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Dev blog: Coming to EVE Online in the Phoebe release on November 4th

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Colonel Selene
Kesukka
#201 - 2014-10-12 03:25:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Colonel Selene
double post

Grrr.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#202 - 2014-10-12 03:26:15 UTC
Aeon Ecko wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
It's interesting, but I don't necessary -like- it. It's very candy crush / farmville. Still, you can already do something similar: if you have that kind of ISK you can buy a character from character bazaar, with skills already trained.


Fair enough. That is assuming those have it. Not saying they will not but have to think outside box like for new players or etc.

oh dude. your version of it is totally broken.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Colonel Selene
Kesukka
#203 - 2014-10-12 03:26:21 UTC
Aeon Ecko wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
It's interesting, but I don't necessary -like- it. It's very candy crush / farmville. Still, you can already do something similar: if you have that kind of ISK you can buy a character from character bazaar, with skills already trained.


Fair enough. That is assuming those have it. Not saying they will not but have to think outside box like for new players or etc.


CCP tried plex for remap and that only lasted for a few days on the test server. I cant imagine the backlash on this as it would be totally pay to win if plex was involved.

Grrr.
Kaaeliaa
Tyrannos Sunset
#204 - 2014-10-12 03:29:51 UTC
Food for thought: If everyone you meet is "closed-minded," your idea just might be stupid.

"Do not lift the veil. Do not show the door. Do not split the dream."
Aeon Ecko
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#205 - 2014-10-12 03:30:30 UTC
Colonel Selene wrote:
Aeon Ecko wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
It's interesting, but I don't necessary -like- it. It's very candy crush / farmville. Still, you can already do something similar: if you have that kind of ISK you can buy a character from character bazaar, with skills already trained.


Fair enough. That is assuming those have it. Not saying they will not but have to think outside box like for new players or etc.


CCP tried plex for remap and that only lasted for a few days on the test server. I cant imagine the backlash on this as it would be totally pay to win if plex was involved.


Fair enough. like i said it would just thinking out loud. I come in peace some will love it some will hate it. I mean no harm just trying.
Aeon Ecko
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#206 - 2014-10-12 03:34:07 UTC
Kaaeliaa wrote:
Food for thought: If everyone you meet is "closed-minded," your idea just might be stupid.


Did not say you were i said do not be one think outside. I made just a innocent idea and now i am being scrutinized. Do not be over zealous your reading to hard into what was said relax i meant no harm. If you think i think everybody i met is closed minded than that is poor judgement i do not. Are we cool? not here to throw stone just here to build.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#207 - 2014-10-12 04:28:54 UTC
and just as fast as it appeared, the forum flash mob vanished, leaving the thread silent once again.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#208 - 2014-10-12 04:44:30 UTC
Aeon Ecko wrote:
Kaaeliaa wrote:
Food for thought: If everyone you meet is "closed-minded," your idea just might be stupid.

Did not say you were i said do not be one think outside. I made just a innocent idea and now i am being scrutinized. Do not be over zealous your reading to hard into what was said relax i meant no harm. If you think i think everybody i met is closed minded than that is poor judgement i do not. Are we cool? not here to throw stone just here to build.

Aeon, you are being trolled.

Forum trolling is a common activity for certain EVE players. The trolls fall into two distinct classes:

1) The incompetents, who troll because they are not very good at in-game PVP (nor any other in-game activity, tbh) and need to do something publicly obnoxious to feel like they are part of the EVE community; and

2) The lobbyists, who troll with the goal of aggravating players who suggest ideas to CCP which are contrary to their own agendas for the game's future development. They hope to (a) make your idea look stupid to CCP, and (b) annoy you to the point where you will quit posting.

In either case, just ignore them and keep posting your ideas.
Aeon Ecko
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#209 - 2014-10-12 04:47:03 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Aeon Ecko wrote:
Kaaeliaa wrote:
Food for thought: If everyone you meet is "closed-minded," your idea just might be stupid.

Did not say you were i said do not be one think outside. I made just a innocent idea and now i am being scrutinized. Do not be over zealous your reading to hard into what was said relax i meant no harm. If you think i think everybody i met is closed minded than that is poor judgement i do not. Are we cool? not here to throw stone just here to build.

Aeon, you are being trolled.

Forum trolling is a common activity for certain EVE players. The trolls fall into two distinct classes:

1) The incompetents, who troll because they are not very good at in-game PVP (nor any other in-game activity, tbh) and need to do something publicly obnoxious to feel like they are part of the EVE community; and

2) The lobbyists, who troll with the goal of aggravating players who suggest ideas to CCP which are contrary to their own agendas for the game's future development. They hope to (a) make your idea look stupid to CCP, and (b) annoy you to the point where you will quit posting.

In either case, just ignore them and keep posting your ideas.


Thank you bruh. Man hats off to you. I meant no harm at all. Internet gangsters got to love em.
Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
#210 - 2014-10-12 08:05:38 UTC
CCP......

