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Dev blog: More Deployables from Super Friends

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Alundil
Rolled Out
#1921 - 2014-01-22 05:58:24 UTC
CCP SoniClover wrote:
Kismeteer wrote:
CCP SoniClover wrote:
I tend to avoid answering posts using inflammatory phrasing, but I actually think your signature answers your question pretty well.


Referencing: “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡ you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.”

Why are null sec people the only people that have defend it? Why couldn't you do this module in high sec, where it could actually make for interesting game play? Or low sec, which this seems ideal for, if anyone ratted there.

If you're avoiding posts with inflammatory phrasing, is that your excuse why you're avoiding most of the posts in this thead?


You can´t expect everything we do to have equal affect on everyone. Yes, the ESS affects null sec more, just like the Hi Sec POCOs we did for Rubicon affected hi sec more. It evens out in the end. We hate everyone equally.


I haven't lived in null in many months so it isn't going to bother me from an income perspective. However, from a gameplay perspective I strongly doubt that this module, in null, will have the effect you seem to think it will. Basically thinking about this module and its implications makes me feel like your face.... and also your face.


As to your parting shot in the quote there clover, as a public representative for a company that's ridiculous and unprofessional.

But hey, stay classy.

I'm right behind you
Alundil
Rolled Out
#1922 - 2014-01-22 06:18:58 UTC
Eram Fidard wrote:
What happens when an unstoppable force (team superfriends or more specifically SoniClover) meets an immovable object (eve playerbase)?

The monument gets it.

I'm right behind you
Alundil
Rolled Out
#1923 - 2014-01-22 07:28:28 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
How many pages does a thread have to reach before it becomes a 'threadnought'?

"Ah one, ah twohoo, ah thrrrreee.... the world may never know"

I'm right behind you
Rekkr Nordgard
Steelforge Heavy Industries
#1924 - 2014-01-22 09:16:45 UTC
Vald Tegor wrote:
Rubicon 1.2:
- Sleepers no longer drop databases
- New deployable. Has a chance to download databases from defeated sleepers in system. Has no effect if the wormhole does not have an active connection to K-space. Wormholes involved cannot be end of life or shrunk due to mass. They must have relay deployables anchored in every system along the path, including the first k-space system. The relays show globally on the overview, immediately alerting travelers that someone down the chain is ratting. Exciting Pvpve encounters are sure to follow.


Let's try not to give the team that thought the ESS was an absolutely fantastic concept any more ideas please.
Anthar Thebess
#1925 - 2014-01-22 09:25:19 UTC
ESS - Bad idea.
If CCP want to work on nullsec why not address issues that players are stating this for years ?
HED proved that servers are unable to handle current nullsec state - i think that this is more important thing to work on rather than ESS?

Or fill the gaps in your rules - players still don't know WHAT is large - scale player fight 10 people on local, 20 , 300 , 2000?

Why ESS is bad idea?
Because it will not change nothing - and can be abused as a tackling device.

If you think that ESS is good idea why it cannot be used at the same time in lowsec and higsec.
Every where play the same players.

I want to put ESS in some higsec mission hub - and guard it with some friends.
Any one can try to take it from us.

Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists

Show your support to The Cause!
Nagarythe Tinurandir
Einheit X-6
#1926 - 2014-01-22 10:06:04 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
ESS - Bad idea.
If CCP want to work on nullsec why not address issues that players are stating this for years ?
HED proved that servers are unable to handle current nullsec state - i think that this is more important thing to work on rather than ESS?


because the game(content)designer aren't responsible for the net code, or whatever part of the backround programming is causing the problems. it's like telling a bakery they should be a barber shop.

Anthar Thebess wrote:

I want to put ESS in some higsec mission hub - and guard it with some friends.
Any one can try to take it from us.


That would be most awesome :D
should have been a high and low sec thing from the very beginning.
CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1927 - 2014-01-22 10:36:35 UTC
posting here in efforts of getting this thread to 100 pages \o/

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis ♥
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#1928 - 2014-01-22 10:41:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Zappity
CCP Punkturis wrote:
posting here in efforts of getting this thread to 100 pages \o/

Hehe, and doing my part... And I still want one of these for highsec and FW low!

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Turelus
Utassi Security
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#1929 - 2014-01-22 11:06:54 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
posting here in efforts of getting this thread to 100 pages \o/

Well... trying not to be an ass but if you wanted to see 100 pages you could go poke some CCP people to post more answers to questions and keep the back and forth going...

Also I added another post for you. P

Turelus CEO Utassi Security
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#1930 - 2014-01-22 11:07:45 UTC
Just to spell out the maths.

Start point. No ESS. 95% today.
ESS. Assuming 1k/lp. Lower than it is currently, lets not doom & gloom crazy, because as price of LP drops from supply, more people will buy the now cheaper items, keeping price partly modulated. So LP won't crash.
80% ISK + 15% LP. 95%. NO OVERALL LOSS EVEN IF YOU GET NOTHING FROM THE ESS.

Upgraded ESS.
80% ISK + 20% LP LP. 100%. GAIN ABOVE NO ESS ALREADY.

