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Notice: Investgation and Prize Item Freeze for Teams in ATXIII

First post First post
Author
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#81 - 2015-09-16 18:13:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Bad Bobby
Captain Thunk wrote:
Bad Bobby wrote:
No, that would just be where it escalated to a higher level of trolling.

Sounds rather like they've just pulled up the ladder behind them, doesn't it?

If you were a member of the Hydramel team I'd call that :backpeddling: Instead it's just bad spin.

Bad spin on what?

If it was a massive troll, then it was a massive troll and you are one of it's many victims.

If it wasn't a massive troll, then it's up to CCP to try to salvage what they can from the PR disaster that will follow.

I'd rather it be the former than the later, tbh.

Captain Thunk wrote:
When you kill off your multi-trillion annual income, that's pretty much guaranteed, it's very difficult, even if you were the offspring of Goebbels and the Iraqi Information minister, to spin this as something positive.

A successful troll on an internet spaceships forum is a successful troll on an internet spaceships forum. I don't see what spin that needs.

Captain Thunk wrote:
Did you name yourself Bad Bobby? or did CCP add the prefix once they saw you post?

I don't know what CCP thinks of my posting. Given the number of subscribers it's brought to the game, I suppose they can't hate it that much.
Selene Mikabosh
department of Long life
#82 - 2015-09-16 18:18:26 UTC
I really am struggling to see the problem here.

They were the two best teams it doesn't even matter. Seems like a bunch of jealous babies crying about it.

I am an outsider though this is just my perspective looking from outside in and these posts.
Captain Thunk
Explode. Now. Please.
Alliance. Now. Please.
#83 - 2015-09-16 18:33:06 UTC
Bad Bobby wrote:

Bad spin on what?

If it was a massive troll, then it was a massive troll and you are one of it's many victims.

If it wasn't a massive troll, then it's up to CCP to try to salvage what they can from the PR disaster that will follow.

I'd rather it be the former than the later, tbh.


I too want it to be the former, trolling themselves out of trillions of ISK with 1st and 2nd prizes year in, year out is hillarious.

Let's face the facts, Hydramel isn't just better than it's closest rivals, it's way better. I can't speak for teams like Nulli, but in the last 2 years in 7 matches, PL is 1-6 down to Hydramel - that's curbstompingly better than PL is.

So yeah, I don't call losing out on your ability to take 1st and 2nd places every year a ~massive troll~
Red Shirt Number-Four
Gildinous Vangaurd
The Initiative.
#84 - 2015-09-16 18:37:48 UTC
Valkin Mordirc wrote:

You should read homie.


Because GAWD knows, EVERYTHING you ever read on the Internet is TRUE and never needs to be questioned!
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#85 - 2015-09-16 18:43:28 UTC
Captain Thunk wrote:
I too want it to be the former, trolling themselves out of trillions of ISK with 1st and 2nd prizes year in, year out is hillarious.
Good, I was beginning to worry that you had lost your sense of humour.

Captain Thunk wrote:
Let's face the facts, Hydramel isn't just better than it's closest rivals, it's way better. I can't speak for teams like Nulli, but in the last 2 years in 7 matches, PL is 1-6 down to Hydramel - that's curbstompingly better than PL is.
Sure, I'd go along with that. Given those stats.

Captain Thunk wrote:
So yeah, I don't call losing out on your ability to take 1st and 2nd places every year a ~massive troll~
I'm not certain that's the way it would turn out, if this is a troll.

It really depends on how CCP react to the whole episode. That's where the real issue is: the unpredictable element that is CCP.
Midori Neko-chan
Doomheim
#86 - 2015-09-16 18:44:18 UTC
Pandemic (Sore) Losers best losers.
Captain Thunk
Explode. Now. Please.
Alliance. Now. Please.
#87 - 2015-09-16 18:52:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Thunk
Bad Bobby wrote:

I'm not certain that's the way it would turn out, if this is a troll.

It really depends on how CCP react to the whole episode. That's where the real issue is: the unpredictable element that is CCP.


Troll or not, it only works because there's plenty of scope for this to *maybe* have happened, which means CCP are almost certainly going to have to tighten up on collusion and team sharing rules because it jeopardises the integrity of the tournament.

Even if found not guilty, which in the absence of verifiable evidence is a certainty, CCP can't ignore the fact the rules do need to change and teams shouldn't enter multiple teams with which to take a greater share of AT prizes. It's not like the other teams can emulate Hydramel and also submit additional teams as it means spreading their players across many teams which weakens them, and as we've already established they already can't beat Hydramel at full strength.

So the days of taking 1st and 2nd places are over. 50 Ships instead of 75.

If it's a troll then it cost them at least 2.5 tril to do and that's best case scenario.
Lovey Dovey
Doomheim
#88 - 2015-09-16 18:54:08 UTC
Midori Neko-chan wrote:
Pandemic (Sore) Losers best losers.


PL have the most AT ships available from this tournament as a result of whats happening. I'm sure any soreness from taking 3rd is being addressed with the increased value in the ships they're selling.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#89 - 2015-09-16 19:00:57 UTC
Captain Thunk wrote:
Troll or not, it only works because there's plenty of scope for this to *maybe* have happened, which means CCP are almost certainly going to have to tighten up on collusion and team sharing rules because it jeopardises the integrity of the tournament.

I agree completely.

But CCP have been in many positions where all logic and sense dictates they should go one way and still they go the other.

