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Dev blog: Reworking Capital Ships: And thus it begins!

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Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers
#181 - 2015-10-25 16:56:48 UTC
The Mach wrote:
CCP Masterplan wrote:
Rek Seven wrote:
"New rapid firing anti-sub-capital weapon batteries are specifically designed to fire at sub-capitals. However their damage will be considerably lower than current XL weapon systems (in the 1 to 2k DPS range on a Sieged Dreadnought)"

I assume that these will be replacing the current extra large guns... If so, isn't this is a massive nerf? In what situation would anyone field a dread, worth billions, to kill sub-caps if it only has the fire power of 2-3 battleships?

I'm looking at this from the perspective of a wormholer and it seems as though there will be no use for dreads outside of pos bashing and instead, I'll be forced to fly a carrier if I want to fly caps in a fight.

No, the new XL anti-subcap guns will be a second type of capital gun. The existing XL guns will still be around, but will be focused on anti-cap/structure damage application only.



Can you not evade this question in every post? And just answer it?


what part of "Focused on Anti-Cap/Structure damage" are you not reading. WATCH the vegas streams. READ the Blogs.

EVEN if you WEBBED and PAINTED a SUBCAP with the XL GUNS.. They wont do anything to a subcap. ONLY the high angle guns will. It's been clearly stated at Vegas and on the Blog. And in the above quote.
Necharo Rackham
The Red Circle Inc.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#182 - 2015-10-25 16:57:50 UTC
How are you phasing in these changes? Particularly how are you planning on introducing the changes so that there isn't a gap where a particularly capability (triage for instance) isn't available at all?
Mai Ling Ravencroft
Duragon Pioneer Group
#183 - 2015-10-25 17:02:00 UTC
I am concerned about the carriers, this is basically removing them from any PvE roles many carrier pilots use them for. Carriers are a significant source of income for many pilots. Many of whom use carriers for ratting so they can then afford to go out and PvP.

This seems to be a massive nerf in this area. Removing a carriers ability to field any of the basic drones and only able to use fighters, drastically hampers then in anoms where frigates take forever to target and nearly as long to kill. Using fighters in anoms is something that most carrier pilots hate, much less with them being more like ammo now rather than something that could be repaired if damaged.

So is CCP willing to either allow squadrons to auto aggress NPCs or will CCP be adding anoms which are more in line with capital class ships. I would honestly love to see both happen, but at least one of these options need to be allowed for capital pilots. Capital level anoms btw would be a really nice feature, as they would give dread, super and Titan pilots, something to do when not on the once in a blue moon fleets they are actually usable for.

While I understand the changes, and am not opposed to them, it does leave a hole in a major area of the game.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#184 - 2015-10-25 17:03:22 UTC
Mai Ling Ravencroft wrote:
I am concerned about the carriers, this is basically removing them from any PvE roles many carrier pilots use them for. Carriers are a significant source of income for many pilots. Many of whom use carriers for ratting so they can then afford to go out and PvP.

This seems to be a massive nerf in this area. Removing a carriers ability to field any of the basic drones and only able to use fighters, drastically hampers then in anoms where frigates take forever to target and nearly as long to kill. Using fighters in anoms is something that most carrier pilots hate, much less with them being more like ammo now rather than something that could be repaired if damaged.

So is CCP willing to either allow squadrons to auto aggress NPCs or will CCP be adding anoms which are more in line with capital class ships. I would honestly love to see both happen, but at least one of these options need to be allowed for capital pilots. Capital level anoms btw would be a really nice feature, as they would give dread, super and Titan pilots, something to do when not on the once in a blue moon fleets they are actually usable for.

While I understand the changes, and am not opposed to them, it does leave a hole in a major area of the game.


capitals were never meant to be able to do pve
Oskolda Eriker
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#185 - 2015-10-25 17:04:05 UTC
Captain StringfellowHawk wrote:

EVEN if you WEBBED and PAINTED a SUBCAP with the XL GUNS.. They wont do anything to a subcap. ONLY the high angle guns will. It's been clearly stated at Vegas and on the Blog. And in the above quote.

for what reason
How many dps have DREAD WITH NEW GUNS WITHOUT SIEGE?
To understand this 3x3 Large cannons
Garrett Howe
New Eden Shipbuilding
#186 - 2015-10-25 17:06:45 UTC
CCP, could you rebalance subcapital logistics ships in the same way as FAX machines? Removing the ability of repping logi to receive remote reps or cap would do a lot to encourage fights at the subcapital level as well.
Oskolda Eriker
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#187 - 2015-10-25 17:07:17 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:


capitals were never meant to be able to do pve

capitals escalation?
isnt it?
Garrett Howe
New Eden Shipbuilding
#188 - 2015-10-25 17:08:07 UTC
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
Captain StringfellowHawk wrote:

EVEN if you WEBBED and PAINTED a SUBCAP with the XL GUNS.. They wont do anything to a subcap. ONLY the high angle guns will. It's been clearly stated at Vegas and on the Blog. And in the above quote.

for what reason
How many dps have DREAD WITH NEW GUNS WITHOUT SIEGE?
To understand this 3x3 Large cannons

With the new guns, dreads without siege will have very limited dps. The 2-3k number for the new guns was in siege, I'm sure you can scale that back based on how siege improves current gun damage.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#189 - 2015-10-25 17:08:17 UTC
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:


capitals were never meant to be able to do pve

capitals escalation?
isnt it?


capital escalations were CCP's attempt at preventing people from using capitals. it didn't really work out.
SCom Thor
Let Me Beeeee
Muh Zkill...
#190 - 2015-10-25 17:08:59 UTC
Am I the only one around here who sees this as the final nerf of capital ships? With repping capability only under triage and ewar vulnerability, caps and supercaps will be quickly decimated by swarms of F1 monkeys with 5mil SPs each. Mentioning the n+1 rule there was a huge irony, while you also mentioned that enough subcaps will be able to ewar supercaps. GG SWARM

GG Mittani, really GG, you won it.

