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[Summer] Pirate Battleship Cost Intervention

First post First post First post
Author
Matthias Ancaladron
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#141 - 2017-06-09 09:09:51 UTC
This only hurts the little guy who won't be able to get a fun ship now. Nothings gonna stop huge corps from just farming stuff and producing Machs en masse.

Added together with the Plex increases and Its just making it harder for players to Plex.
She11by
Big Boys Don't Cry
Kids With Guns Alliance
#142 - 2017-06-09 10:06:30 UTC
Matthias Ancaladron wrote:
This only hurts the little guy who won't be able to get a fun ship now. Nothings gonna stop huge corps from just farming stuff and producing Machs en masse.

Added together with the Plex increases and Its just making it harder for players to Plex.


Exactly will hurt newer players, and annoy veterans.
Blazemonger
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#143 - 2017-06-09 10:34:37 UTC

The current string of nerfs and 'balancing' is obviously mostly geared towards CCP's bottom line. Seeing the articles which have been posted in several financial publications recently it's reasonable to assume a drive to increase net worth to be able to ask a better price when (yes when, not if) the CCP buyout offer comes.

Going F2P did not have the desired effect, bottom end players as well as new players are mostly irrelevant as they do not generate the revenue expected. I can see an Alpha nerf coming, maybe not his year but it will come. Then the push to monetize through micro transactions will get kicked up a notch again..

By then Dual Universe will hopefully have matured enough.
Cartheron Crust
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#144 - 2017-06-09 11:18:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Cartheron Crust
Heh all this crying about BUT I JUST TRAINED/BOUGHT NOW WHY YOU NERF?!!1

One of the things I first learned/read about in EVE was don't FOTM chase. As it will get nerfed when you least want it too. Even more so now if you are going to go out and buy injectors to fly that FOTM stuff.

:AdaptOrDie:

P

[EDIT] - I for one will enjoy seeing less pirate BS as the norm. Even though it's going to take a while to churn through the, what I imagine, are massive stockpiles.
Commander Spurty
#145 - 2017-06-09 11:25:25 UTC
The content in Null is done by swafts of 'frigates' (Hello Pirate Citadel which drops trillions of isk), so lets cull Pirate Battleships ...

Please don't even bother until Pirate battleships are the 'bar' for entry to null or something. So many more things for you to buff (like the content / NPCs flying out of those pirate citadels) before we need to see Nerfs.

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP

JC Mieyli
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#146 - 2017-06-09 11:33:28 UTC
Cartheron Crust wrote:
Heh all this crying about BUT I JUST TRAINED/BOUGHT NOW WHY YOU NERF?!!1

One of the things I first learned/read about in EVE was don't FOTM chase. As it will get nerfed when you least want it too. Even more so now if you are going to go out and buy injectors to fly that FOTM stuff.

:AdaptOrDie:

P

[EDIT] - I for one will enjoy seeing less pirate BS as the norm. Even though it's going to take a while to churn through the, what I imagine, are massive stockpiles.

eh
theyre not being nerfed
theyre just putting more isk into rich player hands is all
and nerfing mining so to increase the value further
and now nerfing ratting so their isk becomes more valuable

this has nothing to do with game balance or health of the economy
it comes down to 2 things
1 - get rich players even richer and screw the economy
2 - get everyone flying t3cs to make more $$$ from sp extractors
Cartheron Crust
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#147 - 2017-06-09 11:54:30 UTC
JC Mieyli wrote:
Cartheron Crust wrote:
Heh all this crying about BUT I JUST TRAINED/BOUGHT NOW WHY YOU NERF?!!1

One of the things I first learned/read about in EVE was don't FOTM chase. As it will get nerfed when you least want it too. Even more so now if you are going to go out and buy injectors to fly that FOTM stuff.

