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Dev blog: Unboxing the new Camera in EVE Online

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Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#601 - 2016-02-20 22:53:58 UTC
What are the settings I need to ensure I have the full "new" camera? I want to make sure I'm experiencing the whole thing. All I see right now are the five or six camera checkboxes in the bottom left of the General Settings tab in ESC menu.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#602 - 2016-02-21 00:24:57 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
What are the settings I need to ensure I have the full "new" camera? I want to make sure I'm experiencing the whole thing. All I see right now are the five or six camera checkboxes in the bottom left of the General Settings tab in ESC menu.

Those and the checkbox on the general tab called "Try the new camera".
Dominous Nolen
The Graduates
The Initiative.
#603 - 2016-02-21 01:45:49 UTC
Feature enhancement
During site running I observed when hacking a can if I press CTRL+SHIFT + Click when attempting to unlock a target the camera snaps the orbit mode with tracking camera follow toggled on to the target being removed from active locks.

Behaviour change request :
Have the ctrl+SHIFT+ click leave the camera in its current position rather then snapping to the target being unlocked.

@dominousnolen

"Fly dangerously, Fly safe, Fly whatever, just keep Flying." - Lee Blackwood
Parious MeHoff
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#604 - 2016-02-21 03:50:19 UTC
I'm sure it already has been mentioned, but I would like to see a toggle on the new camera controls for an auto tracking camera.

Thanks for the great game!
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#605 - 2016-02-21 04:20:27 UTC
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
What are the settings I need to ensure I have the full "new" camera? I want to make sure I'm experiencing the whole thing. All I see right now are the five or six camera checkboxes in the bottom left of the General Settings tab in ESC menu.

Those and the checkbox on the general tab called "Try the new camera".

Oh, okay thanks. I got confused, I was posting afk and meant the Display & Graphics tab. Seems I have the General Settings checkbox marked.

I hope you're bringing the old C toggle camera function into the new camera. Swivel the camera all you want but you need to anchor the camera on the player's ship. Right now the track function is more like "look at... from a distance"

I have Alt+1 bound to a G-Key and spam it when something goes wrong with the camera.

Zoom works like it should, pan works like it should. Return to center with Alt+1

That track function though. Sitting in a citadel yeah it works, but for pilotage we need the old C tracking behavior.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Dominous Nolen
The Graduates
The Initiative.
#606 - 2016-02-21 06:53:58 UTC
Parious MeHoff wrote:
I'm sure it already has been mentioned, but I would like to see a toggle on the new camera controls for an auto tracking camera.

Thanks for the great game!


It was added days ago. Shift + C

@dominousnolen

"Fly dangerously, Fly safe, Fly whatever, just keep Flying." - Lee Blackwood
Dominous Nolen
The Graduates
The Initiative.
#607 - 2016-02-21 06:57:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Dominous Nolen
Opened EBR-68512: CAMERA ZOOM LEVEL RANDOMLY ADJUSTING

Camera when clicking into random space with the tracking camera toggle on will snap to my ship by default and also reset its zoom level to double my original amount

Video included on EBR and here.

Tracking camera zoom + snap

@dominousnolen

"Fly dangerously, Fly safe, Fly whatever, just keep Flying." - Lee Blackwood
Anluan
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#608 - 2016-02-21 22:20:34 UTC
Uhm, you need to fix the camera to no do weird things when:

1) you are in the map and start moving around. the map moves too...
2) You are in the fitting window and you warp, the ship model moves
Ecrir Twy'Lar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#609 - 2016-02-22 01:37:54 UTC
CCP Turtlepower wrote:
Hello everyone,

We met with the CSM this week had an extensive session to go over the new camera, and have a pretty sizable task list to work on in the coming weeks. To make sure we get the camera into top shape before making it the only camera, we have decided to leave the old camera in for another month.

We are not planning on deploying more tweaks and fixes to Tranquility until the March 8th release.

Once again thanks for all the feedback and support.
CCP Turtlepower // Team Psycho Sisters


First of all I would like to thank you for giving us back a toggle for tracking. I can sleep at night now.

Second... I've notice that with the tracking toggle turned on, I can click on things out in space and my camera will focus there where I can dscan. This works for bookmarks seen in space as well. However, if I open the system map from the dscan ui, I can do the same with I think everything except for bookmarks. This isn't a huge deal, because I can still do it in space. However I think it would make a handy addition for those times when you want to dscan from the system map. I think it would also be a good learning tool for those learning how to use dscan effectively.
CCP Turtlepower
C C P
C C P Alliance
#610 - 2016-02-22 11:41:59 UTC
Gommel Nox wrote:
I posted this days ago in the upcoming feature thread on this topic, and apparently the reason I didn't get any response from anyone was because I was supposed to post in the dev blog thread. My bad.

