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Rorqual - I missed the fanfest stream.

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Oxide Ammar
#241 - 2014-10-09 10:57:42 UTC
Anyway it looks like they will let caps and rorqual to enter hi sec, so rorqual itself in hi sec will be big plus (even in its current state) to mining fleets .

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#242 - 2014-10-09 11:48:16 UTC
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Anyway it looks like they will let caps and rorqual to enter hi sec, so rorqual itself in hi sec will be big plus (even in its current state) to mining fleets .



For now, this isn't happening. They specifically said 'use gates, but not enter highsec'

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Oxide Ammar
#243 - 2014-10-09 12:09:01 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Anyway it looks like they will let caps and rorqual to enter hi sec, so rorqual itself in hi sec will be big plus (even in its current state) to mining fleets .



For now, this isn't happening. They specifically said 'use gates, but not enter highsec'


Yea I know this but when they say:

Quote:
As above, capital ships will be able to use stargates, but will for the time being they will still be barred from entering Highsec (that is a larger discussion that we would like to revisit in future).


That means what was considered as taboo to talk about it, can be now revised..in future discussion. may be after 2 patches or may be next year, no one knows.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Dia'Sarbator
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#244 - 2014-10-09 13:42:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Dia'Sarbator
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Anyway it looks like they will let caps and rorqual to enter hi sec, so rorqual itself in hi sec will be big plus (even in its current state) to mining fleets .



For now, this isn't happening. They specifically said 'use gates, but not enter highsec'


Yea I know this but when they say:

Quote:
As above, capital ships will be able to use stargates, but will for the time being they will still be barred from entering Highsec (that is a larger discussion that we would like to revisit in future).


That means what was considered as taboo to talk about it, can be now revised..in future discussion. may be after 2 patches or may be next year, no one knows.


maybe but that still doesn't mean they are living up to the promise they gave us earlier this year.

here is the quote from the Dev blog Reprocess all the Things!
Quote:

Also, we do know the Rorqual needs more love to be a more viable ship, and that is being looked into, but chances are this won’t make it in EVE’s summer expansion.


We are well past the summer expansions.... in fact we are really coming up on the end of the year. I think we are owed some explanations and feedback in regards to our beloved Roqual...
Janeway84
Insane's Asylum
#245 - 2014-10-16 09:58:03 UTC
Im not a regular miner but i done a little bit of everything and I would fully support if CCP turned rorqual into a capital exhumer, mobile refining ship or moon mining ship Smile
hell throw in some ice mining bonuses too and it should win over the industrialist players and make them flock to null and lowsec Smile

I think rorqual needs something more than shiny fleet boosting ship with rr and drone bonuses even though those bonuses used to be nice in the past.
The rorqual cost compared to usefullness isnt making it popular for miners.
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#246 - 2014-10-17 23:06:19 UTC
Not sure what to say... Rorqual does seem redundant. POS's can refine compress, can be moved, are invulnerable when reinforced, a fraction of the cost and training to anchor. You also don't have to have a dedicated trained alt sit in one all the time its in space.
Orca is the same, can buff, can move, is vulnerable, but can escape to high sec and work there. Is a fourth the cost, and doesn't take fuel.
I don't know what to say because the clone bay is marginally useful, you are stuck in deploy mode and can't move. Buffs can't be used at the same time from what I understand.
You would get the feeling a mining barge under threat would be trying to get back to a rorqual as quick as it could for safety, but the rorquals are more targets than anything.
I am stumped CCP, I don't know what you have planned for the mining flag ship, but it had better be good. I try and guess and can't. High sec is a no no, cuz all the noobery will be mad at the giant sucking machine that shows up in system. If you buff its EHP it means nothing. If you make it like a hybrid outpost, combaty types will be crying if they can't gank it...

Surprise me.... Impress me...

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Ms Forum Alt
Doomheim
#247 - 2014-10-21 23:24:55 UTC
Janeway84 wrote:
The rorqual cost compared to usefullness isnt making it popular for miners.


