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Or, making compression a station service, making it ubiquitous and easy.

You bring up an interesting artifact of the current proposal, too -- the grueling, unthinking nature of the work practically begs for it to be automated, against the Terms of Service. This would drive the margins for the process down to nothing and ensure that no humans could actually profit from it.

Note that this post in no way condones doing so -- you should play video games, not automate them. That being said, discouraging this practice for less scrupulous individuals is worth spending time on, and adding a compression service to stations makes this possible.

This is not how markets work.

At the risk of embarassing myself by doing math in public:

240M units of veldspar to fill a JF. A hulk can mine ~0.9M veldspar per hour. That's 267 hours to mine 240M veld. 1.25 hours to compress the veld. Opportunity cost of compression is ~1.1M veld (i.e. you can mine 1.1M veld in the time it takes you to compress 240M veld.) 1.1M / 240M = 0.5% (half a percent.) (Or 1.25 hours / 267 hours = 0.5%.)

I don't think you'll see a 20% surcharge on compressed ore. But I think we'll definitely see a "surcharge" in botting freighters.

Not even close to how this is going to play out.

Bots and crazies will run this make-believe compression industry into the ground. At best miners can hope for prices to stay the same, but the more likely scenario is the cost of business being uploaded to them. POS compression in high-sec is a bad joke.

Your drive for station compression has a big fatal flaw IMHO.

It assumes there will be enough uncompressed ore on the market to begin with, which is highly disputable. In my view even absurd to expect and use as a basis. There will certainly not be many freighter loads per system per day.

The big miners that make up most of the mined ore volume, will simple compress in a POS and where they mine, they do not need stations for that. They do this because stations are too far out if they want to mine where rocks aren't all 70% eaten. They also do this because it simplifies their operating logistics. All your proposal does is make it easier for small time miners is to stay away from corporations that give them more industrial benefits then compression alone.

Including miners, the source of the ore, in your picture totally disrupts your argument that all hauling sores will be done by bots and puts players at a disadvantage somehow. Having compression in station actually is easier/safer for bots as it requires no corporation. This means there is nothing to target by players to disrupt the operation.

Your previous discussion partner is right that the combination of NPC station compression and high null-sec refine means that all non-compressed low end ore will be bought by null alliances, compressed and shipped out. They can always outbid the other market players every time they try to break in, thanks to the refine ratio advantage they enjoy at home. The end result will not be higher ore prices for the miners, but near exclusive below market value ore for those with refine access. Even if the per-system volume is rather low, it will stack over time and several systems, thus there will be few players/corporations exploiting this.

The fact is that station based compression actually helps bottling and drafts new miners as a working class for those with null outpost refine access. If history is anything to go by, those early miners will not get any benefit, they would be helped more by joining a corp and get mining bonus and POS compression early in the game.

Okay. let's do some feedback.


Quick summery on the head : Wake up DEV! Wake UP! You should Calculate Again!



Let's start a simple fomular.

Reprocessing yield: Station Equipment + 0.375 x (1 + Refining skill x 0.02) x (1 + Refining Efficiency skill x 0.04) x (1 + Ore Processing skill x 0.05) x (1 + Refining Implant modifier)

Changes to

Reprocessing yield: Station Equipment x (1 + Refining skill x 0.03) x (1 + Refining Efficiency skill x 0.02) x (1 + Ore Processing skill x 0.02) x (1 + Refining Implant modifier)

Even DEV missing Refining Implant factor on their reporcessing yield fomular, but they put implat factor in ther calculation.

Calculated Reprocessing Yield from DEV Blog



Now, I will start some serious feedback.

But before feedback begins, I re-sorted reprocessing table.

Ore Reporcessing Table

Compressed Ore Reprocessing Table


Dev's Ore Reprocessing Table 12

Dev's Compressed Ore Table 12

If you look Dev's table carefully, you will notice that Mercoxit isn't rounded and volume of compressed Mercoxit is missing.

But that is not important.


Check Pyroxeres, Jaspet, Hemorphite, and Hedbergite


Pyroxeres and there variant(Solid Pyroxeres and Viscous Pyroxeres) have 5 Nocxium per batch.

Compressed Pyroxeres have 2279 Nocxium per batch.

But Compressed Solid Pyroxeres and Compressed Viscous Pyroxeres have 2486 Nocxium per batch.

Nocxium is created while compressing?

Same problem can be found Jaspet, Hemorphite, Hedbergite and their variants.




Let's get to the other problem.

Dev didn't anounce the batch of compressed ore, I reverse calculated the batch.

Compressed Ore Batch Table

Well, it's pretty dirty number, isn't it?

So I rounded the batch.

well, Veldspar's batch is 1663, I don't like that number but it's okay.

Scoldite is 1000, Plagioclase is 330, Hedbergite is 50, Crokite is 12.5, Spodumain is 12.5, Mercoxit is 5.

Wait, What? Crokite is 12.5, Spodumain is 12.5?

You need 12.5 quantity of Crokite to make a Compressed Crokite?

It seems something Terribly wrong.




Anyway, I producted New ore reprocessing table with rounded batch.

Compressed Ore Reprocessing Table should be look like this.

But batch of Crokite and Spodumain should be adjusted.

Proper Compressed Ore Reprocessing Table




Last one.

Check this first. Ore Compression Ratio

I think Dev concentrate on mineral compression ratio only and forgot something important.

When you do compression, you think output volume is smaller than input volume.

But in case of Veldspar, Scordite and Spodumain, output volume is larger than input.

Well, Dev, you should change the name of "Compressed Veldspar" to "Expanded Veldspar"

Awesome sauce.

The yellow marks are awesome.
Even more awesome would be a button to remove all ( red / yellow ) items.
If we are reprocessing a bunch of crap don't wanna have to pick through to find all the yellow marks.

those 30 miners are 30 individual people each with between 4 and 20 hulks. They brought in not even 10% of required materials needed for just me, one producer in 0.0, there are plenty more.

And why would you bother mining in null when you can rat with minimal effort in an ishtar and make 3 times the money?

Looks like you missed the update by CCP Yterbium where he stated that ore compression will be done to a summer expansion's batch (100 units, uniformly). In his example he used Veldspar which results in compression factor of 24 towards the Minerals (26,74 before reprocessing them). Applying this compression factor to all ores results in values like this

Edit: This new approach resolves two issues with the previous one (where the old ore quantities to build a block were used):

• Bonus no longer gets applied to the minerals within the block (which resulted in too low quantities in that table in the devblog)
• Blocks that contained ore quantities which can't be divided by 100 (Pyroxeres and Crokite) are no longer an issue

There's still a mismatch between the 38,1 % approximation and exact values after calculating x 1 / 0.724 which is shown here