EVE General Discussion

Didn't we have this thread already?

If you are worried about AFK cloakers, just go get a bigger pair of balls.

As to the judgement of all the problems with that sentence, we'll just have to wait and see.

So someone is going to be AFK uncloaked?

Where's the problem then?

So you tried to probe one guy for upwards of 10 hours? I've heard null is boring, but jeez.

Then again. Where is the problem with one guy bouncing around safes and the new sov mechanics?

To take your last sentence from your OP as the premise of your thread, and adding in your new example:

"This leaves one guy bouncing around safes as the only effective tool to decrease indices."

Sorry? What?

Reread my post. It identifies "problem" at the end.

Yes, I see your edit. And it's still wrong. Safe bouncing without cap is merely 2nd methods among countless methods that people are about to come up with, should the incentive arise (such as new sov). The 3rd I've observed is burning into nowhere with a cap stable fast boat. When you scan him down and warp in on him, he's already off the grid.

My point is, the new sov defense system needs work. It states its purpose as encourage both in-space activities and small gang roams to disrupt it, when instead it discourages both.

I don't want to nerf cloakie, or safe bouncing, or burning towards nowhere - it's a pointless whack-a-mole anyway. I want sov defense system tweaked so it does what it's stated to do. For example, kills decreasing indices (or increasing it, if kills by owner) would be a mechanic that works towards the stated goals. Encourage afkness, as it currently does, is the opposite of what it's intended to do.

That's not the only reason it doesn't work. The other reason is "I wonder who can make a whole freaking bunch of small gangs, oh that's right, the ALREADY BIG GUYS. Hashtag Malcanis'LAW4Real." The reasoning behind sov isn't bad, it's just that no amount of reasoning can defeat basic human nature.

The new Sov system will be cool in the beginning because it's new. Dominion was fun at 1st, so were Incursions. Then 15 seconds after launch people will figure things out and exploit the more than obvious flaws in the system and people will be wishing for the return of Dominion (in the same way as people realized that the pos based Sov pre-dominion "wasn't that bad in hindsight" LOL).

Every time I close my eyes I hear Battlestar Galactica music and some dude whispering "this has happened before, it will happen again"

For your information, I rat with 2 sentry Archons and a Rapier, in a system outside hotdrop range of anywhere nonblue. And yes, the archons are ehp fit, yes, they have more spare drones than China has rice, and yes, they have rrs, cap transfer, and neut. If roam tacklers wants to tackle 2 archons with a Rapier, they know where to find me. If I lose them, it's all good, I'll have some kms to show for it. No, I don't fit pimp, and yes, the Archons are insured.

Now that you know about me, you know it's not about me. People will continue to failfit, and just move to another system. Fact.

Now, reread my posts, and know it's about new sov, its stated purpose, and why it needs tweaking.



Ah yes, finally someone who's not trying to derail the thread.

Yeah, ppl will find ways to screw any system. I can just see PL breaking into hunting parties spreading out in Brave space, activating entosis links and coaxing "gud fites," aka fights where they win.

But short of abandoning any kind of sov, we might as well try, no? That's what this thread is all about.

Sorry if I wasn't being clear. The confusion has more to do with people assuming afk cloaking thread when it's not there.

Dev blog states the goal of new system is to encourage in space activity and "Engaging with and disrupting enemy activities with small gangs should slowly erode their strategic defenses."

What I'm pointing out with the new system is it discourages both "in-space activities" due to afk camping (in various forms) being the most effective way to decrease indices, and "small gang" roams, due to camped systems not having targets in space.

A possible solution I offered is Kill based indices - roam gets kills, decrease indices, owner kills roams, increase indices. I'm sure there are many loopholes in that. Feel free to point it out and discuss. Or post your own idea that works.

But don't get hanged up on "cloaking" or any other camping methods. Especially when it's imaginary - I never mentioned it to begin with. They're besides the point, and derails the real topic.

For the record, I don't care about afk cloaker in itself, what I care is the new sov mechanics apparently giving massive extra incentives to afk camp as the sole effective way to soften up a system in order to take sov. The only thing worse than sov mechanics mandating pos building/bashing is one that mandates afk camping - another kind of grind, afk camping grind - takes longer, and now afk to boot.

With human nature being what it is, people will be paranoid, they will continue failfit their ratting boats, and continue to go somewhere else when there's an afk camper. I don't, as you already noticed. I'm sure you don't either. But people will.

Afk camping was, is, and will always be the most effective way to decrease in-space activity that's tied into system defense of new sov mechanics. We can't change human nature, only sov mechanics.

I have no problems with POS bashing, but when Sov mechanics gets tied into it as a mandatory activity, it goes somewhere ugly. Afk camping in it's various/countless manifestations is the same. With human nature being what it is, afk camping will be the go-to tool for sov warfare.

Afk grind - the new kind of grind replacing ehp grind, but now afk.

All I'm saying is that afk-ness should not be tied into sov system. It's fine by itself, but not as part of sov. If nothing's done to tweak the new sov (afk camping is fine, as long as it's disconnected form sov), you'll be looking back years later and say "yeah, I remember sov warfare, first there was pos spamming, then there was ehp grinding, then there was afk camper spamming. We went from spamming, to grinding, to both spamming and grinding with a pitch of afkness."

I'm not looking to change afk camping (of any kind). I'm looking to tweak new sov mechanics so it's no longer tied to afk camper spamming. There is a difference.