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How would this not shift the new status quo to mega blops fleets? redeemers are nothing to be laughed at these days, and when paired with stealth bombers for support, we would be back to the original damage projection problem, except now there would be a slightly different required skillset. Sure, the price would be a little higher, but you'd still have alliance fleets travelling from tribute to delve in under 40 minutes with either blockade runners coming along, or fuel depot poses set up along the way.

I'm all for fixing the clearly horrendous fatigue mechanic as mentioned, but I don't think this sort of exception is a good way to address it. Not to mention the potential difficulty in the code of distinguishing what type of destination was jumped to.

Star Citizen is a very different sort of game. At least look into Life is Feudal instead!

A couple of notes to all the people saying adapt or die:

First off people will adapt or die that's not really a choice it's more of a state of affairs. I think what you are completely forgetting is that adapting could mean very few people living much further than 5 LY from a system with a station and a high sec connection.

I haven't read every single post but I've scanned over more than half of this so far and my subjective opinion is as far as cap ship pilots it seems that more of the big alliances are applauding this and more of the small guys are saying it's not so good. Also combat pilots seem to be more happy with this than logistics pilots.

Sure some people will start moving stuff around with escorted industrials that will happen but most likely not at a rate to make up for all of the lost JF trips. I see no way you can increase the difficulty of moving freight around null by this much and not have it affect supply and therefore pricing. For those of you saying "yay high prices I get to make ass tons of isk" The prices will be high because the volume won't be there.

I see no way that you can have vibrant local economies without the ability to transport goods to other regions for trade. This tendency to move stuff to market hubs and then back out to the boondocks is not unique to eve nor is it new. Look at your history books. Also the Jita model is how Fed Ex and UPS operate today. They move everything to central hubs and then back out to the destinations from there.

I went to Spain a few years ago shortly after they had built this huge expressway system across the country. Towns near exits to the new express way were blowing up and booming. Then I went off those expressways and traveled the old 2 lane highways and saw towns shriveling and dying. Restaurants and gas stations boarding up and closing.

We had the same thing happen here in the states in the 50's when the Eisenhower highway system made old route 66 obsolete and it eventually just shut down.

CCP isnt' building an Eisenhower expressway system. They are tearing up route 66

And to the people saying that local economies will start supplying local pilots I am just going to predict that it does not happen that way. I'm saying for the record that barring some other unannounced changes that I am not privy to this will turn anything much more than 5 LY from a system with a high sec connection into more of a ghost town than it already is.

Destructible outposts I think will only make all of this worse.

You just can't have a lot of small gang PvP going on without supplying them ships to loose. These jump mechanics nerf hauling which will effectively nerf PvP.

There is only one real commodity in this game and that is time. I think if you want to predict how things are going to shake out in this game you need to break it down to time spent earning or building ships to time spent loosing them that ratio will tell you everything. These changes are going to mean more time spent hauling, waiting out timers and building all your own stuff and less time spent PvPing.

The thing is that is also helping the bad hype.. is Dotlan

Dotlan doesn't use any gates..

This will of course mean that scouts may need to be used and people will have to be more effective in defending their space from enemy roams/camps.

The main thing that will come out of this is that JF will be slightly more vunerable to attack in null as unless they want to spend a long time moving stuff and hugging stations they will be more exposed to getting shot at

Again, popularity was your word - I never used it except to quote you in a sentence.

But Stewardship does necessitate that CCP chart a course that isn't at total odds with the emergent content the players have created.

Opposing 'OP-Crush-It-With-A-Viking-Hammer' development style isn't insisting an 'advise and consent' process intended to assist in development, and not stifle it, be some unreasonable popularity vote.

****. this thread was great until you said AO

In case the strawpoll was lost:
http://strawpoll.me/2686971

Matches up pretty well with this leviathreadon, slight majority for the change, ~10% questioning things or don't know, and ~40% disagree

Although the response from other sites like fail-heap is almost entirely positive.


P.S. I read all the posts. Every one.

command ships might need -1 high slot now there's less reason to consider fitting a cyno

Although I feel that many players have voiced the same thoughts I have had about the proposed changes, I feel I should weigh in myself. I don't generally get involved with the forums, but this has the potential to impact my favourite game immensely.

In general, I find myself agreeing with the jump nerf. I see capital fleets in somewhat the same light as most governments see nukes: if we can project them onto our enemies, then they will do the same to us, and everyone loses. This was part of the reason the cold war never went hot. Theoretically, a reduction to the ability to project force can actually lead to more conflict. Thankfully, this theory hasn't really been tested in the real world. Maybe if this change leads to less conflict in Eve we can get world leaders to disarm the nukes? :)

That said, I do disagree with a portion of the proposed changes, much like others here. While I do not own a capital of any kind, my corp owns some, and I'm part of the logistics of moving them and supplying them in the somewhat rare instances that we have to move them....like when one of our members ummm...liberates... an Aeon... While the difficulty of moving liberated ships will increase for us, I am still in support of the nerf bat being applied here. Super Capital ships, traditionally, are used where the fighting is heaviest. They are slow to redeploy and are massive national assets in the real world. I find it rather odd that they are used for ratting in Eve. It just seems underwhelming to use the awesome power of a Nyx or Aeon for anything less than all-out war. This is the role they are intended for.

Something I like to participate in when conditions allow is Blops, and I am really hesitant about the new timers applying to these ships. Black Ops are supposed to be the elite, the mobile few that strike behind the enemy battle lines or ambush a supply chain, hit hard, and get out fast. They excel at disruption when used properly, and have a place in even the biggest war armada. The proposed changes really put a big chill on that whole role.

At the same time, I do see why CCP is including them in the changes. A single Blops BS could potentially (if not nerfed) bridge a fleet of cloaky T3's and support haulers a long distance (potentially across the galaxy) with no timers invoked. The T3 fleet could then dock up near the destination or jump to a POS, swap subsystems, and be ready to hit a target halfway across Eve with a much heavier force than any Blops fleet has a right to. Essentially, the problem of capital force projection would be replaced with the problem of T3 force projection. While this is not as serious a problem on the surface, remember that a capital ship takes a long time to train into, while a basic T3 pilot only takes a couple months. Picture thousands of T3's doing what the capitals are doing now. With this potential abuse in mind, I have to (sadly) admit that the nerf should apply to Blops. I'm hoping that someone can come up with an idea that allows for Blops to retain their unique niche without opening the door to massive abuse. Perhaps the timer, instead of not allowing a jump, just won't allow you to swap subsystems when jumping with Blops?

Further, I am in agreement with CCP on the issue of logistics. I do think that regular freighters should have the same rules apply to them as JF's, but so should regular haulers using bridges. They are not part of force projection, and so should not be penalized. This will allow less skilled players to participate in the logistics chain.

Not everyone uses that slot for a Cyno. You may as well say:

My Dragoon\Vexor\Falcon\Harpy\Golem might need -1 high slot now there's less reason to consider fitting a cyno.