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New Sov and "disrupting activities with small gang"

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Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2015-03-04 04:22:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Sibyyl
sabre906 wrote:

A possible solution I offered is Kill based indices - roam gets kills, decrease indices, owner kills roams, increase indices. I'm sure there are many loopholes in that. Feel free to point it out and discuss. Or post your own idea that works.


Can't fake NPC kills or mining, but you can sit there and rack up kill indices with alts. This is probably why this isn't a Kill Military Index contributor.



Edit: also wanted to respond to this.

Quote:
All I'm saying is that afk-ness should not be tied into sov system. It's fine by itself, but not as part of sov.


It isn't. Killing mining and ratting assets is more effective in that it attacks occupancy as well as destroys ISK. Groups who are intimidated by AFK cloakers will be seeing an uphill battle with occupancy. You may be right in that AFK cloaking may become the tactic de jour moreso than it is today (also because people are risk averse and don't want gudfites), but I fail to see why that's a bad thing.

If fear is crippling, then it costs you occupancy. Seems fine to me. If anything AFK cloaking becomes a 'boy who cried wolf' situation. At some point people may start ignoring AFK cloakers since the mechanic will be so overused. Isn't that a good thing?

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2015-03-04 04:28:41 UTC  |  Edited by: sabre906
Sibyyl wrote:
sabre906 wrote:

A possible solution I offered is Kill based indices - roam gets kills, decrease indices, owner kills roams, increase indices. I'm sure there are many loopholes in that. Feel free to point it out and discuss. Or post your own idea that works.


Can't fake NPC kills or mining, but you can sit there and rack up kill indices with alts. This is probably why this isn't a Kill Index contributor.



Indeed... Just throwing out ideas, gonna be full of loopholes. Feel free to suggest viable alternatives. That's what this thread is for.

Sibyyl wrote:


Quote:
All I'm saying is that afk-ness should not be tied into sov system. It's fine by itself, but not as part of sov.


It isn't. Killing mining and ratting assets is more effective in that it attacks occupancy as well as destroys ISK. Groups who are intimidated by AFK cloakers will be seeing an uphill battle with occupancy. You may be right in that AFK cloaking may become the tactic [i]de jour[/i moreso than it is today (also because people are risk averse and don't want gudfites), but I fail to see why that's a bad thing.

If fear is crippling, then it costs you occupancy. Seems fine to me. If anything this becomes a 'boy who cried wolf' situation. At some point people may start ignoring AFK cloakers since the mechanic will be so overused. Isn't that a good thing?


Like I said, human nature won't change, only sov mechanics. Afk camping is the easiest and most effective way to decrease indices, so it will be the go-to tool for sov warfare. A small roaming gang can only stall activities for maybe 5 minutes, then indices go back up, and they lose boats. No indices change in the long term. Afk camper works 23/7 (assuming human nature don't change meanwhile...), and is effectively risk free. Indices change in the long term.

If you want to take systems, you'll plant afk campers in each one for a few weeks, wait for indices to drop (and they will, like I said, human nature don't change). There you go, sov warfare moved from pos spamming, to ehp grinding, to afk spamming + grinding.

And yes, there exist people who aren't afraid of afk-campers, but they're not shooting k space rats. They're either in whs or pvping. If you depend on these people to grind your index from 0 to 1, your index will stay at 0. It's that simple.
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2015-03-04 04:29:59 UTC

Hey sabre, I wouldn't mind if you checked out my edit above and responded to the second part too. And thanks for the discussion.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#24 - 2015-03-04 04:38:35 UTC
sabre906 wrote:


But short of abandoning any kind of sov
The longer I play EVE the more that actually sounds like a good thing.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2015-03-04 04:43:21 UTC  |  Edited by: sabre906
Jenn aSide wrote:
sabre906 wrote:


But short of abandoning any kind of sov
The longer I play EVE the more that actually sounds like a good thing.


It's simpler back then, wasn't it?Smile

Sibyyl wrote:

Hey sabre, I wouldn't mind if you checked out my edit above and responded to the second part too. And thanks for the discussion.



Post edited.

Again, I know how people should behave regarding afk campers. But we can't deal with what should be, we deal with what is. I just don't want to see "afk spamming/grinding iteration of sov warfare," that's all. Sov warfare should be set up in a way that doesn't depend on afk camping to drop system defense.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#26 - 2015-03-04 04:46:28 UTC
Quote:

Forum rules

23. Post constructively.

Negative feedback can be very useful to further improve EVE Online provided that it is presented in a civil and factual manner. All users are encouraged to honestly express their feelings regarding EVE Online and how it can be improved. Posts that are non-constructive, insulting or in breach of the rules will be deleted regardless of how valid the ideas behind them may be. Users are also reminded that posting with a lack of content also constitutes non-constructive posting.


Closed.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
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