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WiS pledge fundrising

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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#301 - 2014-05-08 17:14:36 UTC

hint

[hint]
noun
1.
an indirect, covert, or helpful suggestion; clue: Give me a hint as to his identity.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#302 - 2014-05-08 17:18:19 UTC
Khanh'rhh wrote:

Both ideas were canned independently. CCP promised that no pay-to-win was ever going to be put into Eve, but people were still unsubscribing en-masse. It wasn't until CCP promised to can WiS and spend their efforts on spaceships that the playerbase got back on board with CCP.


That really is a revisionist slant on history.

You really brighten my day with your desperate attempts to rewrite actual events, you should work for Hollywood.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Master Flakattack
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#303 - 2014-05-08 17:45:05 UTC
Aralyn Cormallen wrote:
The other thing with Star Citizen is that it sets up an uncomfortable situation. I've heard some say that if SC succeeds at providing what it promises, EvE is in trouble due to a lack of avatar content. Oddly, I think there is a very different way to look at it.

Far worse than EvE having no avatar content while SC has lots, is the possibility that EvE goes toe-to-toe with SC on avatar play, and comes out second. At least in the first instance, EvE has its spaceship game, and metagame angles to continue to work their existing customer base. But chasing the same star as SC would involve a massive use of resources, and a potential negative effect on the spaceship game (and metagame through lost subs in the sectors of the playerbase that pushes the metagame), all for nothing if SC still came out ahead on avatar play, as those players who want avatar play will go where it is best, giving EvE nothing for coming in second place.

In the scheme of things, EvE is much healthier bolstering their existing playerbase, and trusting in SC catering to a very different playerbase they can't hope to compete for anyway (or just flat out never appearing). I'm not saying EvE should never chase the potential for avatar play, but the way to do that is definitely not setting themselves up for failure in a straight race with SC.

I really like this post and I agree entirely.

I bought into the original kickstarter for SC and so far I like what I am seeing, but I have also been playing EVE on and off since 2006. I will probably play both games, but for very different reasons. All of these people trying to jam avatar gameplay down our throats in EVE really have no idea what the playerbase wants or cares about, so I will give you a hint: EVE is about internet spaceships. Chances are, most of the people who joined EVE joined it for... internet spaceships *SHOCK*GASP*

I don't understand why you people are so bent on adding avatar gameplay to EVE. The question I ask that never gets answered: what do you think avatars will actually add to the game? Why should your average player use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? Why should your specialist player (industrialist, corp leadership, wh) use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? You're asking CCP to shunt a lot of development time and effort to a feature with no stated purpose (other than some RP bull).
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#304 - 2014-05-08 18:17:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Little Dragon Khamez
Master Flakattack wrote:
Aralyn Cormallen wrote:
The other thing with Star Citizen is that it sets up an uncomfortable situation. I've heard some say that if SC succeeds at providing what it promises, EvE is in trouble due to a lack of avatar content. Oddly, I think there is a very different way to look at it.

Far worse than EvE having no avatar content while SC has lots, is the possibility that EvE goes toe-to-toe with SC on avatar play, and comes out second. At least in the first instance, EvE has its spaceship game, and metagame angles to continue to work their existing customer base. But chasing the same star as SC would involve a massive use of resources, and a potential negative effect on the spaceship game (and metagame through lost subs in the sectors of the playerbase that pushes the metagame), all for nothing if SC still came out ahead on avatar play, as those players who want avatar play will go where it is best, giving EvE nothing for coming in second place.

In the scheme of things, EvE is much healthier bolstering their existing playerbase, and trusting in SC catering to a very different playerbase they can't hope to compete for anyway (or just flat out never appearing). I'm not saying EvE should never chase the potential for avatar play, but the way to do that is definitely not setting themselves up for failure in a straight race with SC.

I really like this post and I agree entirely.

I bought into the original kickstarter for SC and so far I like what I am seeing, but I have also been playing EVE on and off since 2006. I will probably play both games, but for very different reasons. All of these people trying to jam avatar gameplay down our throats in EVE really have no idea what the playerbase wants or cares about, so I will give you a hint: EVE is about internet spaceships. Chances are, most of the people who joined EVE joined it for... internet spaceships *SHOCK*GASP*

I don't understand why you people are so bent on adding avatar gameplay to EVE. The question I ask that never gets answered: what do you think avatars will actually add to the game? Why should your average player use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? Why should your specialist player (industrialist, corp leadership, wh) use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? You're asking CCP to shunt a lot of development time and effort to a feature with no stated purpose (other than some RP bull).


I small an alt.

Firstly, no one here seriously cares about SC.

Secondly lots of eve players will probably play SC too, no one is seriously going to leave eve to exclusively play SC

Thirdly, because it was promised to us and included in the game in the form of the CQ, all we want is for CCP to complete or further develop the avatar game with new game play as started with the CQ. It isn't any different to any other aspect of Eve online that gets the occasional reworking such as PI, Industry, ship redesigns and weapon/ship balancing. It's in the game lets get it finished.