:AdaptOrDie:

P

[EDIT] - I for one will enjoy seeing less pirate BS as the norm. Even though it's going to take a while to churn through the, what I imagine, are massive stockpiles.

eh
theyre not being nerfed
theyre just putting more isk into rich player hands is all
and nerfing mining so to increase the value further
and now nerfing ratting so their isk becomes more valuable

this has nothing to do with game balance or health of the economy
it comes down to 2 things
1 - get rich players even richer and screw the economy
2 - get everyone flying t3cs to make more $$$ from sp extractors


It's about time they started doing hats at the New Eden Store. How much was the Tin Foil one?
JC Mieyli
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#148 - 2017-06-09 12:02:54 UTC
wow that was a clever post
dont overdo yourself okay
Taliyah Riraille
Chroma Corp
Prismatic Legion
#149 - 2017-06-09 12:04:29 UTC
I for one welcome our new command ship overlords!
Zoey Quickpoke
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#150 - 2017-06-09 13:20:06 UTC
JC Mieyli wrote:
Cartheron Crust wrote:
Heh all this crying about BUT I JUST TRAINED/BOUGHT NOW WHY YOU NERF?!!1

One of the things I first learned/read about in EVE was don't FOTM chase. As it will get nerfed when you least want it too. Even more so now if you are going to go out and buy injectors to fly that FOTM stuff.

:AdaptOrDie:

P

[EDIT] - I for one will enjoy seeing less pirate BS as the norm. Even though it's going to take a while to churn through the, what I imagine, are massive stockpiles.

eh
theyre not being nerfed
theyre just putting more isk into rich player hands is all
and nerfing mining so to increase the value further
and now nerfing ratting so their isk becomes more valuable

this has nothing to do with game balance or health of the economy
it comes down to 2 things
1 - get rich players even richer and screw the economy
2 - get everyone flying t3cs to make more $$$ from sp extractors


Maybe you haven't the t3 focus group but T3C's are on the operating table too! Smile
big changes are coming! Smile
JC Mieyli
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#151 - 2017-06-09 13:58:01 UTC
yeah but removal of sp loss isnt one of them lol
Jehle
Interstellar Infantry
#152 - 2017-06-09 15:03:06 UTC
This is ********. Why mess with the "player run" economy at all?
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#153 - 2017-06-09 15:43:05 UTC
Jehle wrote:
This is ********. Why mess with the "player run" economy at all?


Because it's actually a simulated economy and, unlike a real economy, there's an effectively limitless influx of new resources instead of a finite amount of material in the universe and, consequently, the flow rate of this influx periodically requires management.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Amarth X
Homicidal Suicidal
#154 - 2017-06-09 15:49:01 UTC
Did you consider that pirate battleships might be cheap simply because battleships in general are? Which in turn can be explained by their weakness in large scale fleet fights.

Most alliances have been favouring HAC and T3 doctrines for many years, simply because they are that much better. They have far smaller sig, they apply damage better, they are faster on grid and in warp.

While the advantages of BS are very few. They do not provide a lot of extra EHP and the extra they get does not make up for the significantly larger sig radius. They do more damage but apply it worse. The only real benefit of BS are that utility slots are much easier to fit, plus the ability to use a few oddball BS-only modules.

This is the root of the problem. Pirate/faction battleships are about the only BS that make sense to use for doctrines, since they overall have larger bonuses than t1. So maybe fix the root of the problem: make BS useful in fleet pvp.

Their main weaknesses are sig radius and warp speed. They are supposed to be big and slow so that's fine. But maybe compensate this by actually giving them higher damage and better tank than cruisers? Right now BS are pretty low on the food chain, having to fear anything from stealth bombers, to sig tanking T3, to blap dreads.

---

In addition, I don't believe there is such a big relation between the amount of BPCs dropped and the ships on market. Likely, industrialists aim to get BPCs for ships that give the greatest profit. Supply and demand dictates that the ships that are used the most will get built the most.