Captain Thunk wrote:
Even if found not guilty, which in the absence of verifiable evidence is a certainty, CCP can't ignore the fact the rules do need to change

No argument there either. I also think it was only a matter of time before this occurred, if not this year then in the next few ATs it had to come to this, because of the poor ruleset CCP is currently using.

Captain Thunk wrote:
So the days of taking 1st and 2nd places are over. 50 Ships instead of 75.

I'm not sure that actually follows, but I can completely see why you think so.

Captain Thunk wrote:
If it's a troll then it cost them at least 2.5 tril to do and that's best case scenario.

That should make it particularly tough for people to top then.
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#90 - 2015-09-16 19:03:28 UTC
Selene Mikabosh wrote:
I really am struggling to see the problem here.


the problem is that we have a bunch of cheating scumbags here.
Cobat Marland
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#91 - 2015-09-16 19:06:13 UTC
Selene Mikabosh wrote:
I really am struggling to see the problem here.

They were the two best teams it doesn't even matter. Seems like a bunch of jealous babies crying about it.

I am an outsider though this is just my perspective looking from outside in and these posts.

Because they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#92 - 2015-09-16 19:08:17 UTC
Cobat Marland wrote:
they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.
No it isn't. If it was, this thread wouldn't exist.
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#93 - 2015-09-16 19:34:06 UTC
Bad Bobby wrote:
Cobat Marland wrote:
they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.
No it isn't. If it was, this thread wouldn't exist.


If you're not a hydra alt, you're rather daft.

If you ARE a hydra alt, then you're trying to justify ruining the tournament. How does it make you feel to be the bad guy?
umaya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#94 - 2015-09-16 21:01:06 UTC
ITT: people who don't know who bad bobby is.

Also ITT people who should separate the fact that they don't like certain rules vs what is actually being investigated.

The collusion rule isn't actually about how close teams work together, go read the thread, go read fozzies answers. The only thing under question is whether camel and hydra have fixed a match or not.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#95 - 2015-09-16 21:08:06 UTC
Cobat Marland wrote:
Selene Mikabosh wrote:
I really am struggling to see the problem here.

They were the two best teams it doesn't even matter. Seems like a bunch of jealous babies crying about it.

I am an outsider though this is just my perspective looking from outside in and these posts.

Because they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.



A and B team is fine, A and B team colluding on the outcome is where **** hits the fan
Captain Thunk
Explode. Now. Please.
Alliance. Now. Please.
#96 - 2015-09-16 21:09:30 UTC
umaya wrote:
ITT: people who don't know who bad bobby is.

Also ITT people who should separate the fact that they don't like certain rules vs what is actually being investigated.

The collusion rule isn't actually about how close teams work together, go read the thread, go read fozzies answers. The only thing under question is whether camel and hydra have fixed a match or not.


The point is you can't have two teams working closely together and not worry about collusion with fixed matches.

If you haven't learnt that yet then there's no hope for you.
Faife
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#97 - 2015-09-16 21:42:05 UTC
#BansOrRiot
Mr Rive
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#98 - 2015-09-16 22:10:53 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Cobat Marland wrote:
Selene Mikabosh wrote:
I really am struggling to see the problem here.

They were the two best teams it doesn't even matter. Seems like a bunch of jealous babies crying about it.

I am an outsider though this is just my perspective looking from outside in and these posts.

Because they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.



A and B team is fine, A and B team colluding on the outcome is where **** hits the fan


its not fine, its within the rules. That doesnt mean its a good rule, just that they cant exactly change the rules halfway through the tournament.

The rules should be changed after this, there is no justifying b teams now. There's a reason we didn't do it.
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#99 - 2015-09-16 22:23:14 UTC
Mr Rive wrote:
This is all daft. I dont care whether the accusations are true or not. It makes no difference to the tournament in the future. Everyone knows what went on. Everyone knows something unethical went on. What matters is the rules get changed for next year so all of this stupid behaviour and using the tournament as a profit machine gets blocked out. Someone or some people did something which damaged the tournament to make a quick buck. It doesnt matter what that thing is, what matters is they knew they were doing it, they knew it was wrong, and they didnt care about the consequences for the tournament. If there is proof, they need to be banned from ever participating again, because they have done it before and you bet your ass they will try and do it again, they dont care. If there is no concrete evidence for CCP to use, then the people resnponsible need to have it as difficult as possible for them to break the rules again.

If neither of these things happen, next year is going to be a farce, and there will be no point in continuing the alliance tournament at all. Instead of treating it as a bit of fun, and as a tool for prestige, you can bet more alliances will make the tournament into a profit machine, it will be part of their yearly income, just like moon mining used to be.

I do NOT want to be a part in a tournament where this is the case.


How quickly you have come to my side eh.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.

Hiply Rustic
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#100 - 2015-09-16 22:41:30 UTC
Mr Rive wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Cobat Marland wrote:
Selene Mikabosh wrote:
I really am struggling to see the problem here.

They were the two best teams it doesn't even matter. Seems like a bunch of jealous babies crying about it.

I am an outsider though this is just my perspective looking from outside in and these posts.

Because they had a 65% chance of finishing better than everyone else by running two teams, which is forbidden, to have A team and B team.



A and B team is fine, A and B team colluding on the outcome is where **** hits the fan


its not fine, its within the rules.


So A team from one alliance and B team from another enter the field (although working together, so same team really), A team opens fire as B team sits idly while their ships are destroyed...outcome predetermined by leaders of the two alliances...is within the rules? Or is it only perceived to be within the rules because it was made to seem like an actual fight sort of took place?

Ralph King-Griffin wrote: "Eve deliberately excludes the stupid and the weak willied." EvE: Only the strong-willied need apply.