Finally, no one here is 'trying to jam' avtar gameplay down anyone's throats, on the contrary the 'spaceships only' crowd are the ones that are trying to force a single play style that excludes avatars and anything not related to spaceships on the rest of the playerbase.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Naomi Hale
#305 - 2014-05-08 19:34:13 UTC
If the entire player-base doesn't want avatar game-play then how come threads requesting it keep cropping up and people in those threads that represent both sides?

Personally I think it shows a lack of imagination on the part of people stating avatar game-play is just role-playing or social chat-rooms. What about finding vulnerable access points in station systems to shut down sensors or sentry guns, allowing ganks, smuggling, or covert drops of Dust troops. How about pvp within stations where you can harvest implants from your defeated foe. Breaching rival Corp outposts to shut down production and services. Then there is team Avatar's prototype exploration with competitive pvp and increased risk/reward.

There are possibilities for great avatar game-play but people are so busy shooting it down that they don't even consider what it could provide.

If EVE remains as is but just fixes bugs and adds polish you'd see more people leave over time than any one divisive feature ever could make them do. Stagnation is death in this industry and innovation it's life blood.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#306 - 2014-05-08 19:36:21 UTC
Between WiS discussions and Gank vs Care threads...


We are just a community that likes to make assumptive remarks in absolutes about what we all imagined the side we disagree with just said aren't we?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#307 - 2014-05-08 19:41:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Shalua Rui
Naomi Hale wrote:
If EVE remains as is but just fixes bugs and adds polish you'd see more people leave over time than any one divisive feature ever could make them do. Stagnation is death in this industry and innovation it's life blood.

True, and CCP is aware of that, hence Legion and Valkyrie... but it's symptomatic for parts of this community - hell, most game communities, really - to only care about what they want individually... at least until they them self are bored by the stagnating game they so enjoyed once.

Irony and stuff...

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Naomi Hale
#308 - 2014-05-08 19:53:02 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
If EVE remains as is but just fixes bugs and adds polish you'd see more people leave over time than any one divisive feature ever could make them do. Stagnation is death in this industry and innovation it's life blood.

True, and CCP is aware of that, hence Legion and Valkyrie... but it's symptomatic for parts of this community - hell, most game communities, really - to only care about what they want individually... at least until they them self are bored by the stagnating game they so enjoyed once.

Irony and stuff...

True enough.

But this is a thread about WiS, so please don't mistake my desire for Avatar gameplay as a desire for CCP to ignore everything else. There are plenty of things I love in this game in it's current state and more that I'm looking forward to, most of them spaceship related (since industry isn't technically spaceships). But to ignore Avatars completely and see them as a deadend isn't the way forward.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#309 - 2014-05-08 20:06:19 UTC
Naomi Hale wrote:
But to ignore Avatars completely and see them as a deadend isn't the way forward.

Exactly... but as I already said, after this fanfest I'm inclined to give them time for now, at least, right now, it looks like they could be going back to avatar gameplay at one point in the future.

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Ubat Batuk
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#310 - 2014-05-08 21:55:25 UTC
Master Flakattack wrote:

I don't understand why you people are so bent on adding avatar gameplay to EVE. The question I ask that never gets answered: what do you think avatars will actually add to the game? Why should your average player use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? Why should your specialist player (industrialist, corp leadership, wh) use avatar gameplay over existing gameplay? You're asking CCP to shunt a lot of development time and effort to a feature with no stated purpose (other than some RP bull).



Excuse me Sir, respectfully speaking, what are you talking about?

I like to get out of the pod and I want CCP to realise the dreams they have been selling me with all those cool videos and that I have been funding with my subscription.

How about these?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GI53ydJaus8&list=PLF614A7A6461E61E1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw&index=17&list=PLF614A7A6461E61E1
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#311 - 2014-05-08 22:13:08 UTC
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Ubat Batuk
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#312 - 2014-05-08 22:33:19 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.


Sorry, I do not agree. Here is the Future Vision video with the Walk In station stuff (a possible version of it of course)... see how excited are people commenting on it. I mean 4000+ comments looking forward to it. So how can you justify your stand on WiS?

Here you go, check the comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw
Ubat Batuk
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#313 - 2014-05-08 22:35:30 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But to ignore Avatars completely and see them as a deadend isn't the way forward.

Exactly... but as I already said, after this fanfest I'm inclined to give them time for now, at least, right now, it looks like they could be going back to avatar gameplay at one point in the future.


Even if WiS came as an extension to DUST on PC, it would be great.
Hazzard
Chaotic Dynamics
#314 - 2014-05-08 22:37:18 UTC
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But to ignore Avatars completely and see them as a deadend isn't the way forward.

Exactly... but as I already said, after this fanfest I'm inclined to give them time for now, at least, right now, it looks like they could be going back to avatar gameplay at one point in the future.


Even if WiS came as an extension to DUST on PC, it would be great.


I completely agree. I cannot see how it would really harm Eve, especially if done via kickstarter as the money and resources would not take away from current development efforts only add to WiS.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#315 - 2014-05-08 22:38:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.