The by far best BS for large scale fleet fights is the Machariel, which is also likely the reason why it is currently expensive compared to the other pirate BS. While the Bhaalgorn is cheapest by far, since it is useless for anything but small gang pvp.

---

Overall, I wish CCP could focus their endless re-balancing projects on things that are fundamentally broken, rather than on things that presently work somewhat well. Instead of tinkering with pirate BS and T3, why not focus on fixing completely broken things such as the bumping mechanics, the cloak mechanics and the nullsec sov system.

Jonathon Rodriguez
Doomheim
#155 - 2017-06-09 16:57:44 UTC
JC Mieyli wrote:
increase material cost and lower bpc means less availability for pirate bs
this means all the industrialists get to build pirate bs early and stockpile
screws over the young industiralist again

how about for once instead of increasing cost to benefit veteran industrialist
try lowering the cost of everything else to help the young industrialist and screw the rich fatcat players
would be niceto see this happen for a change


THIS is the truth.
Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
Citizen's Star Republic
#156 - 2017-06-09 17:07:22 UTC
Jonathon Rodriguez wrote:
JC Mieyli wrote:
increase material cost and lower bpc means less availability for pirate bs
this means all the industrialists get to build pirate bs early and stockpile
screws over the young industiralist again

how about for once instead of increasing cost to benefit veteran industrialist
try lowering the cost of everything else to help the young industrialist and screw the rich fatcat players
would be niceto see this happen for a change


THIS is the truth.



hmmm, the truth.......???

I am one of those rich fatcat vet indy guys that builds everything else......please do on reducing the costs.
Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
#157 - 2017-06-09 17:11:13 UTC
in regards to all of this ^^^

Escalation nerf for anomalies would be an ok idea, but apply it across the board not just to top grade anomalies.

Faction BPC droprate: can't say I run nullsec sites so best I could offer there is to not theorycraft on what i don't know. an alternative suggestion would be allow limited numbers of faction newb ship bpc's to drop.

Build cost changes: I don't agree with special materials requirements unless the material droprates are also increased to compensate for the increased load, instead normalizing them to require similar materials to their T1 counterparts (for all not just BS) would be in line.

Rebalance: it's not the faction BS's that need a balance pass, it's the T1's. Fitting is tighter and they can't compete well.


As for fleet doctrine usage..... as long as there is a supply, there will be usage.
JC Mieyli
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#158 - 2017-06-09 17:26:40 UTC
Max Deveron wrote:
Jonathon Rodriguez wrote:
JC Mieyli wrote:
increase material cost and lower bpc means less availability for pirate bs
this means all the industrialists get to build pirate bs early and stockpile
screws over the young industiralist again

how about for once instead of increasing cost to benefit veteran industrialist
try lowering the cost of everything else to help the young industrialist and screw the rich fatcat players
would be niceto see this happen for a change


THIS is the truth.



hmmm, the truth.......???

I am one of those rich fatcat vet indy guys that builds everything else......please do on reducing the costs.

glad you agree those markets should become more accessible
i find your selfless disregard for your own source of income quite commendable
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#159 - 2017-06-09 18:06:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Mina Sebiestar
this is not nerf to pirate ships this is padding certain ppl wallets in game

faction ship need to be looked up TFI especially it should get range bonus like mach or vargur to be stepping stone to those ships without tank like varg or warp speed and general mobility like mach it wont step on them but will be at least viable to do dmg where those ship can project.

Insted being saddest of tempest hulls faction battleship even, with lowest dmg output among all minmatar battleship while having dual friking dmg bonus.

I like my X-Type stuff but that shiet need to have price tag on it(as in rare) and not be traded for pocket change.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Gallente Citizen 92008988
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#160 - 2017-06-09 18:47:59 UTC
IMO

Should start with changing the building materials amounts first.
It only makes sense, but CCP has a history of doing the wrong things for the benefit
of the few.


Loving the free to play aspect of the game