How about finishing the Tooltip fiasco as promised here:

"As the in-space brackets are a completely different feature to tooltips per se, we have been concentrating initially on improving this key part of the UI. Now that this has been done, we will look at improving the experience with tooltips in later releases. In that regard we are looking at configuring tooltip behavior by category, which we think would allow for you to tune how tooltips display based on the relevance of the information to you.

Team Pirate Unicorns"


This was 3 months ago, and nothing posted about it as yet......


Or is it true to past form and just an empty promise to keep people happy while it slowly slides into a black hole never to be seen again ?
Dwissi
Miners Delight Reborn
#211 - 2014-10-12 10:01:02 UTC
I love the unlimited skill queue - even if i don't understand that you never had the idea to offer that as a one-time-payment service to us. I would have been all for that (gets ready for the incoming hate wave)

But please - i agree with others: No more extra lights pretty please. It has become a real annoyance actually when your windows are pinned and opaque requiring constant adjustment now.

Proud designer of glasses for geeky dovakins

Before someone complains again: grr everyone

Greed is the death of loyalty
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#212 - 2014-10-12 10:34:57 UTC
It should be obvious at this point that players who have an opinion about brighter nebulas oppose them, and some would rather like a darker background for their interface. Being a bittervet, I know that the change will go through, as with everything the Art Deparment gets OK'ed, and players/customers be damned, but at least we said what we oppose and why, so now the ball is on CCP.

It just is tiresome that each time some bloody artist comes up with some bright idea, CCP can't say "no hell no, that would be bad for our customers" and we're reduced to helplessly complain about CCP's artwork hurting our eyes and making our game more difficult to play without an opt-out.

It is so, so tiresome... Cry
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#213 - 2014-10-12 11:43:25 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
It should be obvious at this point that players who have an opinion about brighter nebulas oppose them, and some would rather like a darker background for their interface. Being a bittervet, I know that the change will go through, as with everything the Art Deparment gets OK'ed, and players/customers be damned, but at least we said what we oppose and why, so now the ball is on CCP.

It just is tiresome that each time some bloody artist comes up with some bright idea, CCP can't say "no hell no, that would be bad for our customers" and we're reduced to helplessly complain about CCP's artwork hurting our eyes and making our game more difficult to play without an opt-out.

It is so, so tiresome... Cry


Bad interactions between gameplay/UI and art are a concern, and the graphics QA team do look at all art changes with this in mind. However, they're not going to catch everything you might encounter in-game, because not everyone uses their UI the same way, and so it really does help if you report any serious frustrations you encounter in this area.

The best way to do this reporting is through the Bug Reporting tool, which you can get to by hitting F12 and clicking on the button there.

The best bug reports on this type of issue illustrate the problem with a screenshot, because you may be encountering specific combinations of artwork and UI arrangement that don't occur to the QA analyst even after reading your report. Be as specific and visual as possible -- saying "The new nebulas suck because I can't see UI element" may not be enough information to identify exactly what you're experiencing. Also, it's possible that new graphics or the UI render differently on your machine from others, so a picture can help identify that.

As far as the change to make nebulas brighter: That wasn't simply a change for the look of open space. Nebula brightness also interacts with in-game lighting, and various changes to ship lighting and rendering in our engine benefit from the change as well. If there were unanticipated impacts on gameplay, though, we'd like to hear about it through the bug report system.

I personally am interested in improving our response to feedback on this type of issue, so please keep offering the feedback, here for the minor irritations and in bug reports for the major roadblocks.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins
Miriya Zakalwe
World Wide Welp
#214 - 2014-10-12 12:16:22 UTC
How about a separate option to disable the nebulas entirely? Or does that exist?
Horus V
The Destined
#215 - 2014-10-12 13:55:29 UTC
Any chance to see background stars look a bit sharper in the near future?

V
ForceM
POS Builder Inc.
#216 - 2014-10-12 15:45:04 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
It should be obvious at this point that players who have an opinion about brighter nebulas oppose them, and some would rather like a darker background for their interface. Being a bittervet, I know that the change will go through, as with everything the Art Deparment gets OK'ed, and players/customers be damned, but at least we said what we oppose and why, so now the ball is on CCP.

It just is tiresome that each time some bloody artist comes up with some bright idea, CCP can't say "no hell no, that would be bad for our customers" and we're reduced to helplessly complain about CCP's artwork hurting our eyes and making our game more difficult to play without an opt-out.

It is so, so tiresome... Cry


Bad interactions between gameplay/UI and art are a concern, and the graphics QA team do look at all art changes with this in mind. However, they're not going to catch everything you might encounter in-game, because not everyone uses their UI the same way, and so it really does help if you report any serious frustrations you encounter in this area.

The best way to do this reporting is through the Bug Reporting tool, which you can get to by hitting F12 and clicking on the button there.

The best bug reports on this type of issue illustrate the problem with a screenshot, because you may be encountering specific combinations of artwork and UI arrangement that don't occur to the QA analyst even after reading your report. Be as specific and visual as possible -- saying "The new nebulas suck because I can't see UI element" may not be enough information to identify exactly what you're experiencing. Also, it's possible that new graphics or the UI render differently on your machine from others, so a picture can help identify that.