Upgraded ESS + Payout
80% ISK + 25% ISK + 20% LP. 125%. MASSIVE PAYOUT GAIN.

So, Deploying the ESS is actually very low risk now. You stand to loose the initial 30 Million if you don't get any upgrade ticks done before it gets stolen from & blown up. But unless LP crashes badly (Since it's actually above 1k for most LP anyway, so can drop a bit before making 1k an invalid number) you make the lost 15% isk back in LP, if not quite as convenient. And if you actually manage to upgrade it and get the payout from the ESS when hostiles come through or you are simply done ratting, you make a bucket load of profit.

It's looking good now.
ZynnLee Akkori
Perkone
Caldari State
#1931 - 2014-01-22 12:40:08 UTC  |  Edited by: ZynnLee Akkori
Other questions I have not seen answers for:

Can we have more than 1 ESS in system? If so, how do we know which one is being accessed/attacked?

If the ESS is destroyed, does all the ISK in the kitty just disappear? The original clarification suggested the ISK is credited to the 'system', not the actual ESS device, and we just use it to get to the ISK.

Does the payout 'upgrade' reset if the ESS is destroyed? So if my corp were to rat for a few hours and finally get the ESS to the top bonus payout, then have it popped by some big meanie, does the bonus reset?

Does having more than 1 ESS out double the payout effect or bounty nerf? Can he payout bank be accessed from either device?

If you have 2 ESS deployed and one gets popped, is the Payout bonus and ISK bank preserved?

Has there been any thought to this being used as a bubble between 2 warp points instead of a pve tool? Presumably, I could drop this mid-way between 2 gates and it would pull anyone crossing it out of warp, including ships that are currently immune to this. How does it compare to existing bubble devices?
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#1932 - 2014-01-22 12:45:05 UTC  |  Edited by: War Kitten
ZynnLee Akkori wrote:
Other questions I have not seen answers for:
...


Go read the description in the blog and the first few dev posts - it will answer most of those questions.

...and bubbles don't work like that.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Andrea Keuvo
Rusty Pricks
#1933 - 2014-01-22 12:45:41 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Just to spell out the maths.

Start point. No ESS. 95% today.
ESS. Assuming 1k/lp. Lower than it is currently, lets not doom & gloom crazy, because as price of LP drops from supply, more people will buy the now cheaper items, keeping price partly modulated. So LP won't crash.
80% ISK + 15% LP. 95%. NO OVERALL LOSS EVEN IF YOU GET NOTHING FROM THE ESS.

Upgraded ESS.
80% ISK + 20% LP LP. 100%. GAIN ABOVE NO ESS ALREADY.

Upgraded ESS + Payout
80% ISK + 25% ISK + 20% LP. 125%. MASSIVE PAYOUT GAIN.

So, Deploying the ESS is actually very low risk now. You stand to loose the initial 30 Million if you don't get any upgrade ticks done before it gets stolen from & blown up. But unless LP crashes badly (Since it's actually above 1k for most LP anyway, so can drop a bit before making 1k an invalid number) you make the lost 15% isk back in LP, if not quite as convenient. And if you actually manage to upgrade it and get the payout from the ESS when hostiles come through or you are simply done ratting, you make a bucket load of profit.

It's looking good now.


How will -10 sec status people cash in their LP?
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#1934 - 2014-01-22 12:48:32 UTC
Andrea Keuvo wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Just to spell out the maths.

Start point. No ESS. 95% today.
ESS. Assuming 1k/lp. Lower than it is currently, lets not doom & gloom crazy, because as price of LP drops from supply, more people will buy the now cheaper items, keeping price partly modulated. So LP won't crash.
80% ISK + 15% LP. 95%. NO OVERALL LOSS EVEN IF YOU GET NOTHING FROM THE ESS.

Upgraded ESS.
80% ISK + 20% LP LP. 100%. GAIN ABOVE NO ESS ALREADY.

Upgraded ESS + Payout
80% ISK + 25% ISK + 20% LP. 125%. MASSIVE PAYOUT GAIN.

So, Deploying the ESS is actually very low risk now. You stand to loose the initial 30 Million if you don't get any upgrade ticks done before it gets stolen from & blown up. But unless LP crashes badly (Since it's actually above 1k for most LP anyway, so can drop a bit before making 1k an invalid number) you make the lost 15% isk back in LP, if not quite as convenient. And if you actually manage to upgrade it and get the payout from the ESS when hostiles come through or you are simply done ratting, you make a bucket load of profit.

It's looking good now.


How will -10 sec status people cash in their LP?


Ummm...go to an appropriate station and dock up? There are stations in lowsec too so novices at -10 don't have to worry.

This getting to 100 pages plan is going to be easy...

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Turelus
Utassi Security
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#1935 - 2014-01-22 12:50:22 UTC
Andrea Keuvo wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Just to spell out the maths.

Start point. No ESS. 95% today.
ESS. Assuming 1k/lp. Lower than it is currently, lets not doom & gloom crazy, because as price of LP drops from supply, more people will buy the now cheaper items, keeping price partly modulated. So LP won't crash.
80% ISK + 15% LP. 95%. NO OVERALL LOSS EVEN IF YOU GET NOTHING FROM THE ESS.