Dishing out a max bonus system-wide to whomever joins your fleet is very useful indeed. It's also useful for mobile compression if the POS you're using (you're always in a POS when you're boosting, no question) isn't yours and you can't use its facilities, which is also quite common. Sov holders will often put up poses for +5/+10 general use as a safe spot.
Gorr Shakor
Shakor Freight and Mining Service
#248 - 2014-10-22 05:57:13 UTC
Rio Bravo wrote:
...cuz all the noobery will be mad at the giant sucking machine that shows up in system.

+1 for this bit aloneBig smile

Rio Bravo wrote:
Surprise me.... Impress me...

This.

But I have to say I quite like my POS Deloyqual.
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#249 - 2014-10-24 11:33:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Rio Bravo
Thought I would check in during downtime...

Will take some kind of temporary invulnerability, of one form or another. Modify an old mechanic or create a new dynamic one for the Rorqual, seemed to me the best option. If you wanted us to 'Fly' it to belt, right now it needs a huge escort to survive. I know they are space foundries, I also know that if you give it anything, somehow it will be used for bloodshed.

Seen a Rorqual escorted through null as a booster/logi for a war party, in some local space I was in once. Tried to scoop a tower or an outpost egg, can't remember exactly, heard it over intel...

They are off-shore oil rigs...with fleet multipliers and refining capabilities, essentially mobile stations. Still breaks my brain wondering how you will pull this off with just under two weeks left until the next patch. Guess it boils down to who you will make happy and who you will disappoint.

I am ionized with anticipation...

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Jason Xado
Doomheim
#250 - 2014-10-24 11:59:23 UTC
I haven't had a chance to read all the posts here yet so forgive me if I am repeating.

For me it comes down to a business decision. The reason I will risk a barge in a null sec belt is because I know I will most likely make back the value of the barge and then some before it eventually gets exploded by 10 black ops battleships. Therefore it is worth it to me to risk the barge. If I couldn't make back the value of the barge and some profit, then there would be no reason at all for me to put the barge in the belt.

The same would hold true for the Rorqual. At least for me anyway. If I feel reasonably assured that before that Rorqual eventually gets destroyed that I have a reasonable chance of making back it's value and some profit besides, then yes I would put it in the belt.

Anyway, my two cents on the matter. Not sure how that would be achieved, that would be up to the game designers :-)

P.S. The Rorqual having some sort of reinforced mode really intrigues me.
Aurelius Valentius
Valentius Corporation
Valentius Corporation Alliance
#251 - 2014-10-27 16:20:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Aurelius Valentius
What I want to know about mining in EVE:

Why must the miners, the ships and all that go around un-armed? what logic brought this out anyway... in reality, anyone that goes out into a hostile area looking for valuable items takes guns, weapons, etc... I can see the point in Navy ships not being Merchant ships in RL... but hey it's not always been the case, in the age of sail, often the ships did both concurrently... the Venetian Galley was both a warship and a merchant... and they could build one a day using mass production, and that republic ruled the seas and trade for hundreds of years...

So, since we have refitting in this game how about this:

Allow ORE some teeth, let us put turrets on these ships, and fighters in the bays... here is the balance, when your not tanked up and gunned up, you can mine because your a squishy miner, when you're gunned up and tanked up and dishing out some pain, you can't mine because of a lack of mining lasers... see that is called balance.

Sitting in a belt with a jar of lube and some piddley drones is about as balanced for GF as, well I won't take us there, but you get the idea.

I personally think the "Big R" should be a miner fighter carrier command ship for a system, both being a combat control ship, booster and core processor carrier that moves... not some ore and shine piñata.

*The space control ship was a type of starship that combined aspects of the command cruiser and carrier.- just FYI*
Milla Goodpussy
Garoun Investment Bank
#252 - 2014-10-27 16:34:39 UTC
Rio Bravo wrote:
Thought I would check in during downtime...

Will take some kind of temporary invulnerability, of one form or another. Modify an old mechanic or create a new dynamic one for the Rorqual, seemed to me the best option. If you wanted us to 'Fly' it to belt, right now it needs a huge escort to survive. I know they are space foundries, I also know that if you give it anything, somehow it will be used for bloodshed.

