Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The problem:

Sieged dreads must rely on a local tank alone, which does not scale well with fleet size. Sure, they get one of the best local tanks in the game, but 1-2 supercarriers can kill a sieged dread before it's siege finishes, not to mention the threat of being instapopped by a DD.

The solution:

Allow sieged dreads to be remote repped, at the cost of taking away the EWAR immunity. At least this way dreads will have a better survival rate againast supercarriers when supported with carriers, although they're still giant loot pinatas to titans.

I agree dreads could do with a bit of a buff, but the idea of spider tanking triage carriers with remote ECCM scares the bejeezus out of me. I wouldn't want to mess with a fleet that had them running as logi

I ran some quick numbers in eft ...I'll drop carriers from the debate. I threw it in there as an afterthought because of the same ewar immunity/no friendly reps effect.

I think when he said remove triage carriers from the equation, he meant not to allow them to receive remote assistance in triage. Dreads would still be able to receive capital reps.

Dreads still would have a **** poor scan res, and the lack of ewar immnity would mean that a damp/jamming combo would render those dreads useless. Also good luck keeping 2 dreads alive with 6 guardians once you get hotdropped by supercaps.

Also, what doesn't get wtfpwned after being webbed and painted?


Dreads today are billion isk coffins because they're committed to the field for 5 min and must rely on local reps alone to survive. With the exception of triage carriers, every other ship class in the game can receive remote reps, which allows them to tank much more damage than their local tank ever could. This, in addition to the rise of supercaps which can easily kill a siege dread is the reason why dreads are not very useful and collectively have been collecting dust in hangers for a while now.

Didn't know you could web and paint ships that are immune to ewar...

Back in those days we had AoE DD's and fighter bombers did not exist yet. Focused DD's and swarms of fighter bombers would still kill dreads with ease, but at least dreads would now have some measure of survivability against modern supercaps.

Maybe the problem lies with the decision to go into siege with supercarriers and titans on the field. One could bring a knife to a gun-fight too but it's unreasonable to expect the knife to shoot bullets.

Frankly, the solution to fighting supers at this point in time is still to bring more supers. I think the last nerf was intended to create the possibility of conventional fleets being used in support against supers but that hasn't happened on any scale yet.

In my opinion, the first job to do before figuring out how to buff the dread is to find some kind of balance in the number supercaps being made vs the number being destroyed.

I posted somewhere else recently that the problem isn't with what a supercap can do but with how fast you can make them. If a carrier or dread costs 2bil isk and can be made in (what is it?) 3 weeks then a super that can kill 10 dreads should take 10 times longer to make (ie. +/- 7 months) and a titan for the power of it should take 25 times longer to make than a dread (ie +/- 1.5 years).

The point being that the real problem isn't what they can do but the fact that 0.0 is filling up with them because they are far too easy to make.

T-

I would argue that history has taught us differently on many occasions. Numbers and superior technology/weapons win fights as often as clever strategy.

Then give us a number..... Maybe my calculation isn't the best one but given how many titans are being built vs how many are being destroyed, it's clear that if CCP doesn't either (a) make them VASTLY easier to kill or (b) make them VASTLY harder to build then 0.0 will simply fill up with titan blobs on the long term. That's not a future scenario I would like to see but at this point in time, I'm seeing it as inevitable without some kind of intervention.



if they could have put up 2x the CSAA's they would have already. I agree with you though, that making them hard for everyone else to build gives an unfair advantage to those who already have them. There must be some solution to this. One thing is clear, however, which is that doing NOTHING about over-proliferation of supercaps is not the solution. Something has to be done to limit their numbers or balance their build/die ratios or the game (at least the 0.0 game) will eventually become pointless.



It still works like this. with 150 guys in conventional ships you can kill a titan LOL. It just takes time, which you don't usually have enough of....



A titan can be killed by any configuration that can apply enough dps and tackle to get the job done. You could kill it with noob ships if you you could pin it down in a bubble and put enough of them on the field. The problem isn't that it can't be killed. The problem is that it can't be killed easiliy with any conventional force that can currently be fielded in 0.0. The problem gets significantly complicated because they don't travel alone so you don't fight one titan. You often see them flying in fleets of 10 or 15 (or more) with 40 (super) carriers and 100 subcaps so basically they only get destroyed when the pilot does something really stupid.... like this guy http://www.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12262026



The point I started out making to you is that it's stupid to go in siege when you know there are enemy super caps and titans in the system.