Gommel Nox wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, and I apologize profusely if it already has been beaten to death, but here's my big issue with the new HUD/camera changes. For those of you who do not know, I am a quadriplegic capsuleer. What this means is that I do not have the physical ability to type on a keyboard at all, I cannot feel anything below my chest, and I cannot move my fingers, wrists, or even arms in a meaningful way. In spite of all of these things, I have still managed to keep my eve career going since 2008, adapting with every new change to the UI since.

However, the recent changes to the HUD/game camera are very concerning to me. The reason behind this is that, with the new UI, it is completely impossible for me to zoom in and out. I'm not sure what exactly happened to the zoom buttons, and while CCP Punkturis successfully managed to CCPass_The_Buck to CCP Goliath, not knowing that he was no longer on the team involved with the UI changes. While I should be concerned that, within CCP, people don't know exactly what other people are doing, I'm even more concerned that the new UI changes will be shoehorned in, with disabled people being told to "just bind buttons to zoom in and out" as if it were a feasible option for everybody who plays. I assure you that it isn't.

If you don't know at this point, in addition to being a disabled gamer, I also stream and occasionally write for themittani.com, and I would absolutely love to be able to pick your brain about Eve online being what I would consider one of the most accessible games available for people with disabilities, in a TMC feature for my column, Access:Granted. I really hope you will consider an interview.

Thank you very much


Has this been discussed already?


This has not been discussed in this thread to the best of my knowledge, but we are aware of this issue and plan to deploy a fix for it on March 8th.

Cheers,
CCP Turtlepower // Team Psycho Sisters
Raphendyr Nardieu
Avanto
Hole Control
#611 - 2016-02-22 18:07:35 UTC
Noticed that when disconnecting from tracking (rotateing camera manually when I was tracking something), the camera rotates a lot more than one would expect. This makes it hard to use autotracking or manual to rotate the camera towards the enemy and then repositionin the camera manually.

Basically when you mainly rotate the camera by hand, but some times you loss orientation to the target and want to get the target in view port. You click the track and there the enemy is and then you rotate the camera a bit and lost the enemy again.
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#612 - 2016-02-23 05:18:13 UTC
Raphendyr Nardieu wrote:
Noticed that when disconnecting from tracking (rotateing camera manually when I was tracking something), the camera rotates a lot more than one would expect. This makes it hard to use autotracking or manual to rotate the camera towards the enemy and then repositionin the camera manually.

Basically when you mainly rotate the camera by hand, but some times you loss orientation to the target and want to get the target in view port. You click the track and there the enemy is and then you rotate the camera a bit and lost the enemy again.


That could be easily solved by not moving the camera to the side of the ship.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#613 - 2016-02-23 06:58:52 UTC
Actually I think the problem is when you track and then swivel, your camera is looking at nothing in particular. Because it wasn't anchored on your ship in any way, and then it isn't looking at the target.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Dominous Nolen
The Graduates
The Initiative.
#614 - 2016-02-23 16:33:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Dominous Nolen
Dominous Nolen wrote:
Opened EBR-68512: CAMERA ZOOM LEVEL RANDOMLY ADJUSTING

Camera when clicking into random space with the tracking camera toggle on will snap to my ship by default and also reset its zoom level to double my original amount

Video included on EBR and here.

Tracking camera zoom + snap



EDIT: My EBR was closed with no updates/comments

If this is being included in a future correction could you at least have the bug hunting team include something to say "already being corrected" or something?

New EBR: EBR-68763

EDIT: Ninja comments added to the ticket post closure..

@dominousnolen

"Fly dangerously, Fly safe, Fly whatever, just keep Flying." - Lee Blackwood
Natya Mebelle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#615 - 2016-02-24 01:53:32 UTC
Dominous Nolen wrote:
As directed by CCP Darwin/CCP Support twitter posting feed back here in hopes the UI team will comment

Original Reported thread >> Tab Not rolling windows


I copy my paste from that relevant topic:

Natya Mebelle wrote:
CCP Darwin wrote:
I'll refer you to this tweet from Customer Service.
functionality was removed as it was confusing people who pressed TAB unintentionally.


You have got to be kidding, right? That is not how feedback works. Only because some people report is as bad doesn't mean that many people do NOT say anything about it since they think it is good.
Instead, your choice of action should have been testing how much people use it and if it has valid reasons before you jump to conclusions.

You are removing a FEATURE that is useful once LEARNED. Instead you cater to the lowest common denominator of "Monkey don't know, monkey don't push?"

