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SWToR Just hit the iceberg=Tortanic!
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2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#21 - 2012-02-09 23:21:07 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
EA needs 500k subs for a year I believe at least to make up the initial investment or so they said before release if I remember right, I do not believe they even have 500,000 after a month, also that does not save the fact they have spent 7 years of lost studio time for 3studio one created just for this game and one service center in Ireland etc just for this game. Also They owe George Lucas 35% of everything they ever make of the Star Wars name, ouch. Also they lost consumer trust, I know I will never buy EA titles or Bioware titles again and I also know I am not the only one, sure maybe we are few but that is still something and guess what, whenever EA make another MMORPG, who will even try it out.

Anyway, I think it is funny and also sweet that they fail and I don't care if someone somehow is bothered by me taking pleasure in them failing. They owe me after my wasted 70 EURO.

Also, Biodrones are fun to make fun of Lol I can't remember the last time I had so many great laughs on forums.
Jhagiti Tyran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#22 - 2012-02-09 23:24:36 UTC
If you open identical page in two tabs in a browser you can copy and paste between them, that way you can consolidate the text and enter bbcode manually. This allows somebody to quote several people in a single post.

Much tidier than quadruple posting.
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#23 - 2012-02-09 23:28:30 UTC
Jhagiti Tyran wrote:
If you open identical page in two tabs in a browser you can copy and paste between them, that way you can consolidate the text and enter bbcode manually. This allows somebody to quote several people in a single post.

Much tidier than quadruple posting.



Thanks, I am used to Lazy SWToR Forums, sorryLol holy ****, search button!!

But yeah, will try next time.
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#24 - 2012-02-09 23:43:25 UTC
I am wondering if the marketing people at EA did not grossly underestimate the saturation in this market, especially the theme parks that dominates the genre.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#25 - 2012-02-09 23:57:22 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Alpheias wrote:
I am wondering if the marketing people at EA did not grossly underestimate the saturation in this market, especially the theme parks that dominates the genre.


http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/40196/EA_CFO_Eric_Brown_resigns.php

Obviously.


Also I think they overestimated the Star Wars franchise and that it would make every SW fan boy out there buy it just because it has that IP. Which by the way, is most likely the most expensive IP you can go for.


Honestly, this is how it feels when they decided to make the game-

KOTOR=Bioware RPG+Star Wars=Game of the year and millions of sold copies.

WoW a MMORPG=loads of cash mmm

KOTOR+WOW=ULTIMATE POWAAAHLol

Oh and Activision Blizzard it seems will soon win their lawsuit against EA for industrial espionage on WoW. Which is funny because they obviously failed to even make a good WoW clone.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/12/22/court-says-activision-can-go-ahead-with-lawsuit-against-ea.aspx

They are suing for 400 Million USD and from what I read elsewhere it seems they are likely to win, so SWToR will end up costing at least 700 Million USD?


So I hear a few people who go to see the Star Wars episode 1 in 3D will be treated to an add for SWToR, not of actual gameplay of course but the anime cgi trailer. I wonder how much they paid George Lucas for that tie in promo add.
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#26 - 2012-02-10 00:07:43 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
The other problem they made was making an MMORPG with a worse story than KOTOR 1 & 2 ending at level 50. Most people like myself finished the game before our free month was up. Fully voice over quests to kill 30 sand people was not so much fun after all.

http://beta.xfire.com/games/swtor

EvE Online

http://beta.xfire.com/games/eve

WoW

http://beta.xfire.com/games/wow

Nr 1 is LoL of course.

Also interesting article on future of subscription models.

http://www.shacknews.com/article/71199/soe-dc-universe-daily-revenue-up-700-percent-since-going



Another interesting article by the HeroEngine developers who made the game engine used for SWToR,.

http://www.heroengine.com/2011/11/heroengine-meets-starwars/


In the year 2005 at E3 EA approaches the developers of HeroEngine-

“I need this,” said Gordon. “I am about to start a special project and these tools will let us build and prototype fast and get something running in a hurry.” Gordon is not an excitable guy by nature but this had his adrenaline flowing. “This is just what I need! I want to license your engine.”


“It’s not productized yet,” we told Gordon. “There are whole sections of code that is only roughed in and not optimized for performance or security. And there are very few comments and very little documentation.”

He didn’t care. “We are going to have tons of engineers. We can finish it ourselves. We’re going to want to modify your source code for our special project anyway.”