As far as the change to make nebulas brighter: That wasn't simply a change for the look of open space. Nebula brightness also interacts with in-game lighting, and various changes to ship lighting and rendering in our engine benefit from the change as well. If there were unanticipated impacts on gameplay, though, we'd like to hear about it through the bug report system.

I personally am interested in improving our response to feedback on this type of issue, so please keep offering the feedback, here for the minor irritations and in bug reports for the major roadblocks.


The problem with this is exactly what Indahmawar Fazmarai is saying ...
You will put this change through and THEN we can complain about it.

At this moment were saying it is ALREADY to bright and you want to make it brighter.

Its like the goverment ... "yes sir we made a mistake ... this fine is completely wrong ... so pay the fine so we can pay you back."

Seriously ... come on.
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#217 - 2014-10-12 16:02:26 UTC
ForceM wrote:
The problem with this is exactly what Indahmawar Fazmarai is saying ...
You will put this change through and THEN we can complain about it.


As I said, our QA team does look at changes with gameplay impact in mind before a change ever gets released. You may have a problem they didn't see, though. Thousands of players can catch problems that a small QA team will miss, and that's why we have a system for reporting those issues.

Also, please understand that art/gameplay interactions are almost always subjective and depend on your graphics settings, your monitor, and so on. This is why submitting a screenshot is so important.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins
Mharius Skjem
Guardians of the Underworld
#218 - 2014-10-12 16:20:48 UTC
After all of these years of playing (been here since 2008) and being mindful of the difficult post incarnate period I can honestly say that finally it feels like Eve is moving in the right direction at long last and that good things are not only coming but they keep on coming.

Well done to the Devs!

A recovering btter vet,  with a fresh toon and a determination to like everything that CCP does to Eve...

Don't take me too seriously though, I like to tease a bit on the forums, but that's only because I love you...
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#219 - 2014-10-12 17:04:06 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
It should be obvious at this point that players who have an opinion about brighter nebulas oppose them, and some would rather like a darker background for their interface. Being a bittervet, I know that the change will go through, as with everything the Art Deparment gets OK'ed, and players/customers be damned, but at least we said what we oppose and why, so now the ball is on CCP.

It just is tiresome that each time some bloody artist comes up with some bright idea, CCP can't say "no hell no, that would be bad for our customers" and we're reduced to helplessly complain about CCP's artwork hurting our eyes and making our game more difficult to play without an opt-out.

It is so, so tiresome... Cry


Bad interactions between gameplay/UI and art are a concern, and the graphics QA team do look at all art changes with this in mind. However, they're not going to catch everything you might encounter in-game, because not everyone uses their UI the same way, and so it really does help if you report any serious frustrations you encounter in this area.

The best way to do this reporting is through the Bug Reporting tool, which you can get to by hitting F12 and clicking on the button there.

The best bug reports on this type of issue illustrate the problem with a screenshot, because you may be encountering specific combinations of artwork and UI arrangement that don't occur to the QA analyst even after reading your report. Be as specific and visual as possible -- saying "The new nebulas suck because I can't see UI element" may not be enough information to identify exactly what you're experiencing. Also, it's possible that new graphics or the UI render differently on your machine from others, so a picture can help identify that.

As far as the change to make nebulas brighter: That wasn't simply a change for the look of open space. Nebula brightness also interacts with in-game lighting, and various changes to ship lighting and rendering in our engine benefit from the change as well. If there were unanticipated impacts on gameplay, though, we'd like to hear about it through the bug report system.

I personally am interested in improving our response to feedback on this type of issue, so please keep offering the feedback, here for the minor irritations and in bug reports for the major roadblocks.


But... it's not a bug. It's just that the nebulae are too bright and wash out the interface:

Image 1

Sun flare and nebula; status bars for targets and their name are unreadable.

Image 2

Sun flare and nebula; H/A/S arches barely readable, status of module cycle can't be seen

Image 3

No flare, only the nebula; status bars for targets can be seen with difficulty, target names are barely readable.

Image 4

No flare, only the nebula; H/A/S aches readable, status of module cycle barely can be seen

And this is just the nebula at The Forge, which is not a specially bright one, compared to Amarran space.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#220 - 2014-10-12 17:13:15 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
ForceM wrote:
The problem with this is exactly what Indahmawar Fazmarai is saying ...
You will put this change through and THEN we can complain about it.


As I said, our QA team does look at changes with gameplay impact in mind before a change ever gets released. You may have a problem they didn't see, though. Thousands of players can catch problems that a small QA team will miss, and that's why we have a system for reporting those issues.

Also, please understand that art/gameplay interactions are almost always subjective and depend on your graphics settings, your monitor, and so on. This is why submitting a screenshot is so important.


Yes, and as they are subjective, you should allow the players to trim what they see in their game and their computer. How about the ability to tune the gamma of nebulae during their rendering at the client? That way all the objects would get the appropiate lighting but the nebuale themselves could be rendered at a gamma setting that suited to the player's needs and circumstances.