Sorry, I do not agree. Here is the Future Vision video with the Walk In station stuff (a possible version of it of course)... see how excited are people commenting on it. I mean 4000+ comments looking forward to it. So how can you justify your stand on WiS?

Here you go, check the comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw



It might possibly be because 4000 people is not even 1% of EVE accounts.

Just like a dozen vocal and persistent form posters is not a majority, neither are the sum total of all players attending fanfest, or the total of all forum users combined.

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Ubat Batuk
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#316 - 2014-05-08 22:41:22 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.


Sorry, I do not agree. Here is the Future Vision video with the Walk In station stuff (a possible version of it of course)... see how excited are people commenting on it. I mean 4000+ comments looking forward to it. So how can you justify your stand on WiS?

Here you go, check the comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw



It might possibly be because 4000 people is not even 1% of EVE accounts.

Just like a dozen vocal and persistent form posters is not a majority, neither are the sum total of all players attending fanfest.


The people posting on this thread against WiS are very few. You can probably count them with one hand.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#317 - 2014-05-08 22:48:10 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.


Sorry, I do not agree. Here is the Future Vision video with the Walk In station stuff (a possible version of it of course)... see how excited are people commenting on it. I mean 4000+ comments looking forward to it. So how can you justify your stand on WiS?

Here you go, check the comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw



It might possibly be because 4000 people is not even 1% of EVE accounts.

Just like a dozen vocal and persistent form posters is not a majority, neither are the sum total of all players attending fanfest.


that's assuming that everybody saw the video and that 100% of everybody who wants wis actually posted a comment.

Doc you know I respect you and love your contributions to any thread, so I think you'd be the first to agree that it only tends to be a small percentage of people who post comments about videos or whatever. It's the same for login surveys, not everyone fills them out, likewise elections are won and lost by people that don't even vote.

Thing is though I cant think of any way of gauging support for WIS that isn't open to some form of abuse or outright manipulation, even a blind login survey can be skewed, by people changing ip addresses to do the survey again, and again and again. Though if a goon was presented with one of them a lot them wouldn't even fill it out until they were told how to vote by the chief rabble rouser of their alliance.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#318 - 2014-05-08 23:44:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.


Sorry, I do not agree. Here is the Future Vision video with the Walk In station stuff (a possible version of it of course)... see how excited are people commenting on it. I mean 4000+ comments looking forward to it. So how can you justify your stand on WiS?

Here you go, check the comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mlVuLs_Nw



It might possibly be because 4000 people is not even 1% of EVE accounts.

Just like a dozen vocal and persistent form posters is not a majority, neither are the sum total of all players attending fanfest.


that's assuming that everybody saw the video and that 100% of everybody who wants wis actually posted a comment.

Doc you know I respect you and love your contributions to any thread, so I think you'd be the first to agree that it only tends to be a small percentage of people who post comments about videos or whatever. It's the same for login surveys, not everyone fills them out, likewise elections are won and lost by people that don't even vote.

Thing is though I cant think of any way of gauging support for WIS that isn't open to some form of abuse or outright manipulation, even a blind login survey can be skewed, by people changing ip addresses to do the survey again, and again and again. Though if a goon was presented with one of them a lot them wouldn't even fill it out until they were told how to vote by the chief rabble rouser of their alliance.



My point exactly, it's statistically irrelevant either way and furthermore the "data" can't be trusted.

It's a good thing CCP has good data and customer service records. They've already reacted because of what their data shows them and they are collecting tons more of it. I hope CCP does what they feel is best for the game and not just what a statistically irrelevant number of random people visiting or poasting on a website think regardless of which side of the fence those people are on regarding any matter.

I've noticed when CCP wants our feedback they ask for it.. funny that.

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Morgan North
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#319 - 2014-05-09 00:01:16 UTC
I support Walking in Stations.

But by the time Walking in stations was implemented, the actual problem was with it being forced on dock/undock and slowed down computers. The actual needed change was to actively undock and dock the pod.

I felt it was not the least realistic for the transitions to be instantaneous, and that a capsuleer would probably never leave his pod unless necessary (remember, he risks actual death if he leave the pod.) Until now, that is.

CCP should not stop walking in stations, but it needs to be done properly, and the possibility of adding content will be very low outside of being able to walk around and talking with other chaps in a room (which is what most people want anyways, for reference). Adding a single community room for say, corporation people to be at would do wonders. 90% of the time.

This of course changes if we add strippers and nudity to the game. THEN EVERYONE WANTS IT.
Naomi Hale
#320 - 2014-05-09 04:36:10 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Naomi Hale wrote:
But this is a thread about WiS

No this is a thread about some delusional roleplayers who are pretending that they would bankroll an effort to have CCP add dance emotes and wizard pants to their spaceship game. I think ISD is laughing too hard to lock it.

"Dance emotes and wizard pants"? You're right, ISD is probably laughing at how delusional some people are being on this thread. Not necessarily in your favour though.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.