Read the full article at the link above.


Oh and what effect did SWToR have on WoW? Nothing it seems. Same for EVE Online, nothing.

http://kotaku.com/5883861/what-effect-did-star-wars-the-old-republics-launch-have-on-world-of-warcraft
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#27 - 2012-02-10 01:06:30 UTC
Jhagiti Tyran wrote:
2bhammered wrote:
I also read that EA lied about their figures like they did with warhammer online.

It seem that the 2 million sold copies were to retail and the 1.7 million subs was at end of December and that the only real data provided by EA as to how many play the game is that "Most" people still playPirate


I doubt that they lied, not only where those figures externally verified lying in official stockholder finical reports is punished by prosecution. So during the time period those statistics refer to they are completely accurate.




They did not lie, you just did not comprehend their meaning and you also read it out of context. Also the use of the word "MOST" is not something you can prosecute someone over especially when "MOST" are on their free subscription. People like myself make millions of reading between the lines and knowing how things work not to mention read it all in context. Nope they did not lie, nor did the reuters and other media.

Here is how you SHOULD read it, 2 million sales to retail,1.7 million subscriptions including free month as of december 31, currently "most" are still subscribed as of...

You're welcome, oh and they did the same with Warhammer Online and other titles as have others in the industry. Well except Blizzard who at the same time released exact figure of number of subscribers, I wonder why they use numbers and not words like "Most".

Blink
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#28 - 2012-02-10 02:00:24 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=288275


Pure gold, mmm, I recommend you bring popcorn lol



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYEqQzbU1nk

Invisibility hack=no bans made since launch. Other hacks include speed hack, invulnerability hack, duping credits and much much more!
Liam Mirren
#29 - 2012-02-10 05:23:30 UTC
This IS a discussion forum, not just "lets spam my own thread" :P

Also, we get it: you don't like it (neither do I), lets leave it at that.

Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#30 - 2012-02-10 05:55:01 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Liam Mirren wrote:
This IS a discussion forum, not just "lets spam my own thread" :P

Also, we get it: you don't like it (neither do I), lets leave it at that.



Yes it is a forum and I made a thread about the fact that SWToR has failed and is dying, no I am not going to "leave it at that", because I enjoy it. If you don't then you are excused from this thread which has a clear title so as to avoid confusion about the subject Roll



Here is another funny video Lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68VfgesWmcI

Enjoy!


Besides, being funny, it is the biggest failure of a game in history of the video gaming industry, sounds thread worthy to me Blink
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#31 - 2012-02-10 07:33:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Destination SkillQueue
It's potentially the biggest failure in the industry. If it really takes them 500k subs for a full year to even make a profit from this, there is a real chance that you're right in the end, but I still think they'll make a profit out of this in the long run. I just don't see most MMO veterans having a constant sub for long. A few months sure and then coming back during expansions to play through the new content during the free month. That doesn't equate to failure, just to having to rely on other players to carry the game.

Keep in mind, that it has one of the strongest IP with fanatical fans who genuinely love everything with a SW theme(FFS they'll even defend the prequels to death and see nothing wrong with them) and it has also attracted new MMO players, who don't know any better or really like the single player story aspects. They might stay with the game and if BW can churn out new content for them at a steady pace, they alone could carry the game for a long time. Either way I just think it's too early to tell, since the raging is currently mostly from MMO vets and I'll wait until I see how things look at the 3 month and 6 month marks before announcing it dead or having a bright long term future.
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#32 - 2012-02-10 08:50:40 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
*snip, sorry needed more "characters" Lol.



I agree with most of what you say, except I believe it already did fail and I am sure that will be confirmed this month when they are suppose to have next conference and are suppose to give detailed numbers of how many people have a paid subscription.

I think the game was doomed to fail from day 1 back in 2005, it never had a chance. My reason is because back in 2005 WoW was declared to be the top selling PC game of all time. Later that year on E3 this happened-


http://www.heroengine.com/2011/11/heroengine-meets-starwars/

In the year 2005 at E3 EA approaches the developers of HeroEngine-

“I need this,” said Gordon. “I am about to start a special project and these tools will let us build and prototype fast and get something running in a hurry.” Gordon is not an excitable guy by nature but this had his adrenaline flowing. “This is just what I need! I want to license your engine.”

“It’s not productized yet,” we told Gordon. “There are whole sections of code that is only roughed in and not optimized for performance or security. And there are very few comments and very little documentation.”

