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EVE API and Public CREST discussion

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CCP Prism X
C C P
C C P Alliance
#321 - 2014-05-06 17:21:53 UTC
Locking this temporarily to merge the discussion to here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4558401#post4558401

See ya there! Blink

CCP Prism X

Programmer on Team Gridlock & Expert Ranter
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#322 - 2014-05-06 22:05:34 UTC
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!

The Rules:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.

5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.

26. Off-topic posting is prohibited.

Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Locke DieDrake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#323 - 2014-05-07 03:15:56 UTC
Winthorp wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
So lets answer a few questions:

Bloemkoolsaus wrote:
Our wormhole mapper software relies on this information to determine the current status of the systems we are connected to. I would very much like to keep this information in the API as the information it provides is essential for us.


Your software relying on it is basically why we are doing this. This is information that you guys using software outside the game get a huge advantage over those who do not. CCP by design specifically did not include a map of WH space, and we specifically did not include this information in the client.

.


So then when will you be making an ingame map function that actually works. Why is it other parts of the game are allowed to pull this info and more like jump data. Why is it nullsec is allowed to use out of game tools like dotlan that are supported by CCP?

Do you really expect us to go back to pen and paper maps?

You will literally kill WH space PVP overnight with this one change, i am not exaggerating when i say this. THIS IS A MASSIVE CHANGE.


Bit of a drama queen aren't you?

Your mapping software will work JUST FINE after this change, it just won't include NPC kills. Are you too dense to understand this, or are you so overly dependent on your out of game, immersion breaking tools that you just don't care?
That's a serious question, because from where I'm sitting, you are basically screaming like a 4 year old that lost their lollipop, and it's not very constructive.

I came here basically neutral on the issue, but now I'm in favor of it, just because it pisses people like you off.

I'm a WH dweller, I shoot stuff. I can't possibly imagine this will change my game play in the slightest.
Lenelluce
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#324 - 2014-05-07 04:26:26 UTC
funny that everything goons cry about immediately gets changed
Janeway84
Insane's Asylum
#325 - 2014-05-07 06:56:51 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Hey guys,

as a heads up as soon as I can find the time I will be removing WH systems map/kills endpoint. This is data that exists in the API but not the client and is incredibly powerful. As with everything I am open to discussing this, but I will admit that you will have a damn hard time convincing me of not doing it.

Please continue this disscuission here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4558401#post4558401



Dont do it! Its going to slow down finding pvp even more P
Its one of the few tools wh people use to find out if its worth their time to hang around a wh system to get some action. Shocked

I can understand from a lore perspective why you would do this but I think removing it is as bad as the ideas of wormhole stabilizer.
TurboX3
Pulling The Plug
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#326 - 2014-05-07 07:35:53 UTC
CCP FoxFour - WHY BREAK THE GAME FOR HARD WORKING WORMHOLERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you bias and against the wh community?

Have you seen or used our 3rd part software/ mapping tools?
Rob Crowley
State War Academy
#327 - 2014-05-07 08:12:36 UTC
TurboX3 wrote:
CCP FoxFour - WHY BREAK THE GAME FOR HARD WORKING WORMHOLERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He's not changing the game, that's kinda the whole point of this thing that the game doesn't provide this info. If you want this info in the game ask one of the game designers, preferably in a thread in a more appropriate sub-forum though. Once the game designers have decided to put this info into the game, I'm sure FoxFour will add it to the API immediately.

Quote:
Are you bias and against the wh community?
Nah, he's against all Eve players equally, breaking everyone's game is all in a good day's work for him.

Quote:
No Trolling Please
Also no irony.
Lilli Tane
Deu-La-Deu
#328 - 2014-05-07 08:58:31 UTC
This is funny, and at the same time very disappointing.

CCP announces they are going to fix one of the worst lore breaking bugs in the game, and the self-proclaimed elite PVP community goes in uproar against it.

It is funny since after all the bragging, in the end, all you really depend on is on tools that do all the info gathering for you and not on proper exploring or playing the game.

It is disappointing since I was expecting a better reaction from key figures from W-space.

But I guess the removal of the-i-win buttons always cause trouble.

Now, I suggest you guys go read a bit of the lore of this game you all say you love, so you can understand why having NPC kills API data is a bug and was just a freebie for all these years.
Splodger
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#329 - 2014-05-07 09:50:17 UTC
Maybe without the useless crutch that is NPC kills / Jumps, PvPers will actually complain about real mechanics that will put real balance into risk that wormholes should bring.

Getting new sigs delayed by 30secs is far more productive than advocating for API information.

As it currently stands doing PVE in wormholes is far to safe.

Doing wh PvP is far to tedious and lacks enough reward for the effort because of the current mechanics.
Irya Boone
The Scope
#330 - 2014-05-07 10:15:12 UTC
just right in the moment when goons put some alts.. B.ts in WH ... what a coincidence


Oh wait...

I don't believe in such things

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Puiu Lucif
Tilica Nation
#331 - 2014-05-07 11:03:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Puiu Lucif
It's a good change to help those who don't download 1000 tools to play the game. If it's not in the client then it should not exist, plain and simple, especially something that gives a big advantage in PvP.

