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Crime & Punishment

 
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Estavan Andrard and the World Traders Guild

First post
Author
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#101 - 2015-10-31 00:26:54 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Why is it you hate being challenged in games and feel the need to spend all of your time attacking and insulting people?
You must have an endless supply of irony. I'll admit I'm rather impressed.
If you say so Lol

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#102 - 2015-10-31 01:57:11 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
That's exactly what you would say if you were trying to deflect the actual point that you are defending a crazy man. Veers.
I'm sure it is, troll.


Said the troll.

Incorrect.

Why is it you hate being challenged in games and feel the need to spend all of your time attacking and insulting people? You realise that's not the best way to pro e the guy in your OP wrong...


I feel like Spock in the star trek reboot when the other dudes are trying to provoke him into flipping out. Dude, you don't phase me, everyone here knows your full of crap. The only toll here is you, and I must admit I'm flattered to have taken up so much of your attention.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#103 - 2015-10-31 02:15:57 UTC
Leto Thule wrote:
I feel like Spock in the star trek reboot when the other dudes are trying to provoke him into flipping out. Dude, you don't phase me, everyone here knows your full of crap. The only toll here is you, and I must admit I'm flattered to have taken up so much of your attention.
I'm glad I don't phase you since my goal is to talk about the game, not wind up other players. You're the one who keeps ignoring the discussion points to insult me (also, let's face it, you started the thread to troll a guy). Everyone here can "know" what they want, it's irrelevant to me. Fact of the matter is, you support easy, challenge-free gameplay and I support balance and varied group playstyles. You barely even attempted to make a counterpoint before you started slinging attacks around so I take that to mean you have no relevant opinions on the matter.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#104 - 2015-10-31 03:05:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Leto Thule
Lucas Kell wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
I feel like Spock in the star trek reboot when the other dudes are trying to provoke him into flipping out. Dude, you don't phase me, everyone here knows your full of crap. The only toll here is you, and I must admit I'm flattered to have taken up so much of your attention.
I'm glad I don't phase you since my goal is to talk about the game, not wind up other players. You're the one who keeps ignoring the discussion points to insult me (also, let's face it, you started the thread to troll a guy). Everyone here can "know" what they want, it's irrelevant to me. Fact of the matter is, you support easy, challenge-free gameplay and I support balance and varied group playstyles. You barely even attempted to make a counterpoint before you started slinging attacks around so I take that to mean you have no relevant opinions on the matter.


Please show me a single time I have ever said I don't like challenge. You are the one advocating carebear land, not me.

Edit:

Speaking of challenge, how about you come to the next thunderdome competition? Ill show you how much I enjoy challenges personally. Of course I know you wont come, but hey, the invite is there.

My vision of EVE is full of danger, hard times, and meaningful victories.

Your version of EVE is a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiener" while mining away with no danger, no point other than to print ISK, and the challenge of "running" a high sec industry corp? Be still my heart. All the excitement is killing me.

Lets not forget, we must all stand up for the nutbags that think space pirates are pedophiles. Because you defend those people. Because thats the right thing to do.

Come to thunderdome, Lucas. Show me you are up for "challenge".

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#105 - 2015-10-31 06:29:03 UTC
Denial, not just a river in Africa

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#106 - 2015-10-31 09:08:53 UTC
Leto Thule wrote:
Please show me a single time I have ever said I don't like challenge.
All the times you push for keeping broken wardec mechanics you are pushing for easy challenge-free gameplay.

Leto Thule wrote:
You are the one advocating carebear land, not me.
No I'm not. Not at one point have I suggested anythign for the sort. Wardecs should even still exist, they should just follow a normal risk rward curve where you get more rewards for going after people that are more capable of fighting back, and less by going after rookies that can't fight back. They should also be limited enough that wardeccers have to choose between targets, not go after everyone. CCP knows this and undoubtedly will make changes before too long.

Leto Thule wrote:
Speaking of challenge, how about you come to the next thunderdome competition? Ill show you how much I enjoy challenges personally. Of course I know you wont come, but hey, the invite is there.
No, I won't, because I don't enjoy the things you enjoy. The great thing about EVE is you can be challenged in a variety of playstyles, there's not just one way to play. You like shooting ships I like crushing numbers, building ships and trading, and flying logistics in fleets..

Leto Thule wrote:
My vision of EVE is full of danger, hard times, and meaningful victories.

Your version of EVE is a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiener" while mining away with no danger, no point other than to print ISK, and the challenge of "running" a high sec industry corp? Be still my heart. All the excitement is killing me.
No, your version of EVE is one where only your playstyle is any fun, while you fly around one-shotting rookies and fapping over your killboard. Mine is one where there's a wide variety of playstyles each with their own challenges and barriers. I certainly won't be running a high sec industry corp because I don't live in highsec, but someone running one should be an option.

Leto Thule wrote:
Lets not forget, we must all stand up for the nutbags that think space pirates are pedophiles. Because you defend those people. Because thats the right thing to do.
I'd stand up for him long before I stood up for you.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#107 - 2015-10-31 09:35:00 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Standard Lucas Kell post with too many quotes for the forum


Fapping to my killboard? Wow there is a fantastically disgusting thought, and now you are tossing insults around. Getting upset are we? Anyone who knows me here knows I give zero f***s about my killboard. I am only interested in having a good time. One shotting rookies? Nope, cant say I have ever done that (well, not on purpose anyhow).

I respect the number crunching aspect, and good on you for it. I am not smart enough to do that, always been pretty horrific at math, and after looking up what the "pros" do to manage their production stuff, well lets just say ill leave my spreadsheets at work where they belong.

