Wormholes

Just a thought here, but what if (big if, I know) one of them descended from their lofty heights atop mount don't-give-a-**** and descended to the realm of us mere mortals and *gasp* actually listened to feedback instead of dismissing it because it doesn't agree with their pre-conceived notion of what players want? We all know that the numbers ("metrics") will back their decision because they have washed their hands of Hyperion and are already 2 weeks deep in the next project.
Sarcasm aside, I say actually because, in my experience, when a Dev comes onto the forums in regards to patch changes they have a tendency to:
1)Ask for feedback
2)Quiet the concerns of their player base by sounding reasonable
3)Ignore the forums because too many people won't drink the Kool-Aid (people still disagreeing with them)
4)Proceed with/leave in place the changes they came up with
5)Move on to another half-baked idea in the same way
6)Lock the thread or let it die a natural death by not seeing a Dev post for scores of pages
7)Defend their position with the mysterious "metrics" that, of course, support their position entirely


I get that they're the developers, they make the game, but from my perspective they seem to have lost touch with the fact that players make the content. No one wants to pay for/grind for a sub just to run the same handful of missions, we continue to sub to the game because of the other people in it and when they start screwing with that they are, quite literally, pushing players closer and closer to un-sub'ing. I don't expect the Dev's to be at the beck and call of the players, but I am neither the first nor the thousandth person to express concern that they do what they want and damn what we think of it. There has to be a middle ground and, on the face of it, the CSM would seem to be a step in the right direction but from my perspective it seems like even the CSM has trouble getting through to the Dev's. I could be wrong on that last bit though since I have exactly 0 experience with being a CSM rep.
Now, I know a few players that were at FanFest and they told me that the spawn distance change actually came from players at a round-table and that is great, however that was a fairly small percentage of the total player base. I also understand that it wouldn't be a good business model if they were to scrap all the code and manhours every time the forums disagree, but is it too much to ask for modifications to be made? The example that comes to my mind is the RLML debacle with Rise, and that is the basis for my little list up yonder, and the reason I yap about it so much is because Rise told players that he wanted to modify RLML's so that an ammo swap wouldn't take the full 35 seconds. We're still waiting for that. He also admitted that the RLML's were released on a rush job, they were incomplete and yet they haven't been touched to my knowledge since.
These are just examples of my concerns, I could be way off base and if I am willing to admit it, but as a common player on the forums it seems like a great many people agree with me, at least in part, for their own reasons.


**Again, just to be clear, it is entirely possible that I am way off base so, if I am and someone would like to point that out, try and resist the urge to flame and let's try to keep this civil and reasonable. Much like Trinkets, I am not entirely sober so if my thought process seems off that is likely why.

Well if it gets any worse PvP will become the new PvE.

Ok so a little over a week since patch and we have had following spawn in our C4:

2 x gas sites
1 x cosmic anom

On the other hand no shortage of WH. As far as im aware, no one had been running PVE sites in our home since patch day. I've never thought our C4 spawn rate was particularly high, but this seems way too low.

Yeah, we have seen the same thing. We have had a really active site spawn for about a year - and after the patch its been 1 anom every couple days at best. We assumed it was just everyone hibernating after the patch... Hope it wakes back up soon...

The prevailing thought regarding wh spawns is based on the idea that wh space code is merely repurposed k-space code (would make a ton of sense from a dev pov)

this means things like constellations and more importantly spawn mechanics based on them would also be reused (and why not?)

so the explanation for no sites spawning really is as simple as an extreme drop in a) people in wh space/exploring wh space (warping to sigs to despawn them in statics is normal practice for all smart c5/6 corps) and b) a drop in people running sites.

Now its all fine and dandy saying we should wait for 2 months of data and for ccp to get off their lazy behinds but a lot of people, once they unsub, are not coming back. wh space is PERMANENTLY losing people. they are not coming back.

just to make it crystal clear ccp and corbexx, the damage done, and being done right now is PERMANENT unless huge incentives are introduced to move back into whs or resub. just reversing most of these change wont be enough anymore.

tldr: ccp got rekt wrt whs.

Don't think so. c1-4 has about 0 impact on the market.

While I disagree with the lazy devs bit, your overall conclusions of the effects are sound.
yes, people are leaving wormhole space, some temporarily, some with no wish to ever come back.
Mostly, once someone leaves in the first place, the decision is so reluctantly arrived at, and so tiresome to implement, that there will need to be STUNNING improvements to encourage return.
So in short they have created a massive amount of future work for themselves.
From Corbexx's posts he is quite clear in his concerns, and is working VERY hard to bring matters to CCP's attention, and provide hard data regarding Wh income, to address this.

But yes, Hyperion was a massive clusterfrack for wormhole space. But through misunderstanding, lack of understanding, and ill advised, I doubt if laziness was the cause.

Anyone know if CCP plans to 'fix' this issue?

Not had anything but 1 ore site and wormholes for a week straight :S most of the systems empty or not in the chains are devoid of more than 1-2 sites also aside from the odd empty system that'll have a dozen site or so.

Update, since the patch we've had 3 sites despawn, and 3 sites spawn, so we're at 3 sites.