He didn’t care. “We are going to have tons of engineers. We can finish it ourselves. We’re going to want to modify your source code for our special project anyway.”

Read the full article at the link above.



This is just one thing of many that stands out but it illustrates my point the best. They never cared, they never cared about making a great game, they just wanted something fast to capitalize on WoWs success and get a piece of the pie. Now if you remember at the same time SWG another Star Wars license MMO existed and was failing hard and Lucas Arts were very displeased with Sony Online Entertainment, which is why later they tried to emulate WoW with the NGE making the game level based etc. So Bioware had a title already called, KOTOR, it was game of the year when it released with millions of copies sold, it seemed natural then to partner up for an MMORPG. Kill SWG and use the successful KOTOR.

But reading that and other sources and if you look at how their development of the game has progressed since 2005,it is obvious they wanted to make a Star Wars MMO and release it within a few years. But because of problems and Warhammer Online etc not to mention SOE it ended up taking 7 years to finish. After the success of Mass Effect they then decided to add that system into SWToR, so then they ended up having to borrow their studio time. I could go on and on but...

Point is, they wanted something fast on the market to grab a piece of the WoW action. It ended up taking a lot longer and costing much more money than they bargained for. In many ways it is a very similar story to that of Duke Nukem Forever and how that was handled. I mean, their game engine is dx9 and does not go higher, in 2012, brand new state of the art home computers run the game at 5-20 fps while a computer 5 years old manage at 60 fps.

As for die hard fans, they are very few and I'll tell you why, most hardcore Star Wars fans that would be potential consumers already played SWG with the NGE and they numbered at 10,000 people. Also a lot of the SWG fans both pre NGE and after are for obvious reasons not happy with this Star Wars MMO, it is too much of a theme park and not a sandbox not to mention they were used to far more features in their game.

Also, just as with me and other people who love and loved Star Wars we hated the prequel movies, nr1 fan is Mr Pinkett at redlettermedia or whatever he and his company is called that made the world famous Star Wars prequels reviews http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxKtZmQgxrI That is why he made the videos and spent and still spends so much time hating them. People like that and me we quit SWToR and hate Lucas Arts even more Lol (it is like George Lucas wrote the script and dialogue in SWToR P)

Then you have the MMORPG players and gamers who will leave because the game simply suck.

Will there be many people still playing it? Die hard fans? Yes! But they wont be enough and they will all quit sooner or later or when they are forced to quit, like the last thousand players in SWG last year. Most Star Wars fans will move on to other Star Wars games, like SW Kinect where you can wave a light-saber infront of your TV.

Others will go back to WoW, EvE Online, FF11, EQ, STO etc and others will go to Guild Wars 2, Tera, Diablo 3, DOTA 2 or the other MMO's announced or any of the F2P games like League of Legends that just keeps growing and has far passed WoW.

SWToR costs money, Tera is the only other game this year after SWToR with a monthly subscription model. SWToR would have made it back in 2005-2008 which is what they planned to do, tough luck, industry has changed, people are bored of WoW and WoW clones (SWToR is a WoWclone) and WoW will most likely be the last game with a subscription model that does good, they said their new MMO TITAN wont be monthly sub, Planeside 2 and SOE games will all be some form of F2P etc but it is their fault and now they deserve to fail for their greed and bad productTwisted
Valei Khurelem
#33 - 2012-02-10 10:08:40 UTC
Herping yourDerp wrote:
Valei Khurelem wrote:
Fuee wrote:
SWTOR cost 300+ million to make


Are you ******* kidding me?

Oh wait, must have been all those stupid cinematic videos they put up to hype everything.


MMO's can take 5 years to make and go through basic testing.
assuming they have 300 people working on the project getting 50k a year
300
x 50
x 5
that right there is 75million, i'm sure most people got paid more then that.

i'm sure EA or lucas arts or god knows who wants a cut.

advertising cost a lot

servers.


Oh yeah, the amount of people involved in that daft project was probably ridiculous ( and possibly a reason why it's failing ) one thing a lot of people just don't understand though is how much time you have to put into those cinematic trailers to make them look as good as they do. It honestly takes a good number of months because of all the detail, if they had spent that much time and resources working on the game it might have MIGHT have been better but unfortunately it seems these days stupid cinematic trailers lure gullible people in more than a solid product do.