There's a high chance that there won't be a New Eden anymore by the time these changes will be ready, but for what it's worth you won EvE.
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#191 - 2015-10-25 17:09:02 UTC
The Mach wrote:

Can you not evade this question in every post? And just answer it?

he did answer it you idiot

dreads will have existing anti-cap guns or can use a new kind of anti-subcap gun
Oskolda Eriker
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#192 - 2015-10-25 17:09:07 UTC
Garrett Howe wrote:
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
Captain StringfellowHawk wrote:

EVEN if you WEBBED and PAINTED a SUBCAP with the XL GUNS.. They wont do anything to a subcap. ONLY the high angle guns will. It's been clearly stated at Vegas and on the Blog. And in the above quote.

for what reason
How many dps have DREAD WITH NEW GUNS WITHOUT SIEGE?
To understand this 3x3 Large cannons

With the new guns, dreads without siege will have very limited dps. The 2-3k number for the new guns was in siege, I'm sure you can scale that back based on how siege improves current gun damage.

200dps
Large cannonsX9
REALLY?
Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
#193 - 2015-10-25 17:10:15 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:


capitals were never meant to be able to do pve

Clearly false. The red boxes i shoot only spawn if i warp in capitals.

AKA the scientist.

Death and Glory!

Well fun is also good.
Garrett Howe
New Eden Shipbuilding
#194 - 2015-10-25 17:10:27 UTC
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
Garrett Howe wrote:
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
Captain StringfellowHawk wrote:

EVEN if you WEBBED and PAINTED a SUBCAP with the XL GUNS.. They wont do anything to a subcap. ONLY the high angle guns will. It's been clearly stated at Vegas and on the Blog. And in the above quote.

for what reason
How many dps have DREAD WITH NEW GUNS WITHOUT SIEGE?
To understand this 3x3 Large cannons

With the new guns, dreads without siege will have very limited dps. The 2-3k number for the new guns was in siege, I'm sure you can scale that back based on how siege improves current gun damage.

200dps
Large cannonsX9
REALLY?

That's what siege mode is for. If you want high subcap damage without siege, use a battleship.
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#195 - 2015-10-25 17:10:43 UTC
Mai Ling Ravencroft wrote:
I am concerned about the carriers, this is basically removing them from any PvE roles many carrier pilots use them for. Carriers are a significant source of income for many pilots. Many of whom use carriers for ratting so they can then afford to go out and PvP.

This seems to be a massive nerf in this area. Removing a carriers ability to field any of the basic drones and only able to use fighters, drastically hampers then in anoms where frigates take forever to target and nearly as long to kill. Using fighters in anoms is something that most carrier pilots hate, much less with them being more like ammo now rather than something that could be repaired if damaged.

new carrier fighters don't need target locks

read the blog before weeping over your lost ratting carriers
Oskolda Eriker
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#196 - 2015-10-25 17:14:55 UTC
Garrett Howe wrote:

That's what siege mode is for. If you want high subcap damage without siege, use a battleship.

you can answer the question? 9xlarge cannond doing less than destroer dps.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#197 - 2015-10-25 17:17:39 UTC
loquacious7 wrote:
Querns wrote:
loquacious7 wrote:
Querns wrote:
Carriers can take gates now.

I said I wanted to use the carrier and ships not watch them burn ;)

Do they not have scouts and webs where you live?

My old "suitcase" carrier did not need them. Was part of my point. Maybe I should gank miners and freighters in high sec to prove my point :)

Then the nerfs are working as intended. Suitcase carriers were a truculent cancer and Eve is truly better for their death. Consider putting down stakes, building something, and fighting for it instead of being the Eve equivalent of a vulture.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#198 - 2015-10-25 17:21:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Darek Castigatus
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
helana Tsero wrote:


Quit whinging and adapt.

From noname, ok


Quit whinging and adapt, or more helpfully get on the capital feedback thingy and tell CCP what you think is wrong and what you would suggest in its place, you knopw like theyve been asking people to do ever since they made the first broadcast.

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome
Garrett Howe
New Eden Shipbuilding
#199 - 2015-10-25 17:22:28 UTC
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
Garrett Howe wrote:

That's what siege mode is for. If you want high subcap damage without siege, use a battleship.

you can answer the question? 9xlarge cannond doing less than destroer dps.

Yes, what's hard to understand about that?
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#200 - 2015-10-25 17:26:17 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Oskolda Eriker wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:


capitals were never meant to be able to do pve

capitals escalation?
isnt it?


capital escalations were CCP's attempt at preventing people from using capitals. it didn't really work out.

Agreed -- it's time for CCP to admit their failure of design and remove all loot from capital-escalation-spawned rats.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.