You advertise your game as a sandbox. How many tools do you want to keep taking away from us and force us to build only one type of thing with one type of sand until you don't have anyone left to get reasonably creative?

The functionality was totally fine. Anyone who doesn't want it it on the tab key, should be allowed to change that keybind. And not removing the entire function.

Honestly, where did that even come up? I can't remember anyone saying in corp chat (NPC starter corporation, so we got MANY questions incoming) that they accidentally killed all their windows.

Shade Millith
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#616 - 2016-02-24 12:21:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Shade Millith
Since server is down and Sisi is the only thing available, I'm having another try of the new camera.

1) Once more, vertical camera movement is a problem. Fix it. I think this is half the reason people feel that it's sluggish and unresponsive. It feels horrible, making vertical movement feel too slow and bogged down, and horizontal movement feel too quick.

2) 'Look At' camera is not good. Looking at an opponent is extremely important to get information on the ships movement and gun types. This staticly placed camera you've put on (AGAIN!) looks cool, but performs worse as a source of information. Old camera is quick and snappy. New camera is slow and sluggish.

3) Zoom is just uncontrollable. Exponentially increasing how fast it zooms doesn't work.

There's a reason that nobody I've talked to has had good things to say about it, and have opted out. The same with the new D-scan and new Map.

Setup the Orbit Camera exactly as the old camera is now for those that use the camera as a PVP tool.
Put in a Cinematic Camera with all the bells and whistles for those that want a pretty light show.

CCP, please. Stop dulling the axe to make it look shinier. It's not improving the game.
Ecrir Twy'Lar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#617 - 2016-02-24 14:59:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Ecrir Twy'Lar
Natya Mebelle wrote:
Dominous Nolen wrote:
As directed by CCP Darwin/CCP Support twitter posting feed back here in hopes the UI team will comment

Original Reported thread >> Tab Not rolling windows


I copy my paste from that relevant topic:

Natya Mebelle wrote:
CCP Darwin wrote:
I'll refer you to this tweet from Customer Service.
functionality was removed as it was confusing people who pressed TAB unintentionally.


You have got to be kidding, right? That is not how feedback works. Only because some people report is as bad doesn't mean that many people do NOT say anything about it since they think it is good.
Instead, your choice of action should have been testing how much people use it and if it has valid reasons before you jump to conclusions.

You are removing a FEATURE that is useful once LEARNED. Instead you cater to the lowest common denominator of "Monkey don't know, monkey don't push?"

You advertise your game as a sandbox. How many tools do you want to keep taking away from us and force us to build only one type of thing with one type of sand until you don't have anyone left to get reasonably creative?

The functionality was totally fine. Anyone who doesn't want it it on the tab key, should be allowed to change that keybind. And not removing the entire function.

Honestly, where did that even come up? I can't remember anyone saying in corp chat (NPC starter corporation, so we got MANY questions incoming) that they accidentally killed all their windows.



I was hoping they could remove functionality on my caps lock because I keep bumping it and yelling at people in local. Seriously though, you have to admit that it is ironic that a developer named "Darwin" is advocating protecting people from themselves.
Dominous Nolen
The Graduates
The Initiative.
#618 - 2016-02-24 21:29:34 UTC
Any dev aside from Darwin able to comment on the tab situation?

Would love to know if we're going to get an explaination as to why the feature was removed without comment.

There seems to be a fair amount of user support on a few threads now for its return (or atleast a bind option) and it would be awesome to get clarify here if we're going to see its return.

@dominousnolen

"Fly dangerously, Fly safe, Fly whatever, just keep Flying." - Lee Blackwood
Iris Lurechia
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#619 - 2016-02-25 00:33:44 UTC
What's really bugging me is the lack of the old tracking camera. While before I could click that button and track all that I target automatically, now I have to hold ALT every time I click. This is making dscanning multiple sites & planets in FW space especially cumbersome. Please CCP put a tracking camera option into the system to save my putting a dead weight on the alt key.

Apologies if this has been mentioend already, but 30+ pages is a bit much to read through.
Juhh
Sons of Bendeguz
Phoenix Cartel.
#620 - 2016-02-25 02:25:47 UTC
I think this open a new way. I enjoy this new camera thing. I like to control the ship and I find it useful. You can choose to charge on your enemy or approach in transverse. It will give you opportunity to change if you want.

What bugs me is every time if I click an open window like overview or select menu with my mouse while i control the ship, it lose the hot key. So i have to click back to space to be able to turn with my ship. The buttons what will let you move around should be always "on top" except when you are on the chat window.

It kills the fun when you in fight and click on overview to target and the ship will lose the orbit. And I will start to fly in to the trouble ( straight ).