Seen a Rorqual escorted through null as a booster/logi for a war party, in some local space I was in once. Tried to scoop a tower or an outpost egg, can't remember exactly, heard it over intel...

They are off-shore oil rigs...with fleet multipliers and refining capabilities, essentially mobile stations. Still breaks my brain wondering how you will pull this off with just under two weeks left until the next patch. Guess it boils down to who you will make happy and who you will disappoint.

I am ionized with anticipation...



they plan not to do anything to the rorqual besides adding in jump fatigue and limiting her jump range for phoebe. so stretch that countdown clock cause her rebalance is far off just due to them knowing already how much they've gimped her. they've done a great job at knocking the capital industrial ship down off its pedestal. what could ccp give this ship that cost 2 billion? 1st comment from a dev was "you would want this thing in a field".. knowing darn well some alliances wouldn't even allow that! ( I know several that will out right ban someone and kick them out if they caught a pilot fielding a freakin rorq in a field.. YOU should know this as well).. yet the extremely detached dev's think folks buy a rorqual for its tractor beam...lol

ccp broke the ship and cant fix it, they don't know what to do with it, they've really pushed themselves into a corner its going to take CCP Seagull to figure this one out.. cause it would mean.. savior of the rorqual .. or FIRESALE of rorquals cause they'll become worthless and the risk is just too high to place it in a friggin field!
mup Deninard
mupcorp
#253 - 2014-10-27 17:17:16 UTC
like i said in another post, as ccp will not allow it into hisec because the nullbears don't like to share and ccp want to encourage ppl out of hisec then the best way to fix it is to put the last bullet in its head and kill it. give low and null booster arrays. problem solved. refund sp and isk. frees up a pilot to mine or whatever.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#254 - 2014-10-27 18:49:49 UTC
Lucky Sliver wrote:
Idk if this has been suggested already,

Just make it cheaper to produce. If it wasn't 2.5B pilots wouldn't be as concerned with losing it:

Bump it down to a Battleship class vessel. Keep the siege mode and have it function similar to a Marauder. Less expensive, more mobile, easier to pilot, access to highsec.


1. cheaper sure, BS cheaper no way.

2. Highsec access i would love personally but is this good for the game; would the Rorq tend to overshadow the existence of the Orca?

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#255 - 2014-10-27 19:06:38 UTC
Iosue wrote:
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:
Say for example a Skiff could be fit with a very respectable PVP fit. Not better than a ship designed for it, but enough to make gankers stop and think, is this miner worth my time?, possibly a PVP fit ship, it could just be a trap? Or even give it both, maybe allow strip miners to target other ships,do damage, or tackle, perhaps disabling their warp drive, or preventing capitals from jumping. Something to add combat utility.


what you describe only works in hi-sec during ganking situations. any procurer mining in null when reds or neuts come in is going to die quickly. maybe a little slower with their larger tank, but they're not going to fend off their attackers by themselves. their ability to fit even a respectable PVP tank won't have the slightest effect on those looking for *gud fights* in low or null sec.


I disagree. I will speak for myself only on this point, if you have a fleet of miners in low mining and they can fight back reasonable but not equivalent to actual combat ships then the lone wolf prowling for easy kills goes out the window and now it requires what it should, coordinated effort by a significant fleet of combat ships. Field a small fleet of combat ships and you get the killmails, try and come at them with just a couple ships and go down in burning stupidity.

CCP constantly promotes the mantra risk vs reward but defenseless mining vessels in lowsec have a low reward for a huge risk and CCP seems content to leave it as such (you can extend this same idea to hauling vessels, exploration vessels, etc).

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#256 - 2014-10-28 04:11:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Iosue wrote:
what you describe only works in hi-sec during ganking situations. any procurer mining in null when reds or neuts come in is going to die quickly. maybe a little slower with their larger tank, but they're not going to fend off their attackers by themselves. their ability to fit even a respectable PVP tank won't have the slightest effect on those looking for *gud fights* in low or null sec.

I agree not by themselves, but a Skiff fleet with Geckos can be formidable.