Upgraded ESS.
80% ISK + 20% LP LP. 100%. GAIN ABOVE NO ESS ALREADY.

Upgraded ESS + Payout
80% ISK + 25% ISK + 20% LP. 125%. MASSIVE PAYOUT GAIN.

So, Deploying the ESS is actually very low risk now. You stand to loose the initial 30 Million if you don't get any upgrade ticks done before it gets stolen from & blown up. But unless LP crashes badly (Since it's actually above 1k for most LP anyway, so can drop a bit before making 1k an invalid number) you make the lost 15% isk back in LP, if not quite as convenient. And if you actually manage to upgrade it and get the payout from the ESS when hostiles come through or you are simply done ratting, you make a bucket load of profit.

It's looking good now.


How will -10 sec status people cash in their LP?


LowSec stations and hauling alts, like most people with -10.
Although I doubt you will be -10 long if you grind any meaningful amount of LP this way.

Turelus CEO Utassi Security
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#1936 - 2014-01-22 13:13:06 UTC
Pods? Shuttles? Anything that can beat the faction navies? Just like -10 people always have?
-10 does not mean 'Concorded in a pod as soon as in high sec'
Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
#1937 - 2014-01-22 13:16:14 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
posting here in efforts of getting this thread to 100 pages \o/


Or you could drop the condescending attitude and post something constructive about the concerns people have over this pile of horseshit.
Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
#1938 - 2014-01-22 13:18:37 UTC
Fix Lag wrote:
Well, I put my money where my mouth is, and I've moved six characters into a wormhole. If I'm going to get shot at I might as well get paid for it instead of being pushed further into space poverty by the oppressive reactionaries working for CCP.


Same here. I have moved 4 characters out of null sec to more lucrative areas.
ZynnLee Akkori
Perkone
Caldari State
#1939 - 2014-01-22 13:35:02 UTC  |  Edited by: ZynnLee Akkori
War Kitten wrote:
ZynnLee Akkori wrote:
Other questions I have not seen answers for:
...


Go read the description in the blog and the first few dev posts - it will answer most of those questions.

...and bubbles don't work like that.

Okay....
CCP SoniClover wrote:

3) The warp disruption effect put on ships interacting with the ESS is in addition to the bubble.


Then I found this waaaaaaaaaaay back on page 3:
CCP SoniClover wrote:
Telon Londan wrote:
How long will it take to scoop the ESS? Will it be possible to sit at the ESS with an alt and scoop it immediately as soon as a hostile enters local?


It´s quick, so this is possible. Note that this resets the payout value and allows anyone to place an ESS of their own somewhere in the system to access the pool.


This suggests that the ISK 'bonus' is not technically stored in the ESS device, and if it is destroyed or popped, a new one can be dropped and the payout retrieved. But this still leaves open the question of whether the bonus % resets if the ESS is destroyed.

That's all I could find. Still leaves some questions.


  • Can we have more than 1 ESS in system? If so, how do we know which one is being accessed/attacked?

    Does the payout 'upgrade' reset if the ESS is destroyed (not scooped)? So if my corp were to rat for a few hours and finally get the ESS to the top bonus payout, then have it popped by some big meanie, does the bonus reset? If the ESS is never destroyed or scooped, when *does* the bonus reset?

    Does having more than 1 ESS out double the payout effect or bounty nerf? Can he payout bank be accessed from either device?

    Has there been any thought to this being used as a bubble between 2 warp points instead of a pve tool? Presumably, I could drop this mid-way between 2 gates and it would pull anyone crossing it out of warp, including ships that are currently immune to this. How does it compare to existing bubble devices?
    Nagarythe Tinurandir
    Einheit X-6
    #1940 - 2014-01-22 14:20:13 UTC
    ZynnLee Akkori wrote:


    This suggests that the ISK 'bonus' is not technically stored in the ESS device, and if it is destroyed or popped, a new one can be dropped and the payout retrieved. But this still leaves open the question of whether the bonus % resets if the ESS is destroyed.

    That's all I could find. Still leaves some questions.


  • Can we have more than 1 ESS in system? If so, how do we know which one is being accessed/attacked?

    Does the payout 'upgrade' reset if the ESS is destroyed (not scooped)? So if my corp were to rat for a few hours and finally get the ESS to the top bonus payout, then have it popped by some big meanie, does the bonus reset? If the ESS is never destroyed or scooped, when *does* the bonus reset?

    Does having more than 1 ESS out double the payout effect or bounty nerf? Can he payout bank be accessed from either device?

    Has there been any thought to this being used as a bubble between 2 warp points instead of a pve tool? Presumably, I could drop this mid-way between 2 gates and it would pull anyone crossing it out of warp, including ships that are currently immune to this. How does it compare to existing bubble devices?


    description on first page says only one per system and one of the devs said the bonus resets everytime the honey pot is emptied or a new ESS is placed to replace a destroyed one (go through the blue posts it was in the first quarter of the thread).