Player Features and Ideas Discussion

So throwing 8 taloses and failing a gank is not risking 1 billion and getting not even a killmail in return?
The only reason why 30-40 people can get away with throwing t2 cats at things and kill it at a low risk of 300m is because thats 30-40 people, maybe just 25 and a few have extra characters but were talking about a cumulative time spent with GCC timer of 9+ hours, how much isk can you make in 9 hours?

Time is money, stop acting like 1 freighters time is worth an equal amount as that of 30 gankers.

Thing is even when the kill happens we still have to roll a dice on drops and even if it drops they don't always get everything.

You also run the risk of getting tackled before the gank even happens, you can get podded after it happens and you "can't highsec because you have killrights".

"But they use empty pods!" Yeah and because of that characters train 15% slower, there are consequences to everything.
You try to discuss things but you can only see your side of the argument.

Nope. The only guaranteed way to get out of that situation is ganking the bumper.
Also, it's lets, not let's.


Facpo will spawn with a delay which is long enough even for battlecruisers piloted by -10 chars to move through highest true-sec systems, so - no consequence. As for being open for attack, true but that risk is minimised/removed by use of insta undocks and tacticals.


Heh, if you only knew what you are talking about. You only need a freighter to loot stuff larger then 50k m3 (so, large contracts and cans). If the cargo is not in a package, DST's are regularly used w/o any risk for them.


Well it seems that this risk adverse carebear understands at least one aspect of the game mechanics (looting) a bit better than you do. But please, sling some more insults, that's what you guys excel at.

Just like a carrier can be held-down with a T1 frigate. Both are at risk if another player chooses to do something about it, and both are safe if no-one bothers to attack them. In highsec, you can attack anyone, anywhere (except rookie systems) by design. The only "safety" a bumper has is in your head.

As I explained above, negative security status is not, and never was suppose to have so many "consequences" that criminals are unable to operate. This is a game, and criminals are very much intended to exist and for that they have to be able to function. Now that said, running a -10 has a huge number of consequences, all of which have resulted in criminals flying only cheap, disposable ships for the minimum amount of time exactly because of the impact of these consequences. They were never intended to prevent criminals from operating - there would be many easier ways for CCP to do that if they wanted.

Of course, because of the above consequences. You can only make a character so vulnerable to others before adding more "consequences" has little impact. This in and of itself shows you how consequential the Crimewatch system punishes -10s if a killright which makes you free to attack adds little more risk to criminals.


This is the only point where I agree there could be more game play added. Laundering the goods in space stymies the potential for a cascade of conflict resulting from a fight over the loot. But honestly, this is a minor point, and one that isn't without counter as you can use the exact same mechanics to grab the loot for yourself. Plus there has to be some balance and a chance for the pirate to get away with the loot, or they wouldn't bother in the first place.

You are a risk-averse carebear or at least an enabler of them. Conflict and criminals in highsec is not even emergent gameplay - it has been specifically enabled by the Crimewatch mechanics. Freighters are suppose to be vulnerable. Criminals are suppose to be able to exist. Even when the carebear-apologists were celebrating the day after CCP patched out hyperdunking, criminals were still popping freighters as much as they had before, and exactly as the game designers intend. The same thing will happen if bumping is ever iterated on, and the daily destruction of industrials will carry on as it has for the last 13 years in New Eden.

This. In fact, in one of the many identical threads to this one, I went through the math and figured out that a 5.0 sec status character can gank something like 24 bumping machs and still not reach the -2.0 threshold for penalties in highsec. Even then, it only takes 120mil isk in tags/fees to bring your sec status back up to zero, at which point you can gank 8 more machs without hitting -2.0.

The only thing stopping the white knigits from going on their own ganker gankfest is their own fear.

Especially since you outright lied about pricing for the second time.

Oh look, it's you again. Pretty please, prove me wrong instead of slinging crap around.
Also, for some reason you always sound really agitated. You should relax a bit.

Not really true - if I'm a 'white knight' I don't want to engage in criminal activities in order to prevent crime, I want to do it legally. Now, if we were talking about dark knights, that would be another story. They might be willing to cross the honorabu line and engage in illicit activities under the "end justifies the means" credo in order to bring order to Hisec.

The story about medieval heroes in internet pixel spaceship world would make some sense if it was about principles, courage, intelligence or what not. However it is not. This is a story about game mechanics, simple cost/benefit calculus and their application which allows for some fairly unfortunate application scenarios. Anyway, looking forward to changes .

If you're going to deliberately restrict your own options for the sake of roleplay, you have handicapped yourself.

Nothing to do with the mechanics, you just want to have your cake and eat it too, and that's not going to happen.

No you did not.
I said that the only guaranteed way of getting out is ganking the bumper. Again, please do enlighten us all on viable alternative.

Also, even if there was one, you could only say that I was lying had I knowingly decided not to disclose the alternative way of getting out in my post, which (with my s****y knowledge of game mechanics) I certainly did not do. Since you do not know what I do or don't know about bumping, you are lying about me lying. How cool is that.
Also, as I said, you should chill a bit, it's just a game buddy.

And that is a lie.




Hell, they were posted on the same page as you posted your lie. Why do you need me to do your reading for you? How about you actually read the thread in the first place?