CCP are equally as guilty on this, I think their crucible trailer was the only honest trailer I've seen from them so far because it was just gameplay footage and nothing else.

"don't get us wrong, we don't want to screw new players, on the contrary. The core problem here is that tech 1 frigates and cruisers should be appealing enough to be viable platforms in both PvE and PvP."   - CCP Ytterbium
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#34 - 2012-02-10 10:45:27 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Valei Khurelem wrote:
Herping yourDerp wrote:
Valei Khurelem wrote:
Fuee wrote:
SWTOR cost 300+ million to make


Are you ******* kidding me?

Oh wait, must have been all those stupid cinematic videos they put up to hype everything.


MMO's can take 5 years to make and go through basic testing.
assuming they have 300 people working on the project getting 50k a year
300
x 50
x 5
that right there is 75million, i'm sure most people got paid more then that.

i'm sure EA or lucas arts or god knows who wants a cut.

advertising cost a lot

servers.


Oh yeah, the amount of people involved in that daft project was probably ridiculous ( and possibly a reason why it's failing ) one thing a lot of people just don't understand though is how much time you have to put into those cinematic trailers to make them look as good as they do. It honestly takes a good number of months because of all the detail, if they had spent that much time and resources working on the game it might have MIGHT have been better but unfortunately it seems these days stupid cinematic trailers lure gullible people in more than a solid product do.

CCP are equally as guilty on this, I think their crucible trailer was the only honest trailer I've seen from them so far because it was just gameplay footage and nothing else.



Skyrim=3 years + 60 million dollars in total including all advertising, return 450 million dollars in 3 days and now is up to 650+ million, no recurring costs for license or servers (I am sure there are other fees in future of course but minimal.) This is official numbers of profit they made.

SWToR=7 years + 300 million, some say 500 million with advertising, return 120 million after a month?-35% license fee -server costs -support - new development studio -offices in Ireland -taxes etc. I had to guess.

When you think about it, it is most likely going to end up at 500 million USD and not 300 million. It also makes you wonder how much sales you need to make a return, 2 million is not enough, so how many subs? Hmm, 15 dollars a month -charges, taxes, LA license hmm, oh oh Oops

WoW back in the day I think had a total of 60 million invested when they released their game, within a year it was all time best selling PC game. Of course like Bethesda they made their own engine and everything in-house.

I welcome an expert to try and figure out how many subs SWToR needs to break even, someone with far better math skills than I.
Valei Khurelem
#35 - 2012-02-10 10:59:19 UTC
We'll only be able to know about whether they've actually made money off The Old Republic until they release their profits at the end of the year, since EA is a public corporation they have to answer to shareholders, they have been consistently losing money each year and I reckon it's partially because they spent so much money trying to take down their competition ( Buying out people like Westwood, Bioware etc. ) and because no one in that companies management I think really knows properly how to make games they're having a lot of difficulty.

They're boasting the numbers now because they're big and impressive but just wait for the next few months to pass and we'll all see how well The Old Republic is really doing.

"don't get us wrong, we don't want to screw new players, on the contrary. The core problem here is that tech 1 frigates and cruisers should be appealing enough to be viable platforms in both PvE and PvP."   - CCP Ytterbium
Fuee
Doomheim
#36 - 2012-02-10 12:33:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Fuee
I was waiting on this game on and off for at least 2 or so years. I was thinking it was to be more like a sandbox SWG 2 , I had pre-ordered it in November but luckily cancelled when I read more about their focus on the "story" and that it was to be like WoW.

The one good thing these Star Wars games have provided is a metric crap-ton of drama, from the developer behind the SWG NGE's suicide, the SWG forum archives as a whole to now the most costly release ever and losses at least in profit potential if not in outright negative balance sheets.

When I cancelled my pre-order a few months ago I went back and read the old forums, news about the SWG disaster. Though the old SWG forums were replaced some time ago the archives still exist somewhere out there. They're pretty hilarious.

(and.. I'm not laughing at the developer's suicide.)
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#37 - 2012-02-10 16:13:02 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Fuee wrote:
snip* I needed characters, sorry Oops



I loved SWG until the NGE hit, I had a dark jedi on bria, it really hurt. Yes, SWToR was nothing like SWG and heck, it is even worse than WoW vanilla to me or WoW today. I had a hunch the game would fail for the reasons I came to seeLol But I let myself get fooled, some friends said it was great, just like KOTOR and leveling is awesome hyperbole stuff, oh and they all also quit after meRoll But I figure, how can they **** it up? Like I told myself when I went to see Star Wars the Phantom Menace, maybe it wont be as fun as SWG or whatever but surely it will be at least as good as WoW or something.

