These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
John Selth
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#5101 - 2014-10-03 08:47:54 UTC
Big Lynx wrote:
Those huge streams of tears prove that the changes are undoubtful the right way. congrats CCP!

Guess now we cant APEX Force your corps Aeon... Oh wait
Ninteen Seventy-Nine
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#5102 - 2014-10-03 08:53:14 UTC
Innominate wrote:

The jump freighter nerfs hurt _everyone_ who is trying to get by in nullsec, not just the established powers, and it's the smaller groups who suffer the most.


The only people it's going to hurt are people that can't adapt.

What about all the people it's going to help?
People who's gameplay might not revolve around any of the crap you're so concerned trolling about?

"The unending paradox is that we do learn through pain."
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#5103 - 2014-10-03 08:54:07 UTC
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
baltec1 wrote:

Go look at the income you get from a tower before saying these things, it will stop you from looking stupid.


No, please. After you, I insist.

Enlighten us. Show me the errors of my ways.

Tell us how much one makes in a month and how utterly miniscule that amount is when stacked alongside moons ALL ACROSS THE GODAM GAME

I'm sure it's insignificant.


Because there is only one guy who mines in EVE.
The Ironfist
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5104 - 2014-10-03 08:54:44 UTC
CCP Greyscale have you and your team concidered giving JF's and Rorquals the same range Blackops enjoy? (Current titan range 7,85ly)

It would at least solve the problem of logistics unable to make regional divides in the south and North-East. (Not sure how many other divides there are that can not be made with 5ly)
Optimo Sebiestor
The New Eden School of trade
Organization of Skill Extracting Corporations
#5105 - 2014-10-03 08:55:03 UTC
Theres no logistical problem tied to t2 Production imo. Yes there will be a settling period where moons change hands due to certain parties no longer beeing able to protect their moons spread over half the map. But in general far to Reach Places will be using wormholes as their using them now to traffic t2 Products to highsec. Because, jumping something 1-2 jumps thrugh a wormhole is far easier than jumping something 3-4 times in a jf, far cheaper too.
Igor Nappi
Doomheim
#5106 - 2014-10-03 08:55:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Igor Nappi
Innominate wrote:

Jumpbridges are essentially removed, rather than preventing their use for crossing the galaxy, it prevents their use even for intraregion travel. This appears to be a change intentionally backdoored under the guise of stopping "long distance" travel. Jump bridges are one of the few real advantages of owning space.

Current jump bridges are hilariously overpowered and desperately need the nerf.

Edit: I'm bad at quoting.

Furthermore, I think that links must be removed from the game.
Hilti Enaka
Space Wolves ind.
Solyaris Chtonium
#5107 - 2014-10-03 08:58:44 UTC
Just received this:

Quote:
Caps
From: xxxxx
To: xxxxx
Dear alliance members

In light of the proposed changes to capital deployment, we have at leadership level decided to focus our activities on capital manufacturing for the next 3 months.

I want every alliance member concentrating on:
1. buying capital pilots that are currently going on firesale
2. buying and building capitals

A list of strategic systems will be posted on our forums of where to store your capitals. Many players are claiming this change will stop force projection, we thought about it and rather than not adapt our aim is to have a capital fleet at our disposal in any area of the map. Our solution is quite simple focus on capital readiness by having capitals "to-go" in any area of eve. It will only take you 20 minutes - 30 minutes to use the jump bridges to high sec and move your pod across New Eden to our strategically placed capitals.

You all know me and I am all about adapting, this is us adapting.

See you on the battlefield
Alliance leaders


Gotta love this.
gascanu
Bearing Srl.
#5108 - 2014-10-03 09:00:03 UTC
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
Innominate wrote:

The jump freighter nerfs hurt _everyone_ who is trying to get by in nullsec, not just the established powers, and it's the smaller groups who suffer the most.


The only people it's going to hurt are people that can't adapt.

What about all the people it's going to help?
People who's gameplay might not revolve around any of the crap you're so concerned trolling about?


dude are you ********?
how are you going to adapt on that? going back to move your stuff with t1 haulers 30 jumps of hostile space?
oh, wait, there is another way to adapt: setting everyone blue all the way to empire should do the job; i can even use my jf then...
Easthir Ravin
Easy Co.
#5109 - 2014-10-03 09:00:26 UTC
Igor Nappi wrote:
Innominate wrote:
[quote=Aiyshimin]
Jumpbridges are essentially removed, rather than preventing their use for crossing the galaxy, it prevents their use even for intraregion travel. This appears to be a change intentionally backdoored under the guise of stopping "long distance" travel. Jump bridges are one of the few real advantages of owning space.

Current jump bridges are hilariously overpowered and desperately need the nerf.



How could you possibly know?

IN THE IMORTAL WORDS OF SOCRATES:  " I drank WHAT?!"
Ninteen Seventy-Nine
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#5110 - 2014-10-03 09:01:17 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
baltec1 wrote:

Go look at the income you get from a tower before saying these things, it will stop you from looking stupid.


