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a new shortcut menu tab of consolidated camera controls would be greeeat thaaaanks

I dont know if this has already been mentioned, I'm at work and dont have time to read all the comments.

First: The new camera zooms you all the way into the back of your ship when you undock. Personally I hate this. It is also very unnerving when undocking a jump freighter and other large ships. Other than that, the orbit camera is great.

Second: Yaw needs to be added to first person camera. and Full 360 degree pitch. I know it could be disorenting but it severly limits the capabilities of manual piloting when you cannot do a full roll or loop. you hit that 180 degree barrier.

Third and final: on the mass targeting (holding CTRL+click drag) to drag the square in space, that square should only target active overview settings. Trying to use it for anyhting other than savlage is impossible, especially on the pirate gate havens. I end up with a full row of snake astroid targets. I also hate the lack of the automatic tracking of selected target and no custom tracking positions! this makes PVP extremely difficult as you cant just click the enemy on the overview and have it snap right to them!

Please fix these issues! these camera are a great addition but they have a bunch of minor annoyances,

Let me just reiterate my post in the february feedback thread in the proper topic (https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6332437#post6332437)

I have no need for the camera tracking feature personally, never have and probably never will. Why is it taking such an inordinate amount of space on my GUI I will never understand. Okay, fine, rewrite the code. But can I just get the current type of camera i.e. one that does not simulate tracking and foul up aspect ratio whenever it feels like it.
And please make it so it can remember settings, because readjusting the camera after every jump will get annoying fast. How something like that got past testing is another thing I can't understand.

Why does the new camera have less "FOV Zoom in" (ALT+Mouse-wheel) then the old camera (ctrl+L+R mouse)? I hope its not because people complained about "Low res. sky-box" so ccp just reduced maximum zoom in, instead of fixing sky box.

I am one of those players that always used tactical overlay. I find it ridiculous that with new camera I CAN NOT change my field of view in the tactical camera I have to switch to orbital camera first then alt+mouse-wheel, WHY?

With old camera I could center tracking position for d-scanning or create custom tracking position all from my HUD. How do I do this with new?

Also most Importantly why cant I toggle tracking camera ON or off this is the worst.

Lots of glitches, shacking camera, camera gets left behind when I warp, If I am in map mode and I jump my map moves on me. And much more!

Besides being more cinematic then the old camera the new camera Is a Huge step backwards in terms of functionality. Very much like the new map, if i set new map to jumps or kills per hr. EVERYTHING is the same color between 1-100 kills or jumps (not enough color variation) but the new map is still optional in a month the new camera will be mandatory Please fix the problems before doing this!

Well after some more testing I realized I was a bit wrong about why the inertia effect feels so bad. I also updated my older post. Basically I thought the inertia effect in itself was the problem, but after someone mentioned that it's already in the old camera I did another test. The old camera has some inertial drift after moving it, but it's fine because the drift is both slow and only at the end of the camera movement. The old camera starts moving at full speed instantly instead of accelerating at the beginning of the motion.
On the other hand, the new camera takes some time to get up to speed, causing it to feel very sluggish and laggy. That slow acceleration at the start of the movement is most of the problem, but the drift at the end also needs a little work. The new camera seems to slow almost linearly from full speed to a stop, causing it to feel very uncontrolled and bouncy. The old camera seems like it slows down very quickly and most of the drift is at a low speed so it feels like the camera is just settling into place rather than drifting past where we want it.

Inertia on zooming is still very bad because scrolling with a mouse wheel is a much more granular operation with steps. Smoothing those steps creates a very uncomfortable disconnect between input and effect where the input is quick and precise but the effect is slow and imprecise.

Also, the more I use the camera the more I notice how slow it is to move the camera vertically. The difference between vertical sensitivity and horizontal sensitivity is very strange and feels wrong.

Now, about the V thing people keep mentioning, I can't get that to work but slowly adding lines to the dscan results window is a terrible idea. It needs to be at least 4x faster if it absolutely must be done that way, but getting the whole list instantly is still far better.

And just so nobody reading this thread gets the impression there's anyone who doesn't hate the tracking changes, let me make it clear that I too dislike having to press C on each new item. I also don't like having my ship moved to the side where there are always windows covering it.


TL;DR: Inertia on the start of camera movements is bad and makes it feel sluggish and laggy. Inertia on zooming is also bad because it's a precise operation and it doesn't feel precise with inertia. Vertical camera sensitivity should be the same as horizontal. Adding dscan results one line at a time needs to either be much, much faster or not happen. Please fix the tracking camera; it's not nice to use the way it is now.

The new camera has come a long way, but a few of those basic issues remain, making it hard to use. The proposed dscan changes really don't make up for the tracking camera being hard to use, even just for dscanning. That's not even considering its uses in combat or for getting a sense of your position in space.

why is it so hard to not sort by pilots name and ignore the icons? if you asre in fleet and the fc says 'dareaper is primary' then who cares what the icon for my ship is? you cna also sort by type and again, ignore the icon. No real reason not to as its what you would of done anyway if the icon was still a [ ]. There i fixed your icon issues, you are welcome

Exactly. Ranting and raving and threatening to quit over changes does help a little in that it helps to make the scope of the problems apparent. However, to actually fix the problems devs need to know specifically what's wrong and figure out how to fix it. That however leads to our current situation where everyone and their mom wants the tracking camera to be a mode toggle instead of a command but the devs don't change it. At this point it should be obvious what the problem is and how to fix it, but they're not fixing it. That's pretty much the only case where ranting and raving and threatening to quit the game can accomplish anything.

For the rest of the issues as well as this one we need to be constructive and actually narrow down the cause of the problem as closely as possible, and ideally offer solutions.

Gave the new camera a try in PVP on Friday. Tweaked the settings until I was reasonably comfortable with them, and had an okay time--until I clicked on the overview to look at something or D-scan something, and got frustrated because I'd forgotten to c-click again. Today I switched back to the old camera, and frankly it was a relief to have tracking behaving normally again.

Suggestions so far, then:

1) Default settings should be adjusted so the orbit camera behaves more like the old camera out of the box. EVE really doesn't need another thing to configure before you start playing. Video makers will probably want to tweak the settings to take fuller advantage of the new features, but video makers would probably have tweaked the camera anyway according to their own personal needs and tastes.

2) Really, honestly and truly, tracking should be toggled on once and left on. For fast d-scanning, for situational awareness in a fight, for just catching a glimpse of something cool, c-clicking is inadequate.

EDIT:

3) I'm not sure if the spooky music in tactical mode is a bug or intended feature, but that really should be bound to the music volume slider for people who want to turn it off. It's my understanding now that it's bound to the UI volume slider, which means, if you don't like the spooky music, choosing between gritting your teeth and bearing it, switching to another camera mode, or turning off the client's (very helpful!) array of audio signals.

Do not remove the option to opt for the old camera angle version please.

Changes are welcome if they are based upon positive feedback of the end-users. For instance, in aviation, HUDs (Heads up displays) were made because of pilot feedback, so the aviation industry have implemented the system on military and civil aircraft based upon pilot feedback.

So, in Eve, CCP would be the aviation industry and the players would be the pilots when comparing this to the above example.

If engineers would have made HUDs not giving a damn about pilot feedback, then guess what, pilots will just flip the HUD up and not even use it to begin with, and rely on traditional display unit instrumentation layouts. However, as engineers forcing pilots to use HUDs without having had pilot feedback, oh boy... welcome increased inefficiency, risks, etc... again, sometimes it is good to make a real life scenario for comparison.

Failure to listen to end-user feedback and blindly removing the option to enable the older version of camera angles is a SERIOUS MISTAKE.