But thats not why you wont fight in thunderdome... you are scared to lose a ship. You are one of those guys who still hasnt figured out that ships ARE ammo, and if you had, you wouldnt feel the need to make such a freakin fuss about a noob losing a ship and that somehow being "bad" for player retention. I am PROOF that being wrecked keeps a player in the game, buddy. Not the other way around.

You want people to set their own barriers? Ok, thats great, and a valuable aspect of the game. However- it does not grant them the immunity from how others want to play. How can you say that its OK for a new player indy corp to do whatever THEY want, but a wardec corp needs to be toned down? PERSONALLY - I dont like the 100+ wardecs at a time corps. I feel that most likely thats just an excuse for hub campers to chill out on the Jita undock and blap stuff. But there are people who play that way, and they make their ISKies from it. They are entitled to their game style as well as anyone else.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
#108 - 2015-10-31 13:26:11 UTC
Leto Thule wrote:
Fapping to my killboard? Wow there is a fantastically disgusting thought, and now you are tossing insults around. Getting upset are we? Anyone who knows me here knows I give zero f***s about my killboard. I am only interested in having a good time. One shotting rookies? Nope, cant say I have ever done that (well, not on purpose anyhow).
Not meant to be an insult, just an observation. Yes, you are interestes in having a good time. I'm interested in a variety of playstyles having a good time

Leto Thule wrote:
I respect the number crunching aspect, and good on you for it. I am not smart enough to do that, always been pretty horrific at math, and after looking up what the "pros" do to manage their production stuff, well lets just say ill leave my spreadsheets at work where they belong.
I've always been horrible at combat hence my reluctance to join in on a thunderdome.

Leto Thule wrote:
But thats not why you wont fight in thunderdome... you are scared to lose a ship. You are one of those guys who still hasnt figured out that ships ARE ammo, and if you had, you wouldnt feel the need to make such a freakin fuss about a noob losing a ship and that somehow being "bad" for player retention. I am PROOF that being wrecked keeps a player in the game, buddy. Not the other way around.
See, here you are making multiple assumptions. First the ludicrous idea that I'm scared of losing a ship. Why would I be scared? I avoid it, sure, but I've got a ludicrous amount of ISK and I've made the "ships are ammo" comparison myself on several occasions. I have no problem losing ships, I just have no interest in the style of play you are interested in.

You're also making the assumption that I think losses are bad for retention. That's wrong again. Losses are an integral part of the game. The problem I see is that in highsec there are veteran players who take the easy targets to avoid their own losses (like 99% kb efficiencies) at the expense of several styles of play. I want to see varied styles of play and losses from all of them. Yes, NPCs need to be tougher as part of that based on the level of the activity, trading also needs a heck of a lot more risk and cost, and things like wardecs need to be looked at so soft targets are less rewarding than capable ones.

Leto Thule wrote:
You want people to set their own barriers? Ok, thats great, and a valuable aspect of the game. However- it does not grant them the immunity from how others want to play. How can you say that its OK for a new player indy corp to do whatever THEY want, but a wardec corp needs to be toned down? PERSONALLY - I dont like the 100+ wardecs at a time corps. I feel that most likely thats just an excuse for hub campers to chill out on the Jita undock and blap stuff. But there are people who play that way, and they make their ISKies from it. They are entitled to their game style as well as anyone else.
It's manly because their wardeccers gameplay style is at the expense of whole varieties of playstyle. By being able to wardec hundreds of groups and go after soft targets they don;t just make it tough, they make it impossible for other gameplay styles to thrive in groups. Decently sized highsec corporations should not be for combat characters only.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#109 - 2015-10-31 13:36:49 UTC
Fapping to a kill board... brb

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Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#110 - 2015-10-31 15:03:48 UTC
I don't want to see a perfectly safe highsec. But when I see veteran players hiding behind CONCORD, paying a small fee for the privilege of using casual and clueless players as clay pigeons, I can't shake the feeling that something is wrong.

We keep hearing how dark and dangerous EVE is, but it is really only dark and dangerous when you play a single account. Alts and multiboxing allow for the mitigation of risk and consequences to the point of irrelevance.

You have to look at people who've really learned how to exploit the wardec system, to see that there's a problem. For someone like me who only plays one account at a time, a solo wardec is in fact a risky endeavour. But I recently watched one guy and his band of alts rip through a bunch of cookie cutter PvE corps, inflicting billions in damage via kills on industrial ships with the clever use of innocuous-looking shell corporations, which he dropped his well known combat toons into at the last moment. There was no risk or challenge for him.
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#111 - 2015-10-31 15:15:10 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
I don't want to see a perfectly safe highsec. But when I see veteran players hiding behind CONCORD, paying a small fee for the privilege of using casual and clueless players as clay pigeons, I can't shake the feeling that something is wrong.

We keep hearing how dark and dangerous EVE is, but it is really only dark and dangerous when you play a single account. Alts and multiboxing allow for the mitigation of risk and consequences to the point of irrelevance.

You have to look at people who've really learned how to exploit the wardec system, to see that there's a problem. For someone like me who only plays one account at a time, a solo wardec is in fact a risky endeavour. But I recently watched one guy and his band of alts rip through a bunch of cookie cutter PvE corps, inflicting billions in damage via kills on industrial ships with the clever use of innocuous-looking shell corporations, which he dropped his well known combat toons into at the last moment. There was no risk or challenge for him.


Perhaps not, but I see that situation as the wardeccer IS the challenge for his targets. He is filling a position of content provider.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

ISD Buldath
#112 - 2015-10-31 21:22:45 UTC
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