No, please. After you, I insist.

Enlighten us. Show me the errors of my ways.

Tell us how much one makes in a month and how utterly miniscule that amount is when stacked alongside moons ALL ACROSS THE GODAM GAME

I'm sure it's insignificant.


Because there is only one guy who mines in EVE.


Don't be coy. You're terrible at it.

Your entire insinuation is that moons don't matter much. It's a bald faced lie hidden behind a ridiculous talking point.

As if a passive tower somehow correlated to a player in a ship in space actively executing a function to begin with.

"The unending paradox is that we do learn through pain."
Ninteen Seventy-Nine
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#5111 - 2014-10-03 09:02:03 UTC
Easthir Ravin wrote:


How could you possibly know?


How could one not?

"The unending paradox is that we do learn through pain."
Lord TGR
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5112 - 2014-10-03 09:02:44 UTC
Easthir Ravin wrote:
Igor Nappi wrote:
Innominate wrote:
[quote=Aiyshimin]
Jumpbridges are essentially removed, rather than preventing their use for crossing the galaxy, it prevents their use even for intraregion travel. This appears to be a change intentionally backdoored under the guise of stopping "long distance" travel. Jump bridges are one of the few real advantages of owning space.

Current jump bridges are hilariously overpowered and desperately need the nerf.

How could you possibly know?

He's trolling.
Caius Sivaris
Dark Nexxus
#5113 - 2014-10-03 09:04:01 UTC
Nazri al Mahdi wrote:

No one is taking a standard freighter from empire to Outer Passage unless there's an outpost egg inside, so don't even pretend that's an option.


Off course they do. And it's likely 6 non highsec jumps at most. It's happening today and it will happen a lot more in the future.
OldWolf69
EVE-RO
Goonswarm Federation
#5114 - 2014-10-03 09:08:38 UTC
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
baltec1 wrote:

Go look at the income you get from a tower before saying these things, it will stop you from looking stupid.


No, please. After you, I insist.

Enlighten us. Show me the errors of my ways.

Tell us how much one makes in a month and how utterly miniscule that amount is when stacked alongside moons ALL ACROSS THE GODAM GAME

I'm sure it's insignificant.


Because there is only one guy who mines in EVE.


Don't be coy. You're terrible at it.

Your entire insinuation is that moons don't matter much. It's a bald faced lie hidden behind a ridiculous talking point.

As if a passive tower somehow correlated to a player in a ship in space actively executing a function to begin with.


I just want to see people like you maintaing these "important" moons after patch. Will laugh my arse off.Lol
Easthir Ravin
Easy Co.
#5115 - 2014-10-03 09:08:51 UTC
The second and third order effects this is going to have on regional markets and the economy are mind numbing... I realize that it is CCP's property, but this is a wrecking ball of an idea. Might as well just come out and say, "Dear Eve player, we here at CCP really just don't like the way you have played our game for the last 11 years. We are making changes to the jump mechanic in order to force a game style more suited to our vision." It would be more truthful, imo.

IN THE IMORTAL WORDS OF SOCRATES:  " I drank WHAT?!"
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#5116 - 2014-10-03 09:09:28 UTC
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:


Don't be coy. You're terrible at it.

Your entire insinuation is that moons don't matter much. It's a bald faced lie hidden behind a ridiculous talking point.

As if a passive tower somehow correlated to a player in a ship in space actively executing a function to begin with.



You do know that near all mining is done afk dont you?
Gho Higyidr
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#5117 - 2014-10-03 09:09:42 UTC
Lord TGR wrote:
Gho Higyidr wrote:
knobber Jobbler wrote:
Anthar Thebess wrote:

Remember that most of those players where playing different games while waiting for pings.



This is fairly normal when you reach a certain state in EVE. If CCP promote a style of game play which consumes a vast amount of time to do anything yet you're not actually required to do very much during that time, it's hardly a surprise.

Some of these changes are good, some are completely daft and some further promote this sort of timer based game play which means players go AFK while they wait for an alarm clock. It's not an elegant solution.


Agree with you here. Increasing the time it takes to do something that already takes TIME to do in current mechanics.. is the most .. I don't even have a word for it. Again I speak as an advocate for change.. but CHANGE doesn't have to be to torch the very aspect of null. Capital Ships rule nullsec, simple. Nerfbatting them into gate-jumping super battleships that take weeks to a month to be able to jump any distance.. is downright frustrating.

I'm just more hung up on the fact that CCP will be gutting out the JF and rorquals.. and possibly even giving BLOPS a dead buttcheek... It's not making nullsec more 'fun' it's going to make it miserable.

EVE is already a 'job'. Now it looks like overtime and doubletime are in order to even fuel a tower more than 5LY away. But who am I kidding? EVE isn't about the player, it's about the subscriptions and money right?