Boy was I wrong, not only was it not what I wanted, it is terrible and time will tell but I believe it will end up that this game is nothing no one ever wanted. Not even that most rabid fan-boy. It is an insult to gamers everywhere and the industry as a whole. I can't wait to see EA and Bioware lose their lawsuit on top of this game tanking. Yes I am "Laughing" at them as their game is sinking as we speak and I do take pleasure in it and I don't care if anyone has a problem with me enjoying itTwisted

I don't doubt for a second that this game will not only fail to break even with their investment but in fact gointo the negative as you put it. Unlike SOE who with SWG commited suicide (but don't forget Lucas Arts pressured them to show numbers equal to WoW and do anything to achieve that result,) Bioware and EA commited suicide before the game was even released.

The fact they released it in the state it is and will continue to be shows that they don't mind screwing every single person out there to try and save money, even if that person was or is a loyal consumer of theirs. They honestly do not give a crap, just read their forums, they broke the UI and now said that it is the players fault for not testing the changes on the PTR and giving them enough feedback to know that the UI is broken before going live with latest patch. Afterwards several people showed them threads posted on the PTR forums alerting the developers to the broken UI all ignoredRoll every single feedback and issue in beta, also ignored for 1 year since closed beta testing and worse.

I hope they burn, I mean it and as you can see and as I have pointed out in this thread it is clear that SWToR has already failed and now the question is how much it will hurt them.

One of my biggest concerns with this launch is the media, go read the EGM review online of the game, almost everyone have given the game 9 out of 10 before launch, biggest reviewer in Australia gave it 9.5/10 to a game that still does not have a release date in their countryUgh I have never witnessed another game in my life since the80's have this amount of biased reviews, read them I dare anyone to read them, IGN and others reviewing and giving top score, game of the year MMORPG for 2012 when it was released in 2011 based on a beta build... Yes we have all seen biased and bought and bribed reviews and reviewers before but this is on a whole different level.

I have read 4 reviews by leading game sites with obvious copy and paste articles without anyone calling them out, if someone does threads are deleted, accounts banned Biodrones trolling and attacking and making outright lies to people who have not played the game making up bullshit. I see posts everyday by these people saying EVE sucks and failed and SWToR is beating WoW in subscriptions and even worse, without anyone calling them out and if they do they get banned.

I have seen youtube video bloggers making a small critique about the game and get 1000 comments calling him names.

EA must have bribed so many people it is not funny, I even see it on Neogaf, known as the most respected forum for video game industry in the world banning people left and right for saying anything bad about SWToR. Not troll posts screaming burn burn EA, but posts explaining how it is bad game design with thought put into it.

I am not joking when I say, I have never seen a worse community or worse media manipulation in my life of gaming. Microsoft and Sony console war is not even 1/100th as bad as this, not even the MW3 vs BF3 came close by a long-shot. MMORPG.com reviewer already got fired for giving the game a score of 6/10, they hired another one who gave it game of the year instead shortly after. When that happened a few years ago with gamespot reviewer it made headlines across the gaming world, this time not a blip* He is not the only one either, gamepro made a video, available on youtube being negative before launch, now they don't have a voice on metacritic anymore. G4 TV gave the game 100 out of 100, highest game score in history, they claimed it to be the best game ever made. PC Gamer, 93, game of the year, on their top 20 list of best games in history.

No, something is very wrong with the gaming industry and the best thing about SWToR failing and hopefully killing Bioware and hurting EA is, people will question the gaming media and forums and blogs and hopefully change things around or the very least, make headlines again.

Threads like mine are against the rules on mmorpg.com, mmo-champion.com and other forums, only one who seems to allow it is their competition forums, as in WoW, EVE and RIFT etc. All other communities even gamefaqsShocked and youtube run into moderation. I have even seen tortanic videos removed by youtube.

It is not so hard to buy of the gaming media and pundits like Pachter. To give an example, MMORPG.com pays 50 dollars per review.

http://www.egmnow.com/articles/egm-review-star-wars-the-old-republic/

"From a PvP standpoint, I tried each of the different Warzone modes and briefly visited Ilum; though, since I’m not really a PvP fan, I didn’t concentrate on this aspect"

"planet Ilum offers some solid endgame PvP"

My comment was deleted...