Loved the way CCP devs managed to stay sane while reading all the weird hate posts by people who don't have a life. Keep up the good work and fly safe o7 !
King Fu Hostile
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#332 - 2014-05-07 11:43:48 UTC
Winthorp wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
So lets answer a few questions:

Bloemkoolsaus wrote:
Our wormhole mapper software relies on this information to determine the current status of the systems we are connected to. I would very much like to keep this information in the API as the information it provides is essential for us.


Your software relying on it is basically why we are doing this. This is information that you guys using software outside the game get a huge advantage over those who do not. CCP by design specifically did not include a map of WH space, and we specifically did not include this information in the client.

.


So then when will you be making an ingame map function that actually works. Why is it other parts of the game are allowed to pull this info and more like jump data. Why is it nullsec is allowed to use out of game tools like dotlan that are supported by CCP?

Do you really expect us to go back to pen and paper maps?

You will literally kill WH space PVP overnight with this one change, i am not exaggerating when i say this. THIS IS A MASSIVE CHANGE.


"why is it that wormhole space is different than k-space"

And yes, you are indeed exaggerating, it doesn't affect wh PVP in any way.

Ideki
Wolf Brothers INC
United Neopian Federation
#333 - 2014-05-15 17:33:11 UTC
One question for the PI API:

It returns only the changes that have been applied to a planet. right?
Or do we have access to the changes in progress?

Creator of The EVE Planetary Planner
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#334 - 2014-05-15 17:46:58 UTC
Ideki wrote:
One question for the PI API:

It returns only the changes that have been applied to a planet. right?
Or do we have access to the changes in progress?


The API will only show what you last saw in the client as the DB is only updated when you look at it in the client.

I hope that answers your question, I am not sure I understand it 100%.

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Ideki
Wolf Brothers INC
United Neopian Federation
#335 - 2014-05-15 17:50:17 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Ideki wrote:
One question for the PI API:

It returns only the changes that have been applied to a planet. right?
Or do we have access to the changes in progress?


The API will only show what you last saw in the client as the DB is only updated when you look at it in the client.

I hope that answers your question, I am not sure I understand it 100%.



Ok, let me try to clarify myself.

If I open the PI ingame, then make some changes (ex: change an Extractor program) but I do not validate it yet, then I do a request on the API.

What will I see in the API?

  1. The extractor as is was before the change ?
  2. The extractor as it is on my screen ?


From your answer I am guessing answer #1.

But still, the PI API is extremely useful for me.
And I added some neat tricks to my tool for #2.
So all in all I cover both sides Big smile

Creator of The EVE Planetary Planner
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#336 - 2014-05-15 17:53:50 UTC
Ideki wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Ideki wrote:
One question for the PI API:

It returns only the changes that have been applied to a planet. right?
Or do we have access to the changes in progress?


The API will only show what you last saw in the client as the DB is only updated when you look at it in the client.

I hope that answers your question, I am not sure I understand it 100%.



Ok, let me try to clarify myself.

If I open the PI ingame, then make some changes (ex: change an Extractor program) but I do not validate it yet, then I do a request on the API.

What will I see in the API?

  1. The extractor as is was before the change ?
  2. The extractor as it is on my screen ?


From your answer I am guessing answer #1.

But still, the PI API is extremely useful for me.
And I added some neat tricks to my tool for #2.
So all in all I cover both sides Big smile


If by validate you mean submit... then yes #1. :)

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Ideki
Wolf Brothers INC
United Neopian Federation
#337 - 2014-05-15 18:12:44 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Ideki wrote:


Ok, let me try to clarify myself.

If I open the PI ingame, then make some changes (ex: change an Extractor program) but I do not validate it yet, then I do a request on the API.

What will I see in the API?

  1. The extractor as is was before the change ?
  2. The extractor as it is on my screen ?


From your answer I am guessing answer #1.

But still, the PI API is extremely useful for me.
And I added some neat tricks to my tool for #2.
So all in all I cover both sides Big smile


If by validate you mean submit... then yes #1. :)


fair enough Smile

As I said, I have contingency plans for that.
I wrote a small algorithm that can get the extractor info from a screenshot of it.
It is integrated to the new version of my tool.
Now I just need to integrate you API to make it complete.

Thank you again. Big smile

Creator of The EVE Planetary Planner
Ideki
Wolf Brothers INC
United Neopian Federation
#338 - 2014-05-15 18:14:18 UTC
unrelated:

Could we have any API (or is there one already) that tells us when posts we follow received new messages?
Same for posts we created, can we know when we get new 'likes' ?

Blink

Creator of The EVE Planetary Planner
Ideki
Wolf Brothers INC
United Neopian Federation
#339 - 2014-05-15 20:52:22 UTC
I do not see the head count in the /char/PlanetaryPins

This is a really useful data that is missing.

Creator of The EVE Planetary Planner
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#340 - 2014-05-15 20:53:55 UTC
Ideki wrote:
I do not see the head count in the /char/PlanetaryPins

This is a really useful data that is missing.


In what way is it useful?

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.