Actually, are the time aspects of the JF changes necessarily so bad? I would've thought the LY changes would have much more of an impact, especially considering that the haulage guys can either utilize more alts and just change their delivery method to a pony express style of delivery, i.e. JF guy 1 takes leg 1, JF guy 2 takes leg 2 etc.

The LY change means that some things are potentially not even viable to reach, like deep space, and I would've thought people would be more up in arms about this. I kind of like it, because it does exactly what CCP wants, i.e. make space larger and more strategic, but I can also appreciate the added difficulty this does create for deep space inhabitants.


Just feels like too big of a step back from modern EVE Online to me. I remember the days before JF's and I lived in Drone Lands during those days. I made things locally but making the trip to empire for the bigger necessities.. wasn't FUN at all. It took VERY careful planning and execution. It's not cut and dry, it's tedious and time consuming.. tbh not really the kind of fun I'm after in EVE. Think about it. JF's already consume a TON more fuel than they did... My JF chokes down a full hold (100ish K isotopes) in a round trip trek across my home to maintain basic things. It's very expensive and already time-consuming enough as it is, even with help. With this JF nerf inbound, I will have to resort to old-school methods of tower and logistics maintenance when my Jump Fatigue is too high... It's not fun and it's not worth the time I'd rather spend shooting all the things.

Another point that irks me: Ok so Capitals are given double dead ass-cheeks. Fine. But now we already have to go a huge amount of jumps for a fight just to have said fights not happen. Even WITH titan bridging.. that's enough to **** even the most patient off. NOW... with the nerf, titan pilots may not want to waste their fatigue timers on bridging and jumping around non-super-serious-business fleets.... so we adapt and go gate to gate... with 100 or so people... 20+ jumps.... likely NOT to get a fight and have to turn around and fly all the way back. In big ships or slow-warping ships.. that's just not... fun? Maybe it is for some of you.

It's difficult to keep going on when there runs a risk of contradiction. lol. IMO.. the bigger the ship class, the shorter the range... so titans get the shortest.. followed by supers... dreads and carriers... BLOPS and JF / Rorquals shouldn't be touched with anything on their range at all... 5-7-10-no range nerf.

Another point: If this is an attempt to break up this MASSIVE throbbing blue donut environment... I think CCP is sadly mistaken. The coalitions have been around too long to just poof to dust over one or two gigantic nerfs.

I could be wrong.. LOL
Rei Moon
Perkone
Caldari State
#5118 - 2014-10-03 09:10:35 UTC
Almighty Bob
Bathe in this storm of tears
I offer you the utter pleasure
At the squeaky nullsex cost

alas lemme grab my socks
wife make me some popcorn
Warm and endless trail of tears
from those who can't think outside the box

Here in Brazil
net is awful, pinging slow
i still happily dualbox in wormholes
until the day these tears turn into snow

almighty Bob
rejoice in screams from those who don't know
don't grow a pair, cannot adapt
Unsub and plz >>>>
That way, it's WoW

Down the pole podcast "Annhhh"
Redwyne Vyruk
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5119 - 2014-10-03 09:11:09 UTC
Caius Sivaris wrote:
Nazri al Mahdi wrote:

No one is taking a standard freighter from empire to Outer Passage unless there's an outpost egg inside, so don't even pretend that's an option.


Off course they do. And it's likely 6 non highsec jumps at most. It's happening today and it will happen a lot more in the future.


quite mroe than 6 j
Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#5120 - 2014-10-03 09:11:23 UTC
Innominate wrote:
Aiyshimin wrote:

Why would the changes "hurt" anyone? That's not their intent or purpose.

It will change the way people move capitals around.


The effects to carriers, dreadnoughts, supercarriers and titans overall are reasonable. I think it could use some tweaking, but on that front things are basically okay. Not perfect, but I'm not really complaining.

Where it hurts is the effect on jumpfreighters and jumpbridges.

Jumpbridges are essentially removed, rather than preventing their use for crossing the galaxy, it prevents their use even for intraregion travel. This appears to be a change intentionally backdoored under the guise of stopping "long distance" travel. Jump bridges are one of the few real advantages of owning space.

The effect on jump freighters is the big one though, it makes the logistics of living in nullsec far far more difficult. Getting resources from nullsec for sale in highsec and getting supplied from highsec into null depends on the use of jump freighters. This is not something unique to the coalitions, very much the opposite, the coalitions own the portals to highsec. All those smaller groups trying to get by in nullsec? How are they supposed to get supplies? Is MOA supposed to take their 30 man fleet and escort a freighter through CFC space, within hotdrop range of our titan bridges?

The jump freighter nerfs hurt _everyone_ who is trying to get by in nullsec, not just the established powers, and it's the smaller groups who suffer the most.


Yes, changes to JFs jump range should be reconsidered, even though I'm not a huge fan of the Jita-centered universe as it is.

In my ideal EVE, alliances and coalitions should be able to build up viable economies, but it seems this isn't currently possible.