Example: https://zkillboard.com/kill/40213421/
Milla Goodpussy
Garoun Investment Bank
#257 - 2014-10-28 07:47:05 UTC
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Iosue wrote:
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:
Say for example a Skiff could be fit with a very respectable PVP fit. Not better than a ship designed for it, but enough to make gankers stop and think, is this miner worth my time?, possibly a PVP fit ship, it could just be a trap? Or even give it both, maybe allow strip miners to target other ships,do damage, or tackle, perhaps disabling their warp drive, or preventing capitals from jumping. Something to add combat utility.


what you describe only works in hi-sec during ganking situations. any procurer mining in null when reds or neuts come in is going to die quickly. maybe a little slower with their larger tank, but they're not going to fend off their attackers by themselves. their ability to fit even a respectable PVP tank won't have the slightest effect on those looking for *gud fights* in low or null sec.


I disagree. I will speak for myself only on this point, if you have a fleet of miners in low mining and they can fight back reasonable but not equivalent to actual combat ships then the lone wolf prowling for easy kills goes out the window and now it requires what it should, coordinated effort by a significant fleet of combat ships. Field a small fleet of combat ships and you get the killmails, try and come at them with just a couple ships and go down in burning stupidity.

CCP constantly promotes the mantra risk vs reward but defenseless mining vessels in lowsec have a low reward for a huge risk and CCP seems content to leave it as such (you can extend this same idea to hauling vessels, exploration vessels, etc).



this isn't about some darn skiff's or procurers.. this is about a friggin CAPITAL SHIP.. the INDUSTRIAL CAPITAL SHIP!.. there is no comparison of it to smaller ships cause it is not a SMALL GOD DARN SHIP!.. you will NOT see Fleets of Rorq's on friggin roams or even trying to fight in a PVP type setting.. that's not what the hell its meant for!.. good grief for fawks sake.. that's why ccp is stuck on this one cause it never fails how someone throws up a comparison as if some idiot would be totally into taking a rorqual...now with limited jump capability as of next Tuesday out to say.. umm..kill a friggin NYX!!!...

Ccp uses that risk vs reward as a cop out.. cause if they understood it.. then we would not have to deal with cloaky campers!.. and until they nerf that son of a beeeeeeeeeeeeeeyotch!.. when they claim it.. its all a friggin joke! and they know it!
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#258 - 2014-10-28 16:10:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Rio Bravo
Rorquals are really not worth the cost to individual pilot or micro corp. Was in a discussion with an ally about the compression last night. The station we are in is maxed for reprocessing, and so why would he compress ore and ship it anywhere else? I wasn't satisfied with his answer of, "I fill my hold with compressed ore, then bring it to station" as if running it directly to the refiners was an inconvenience.
Perhaps for a very large corp or alliance owning one is cost effective, for boosts or compression. As a wormhole machine it works most effectively with the clone vat bay. Personally, unless CCP does something revolutionary with the hull, giving it a niche that other ships or POS modules can't fill, and useful enough to be worth training, owning, and actually flying....I will sell this giant scrap heap.
It is almost worthless, given the costs/time/risk involved. If it could refine better than station...+1. If it could reinforce under attack, and not lose utility...+1. If it could bridge a fleet...+1. There is for all its functions, a ship, a module, a station, or deployable that can do a job it can't , or do a job it can do better than a Rorqual. Rorquals will retreat into Wormholes, the rest becoming hangar curios or just miner status symbols. I have lost confidence in CCP wanting to save the Industrial Capital. Unless something is done...like warp scramble/disruption immunity...

RIP Rorquals!

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
GsyBoy
Doomheim
#259 - 2015-01-21 13:33:16 UTC
Still do not wish to take a Rorqual into a belt (or use it for other reasons :-) ), are we still waiting for the change that is going to convince us? This has me intrigued I will admit.

https://www.twitch.tv/gsyboy
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#260 - 2015-01-21 18:52:39 UTC
GsyBoy wrote:
Still do not wish to take a Rorqual into a belt (or use it for other reasons :-) ), are we still waiting for the change that is going to convince us? This has me intrigued I will admit.

Fozzie et al. are too busy with T3 destroyers.