground as is so that they don't steal it and you avoid SP loss in many situations. Ofc, this is not considering having a orca-alt land on field to scoop it at the last minute.

*I have never liked or agreed with any mechanic that takes away skill points (eg clone penalties). Since you train in real time you are quite literally buying skill points. Any SP loss is direct hit to what you've paid into the game, in time and money. That said I fly T3s occasionally at the risk of losing SP anyway.

I just want to say if I ever meet you Masterplan, I'm buying you a beer. I like the 'no logging off if you're ratting to save your ship's ass from PvP gank squads. I like the 'no ejecting if you have fired weapons to save skill points/pod' thing. Of course this means many people are going to be even more hesitant about committing to combat, but that's Eve for ya.

I'm sure we'll all adjust.