SCORE: 9.0

Again, I hope they burn!
Jhagiti Tyran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#38 - 2012-02-10 17:32:16 UTC
2bhammered wrote:
Jhagiti Tyran wrote:
2bhammered wrote:
I also read that EA lied about their figures like they did with warhammer online.

It seem that the 2 million sold copies were to retail and the 1.7 million subs was at end of December and that the only real data provided by EA as to how many play the game is that "Most" people still playPirate


I doubt that they lied, not only where those figures externally verified lying in official stockholder finical reports is punished by prosecution. So during the time period those statistics refer to they are completely accurate.




They did not lie, you just did not comprehend their meaning and you also read it out of context. Also the use of the word "MOST" is not something you can prosecute someone over especially when "MOST" are on their free subscription. People like myself make millions of reading between the lines and knowing how things work not to mention read it all in context. Nope they did not lie, nor did the reuters and other media.

Here is how you SHOULD read it, 2 million sales to retail,1.7 million subscriptions including free month as of december 31, currently "most" are still subscribed as of...

You're welcome, oh and they did the same with Warhammer Online and other titles as have others in the industry. Well except Blizzard who at the same time released exact figure of number of subscribers, I wonder why they use numbers and not words like "Most".

Blink


The problem is noone seems to have bothered to check the financial statements themselves, that would answer the question once and for all. Income from the sales of the game (and thus the 30 days) and the income from subscription fees would have to be listed separately.

Wading through all the verbiage in the reports isn't something I can be bothered with because I don't care about how many people are playing SWToR. Anyone who cares enough though should really do it though because it will end the speculation.

Of course it seems more about trolling and smacking a game that people individually dislike than any real discussion about how well the game is doing.
Fuee
Doomheim
#39 - 2012-02-10 17:38:47 UTC
The top 4 threads on SWToR forum

http://i.imgur.com/DIIFp.png

So much entertainment value. I almost wish they had tricked me so I could participate Lol
2bhammered
Cyberpunk 2077
#40 - 2012-02-10 17:42:03 UTC  |  Edited by: 2bhammered
Jhagiti Tyran wrote:
2bhammered wrote:
Jhagiti Tyran wrote:
2bhammered wrote:
I also read that EA lied about their figures like they did with warhammer online.

It seem that the 2 million sold copies were to retail and the 1.7 million subs was at end of December and that the only real data provided by EA as to how many play the game is that "Most" people still playPirate


I doubt that they lied, not only where those figures externally verified lying in official stockholder finical reports is punished by prosecution. So during the time period those statistics refer to they are completely accurate.




They did not lie, you just did not comprehend their meaning and you also read it out of context. Also the use of the word "MOST" is not something you can prosecute someone over especially when "MOST" are on their free subscription. People like myself make millions of reading between the lines and knowing how things work not to mention read it all in context. Nope they did not lie, nor did the reuters and other media.

Here is how you SHOULD read it, 2 million sales to retail,1.7 million subscriptions including free month as of december 31, currently "most" are still subscribed as of...

You're welcome, oh and they did the same with Warhammer Online and other titles as have others in the industry. Well except Blizzard who at the same time released exact figure of number of subscribers, I wonder why they use numbers and not words like "Most".

Blink


The problem is noone seems to have bothered to check the financial statements themselves, that would answer the question once and for all. Income from the sales of the game (and thus the 30 days) and the income from subscription fees would have to be listed separately.

Wading through all the verbiage in the reports isn't something I can be bothered with because I don't care about how many people are playing SWToR. Anyone who cares enough though should really do it though because it will end the speculation.

Of course it seems more about trolling and smacking a game that people individually dislike than any real discussion about how well the game is doing.


No that is not how it works, how it works is a publisher sends copies of software to retail free and months later retailers pay for it. EA can see how many started a subscription, they said, and yes I did look into it but thanks for the insult? 1.7 million people that includes free subscriptions. They are suppose to give an exact figure other than "most" this month at the next conference as I already stated in this thread.

Now you can't be bothered wading through reports, fine, but there is only 1 report and 1 conference call with investors to wade through so whatever, I guess that is too much for you.

Of course it seems to be more about you trolling this thread then discuss anything because you all you have done so far in here is? Right!

Want real discussion? Look at my posts in this thread, now come back and tell me I did not post anything "real" here.

Peace!