These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Out of Pod Experience

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Star Citizen v EVE

First post First post First post
Author
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#841 - 2014-01-05 21:40:48 UTC
voetius wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
ISD Gallifreyan wrote:
Off topic Post regarding another game with no input to the discussion at hand removed.


I feel like no game will be everything for everybody.
I encourage everyone who is curious about Star Citizen to try it when it releases.

Eve will be there when you find out it is not perfect either.
Come back to Eve and tell your CSM rep how Eve can be better.

Everyone Here who stays subbed and work hard everyday, (Either at CCP or as Players Creating Content) will be trying to make Eve the best it can be.

Lessons will be learned. Either way.

Arguing about a game that is not actually competition until it releases is just ship spinning.



Are you aware that, despite CCP having 6 years of headstart, I will play with an avatar first in Star Citizen, second in Elite: Dangeorus and maybe (MAYBE!!) third in EVE Online?

Picture me unimpressed.


That is as maybe but both of these games are at their core games about spaceships. Elite is one of the first games I played and the Wing Commander | Freelancer | X-Wing | Tie-Fighter games all have space combat as their core gameplay. Not that I have any objection to avatar gameplay, the original concept of WiS as most ppl understood it before Incarna was as an extension of the Eve Universe where avatars would let us do stuff like gambling, smuggling, assasination etc not just stand around posturing as in Terra What?


My ideas for avatar gameplay spanned from the very mundane (waltzing and fashion collecting) to the very EVE (corrupting NPCs) to the very wild (swordfighting in blood games).

The idea was: if it can't be done in space gameplay (because of :exponential complexity:, :lobbies: or :old code:), do it in avatar gameplay.

Instead, CCP botched everything and now they're spending three years just to add more nullsec to the game. And that despite that they're fully aware that hisec PvE is the main reason why people pays the game for two years and then leaves.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#842 - 2014-01-05 22:07:42 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
ISD Gallifreyan wrote:
Off topic Post regarding another game with no input to the discussion at hand removed.


I feel like no game will be everything for everybody.
I encourage everyone who is curious about Star Citizen to try it when it releases.

Eve will be there when you find out it is not perfect either.
Come back to Eve and tell your CSM rep how Eve can be better.

Everyone Here who stays subbed and work hard everyday, (Either at CCP or as Players Creating Content) will be trying to make Eve the best it can be.

Lessons will be learned. Either way.

Arguing about a game that is not actually competition until it releases is just ship spinning.



Are you aware that, despite CCP having 6 years of headstart, I will play with an avatar first in Star Citizen, second in Elite: Dangeorus and maybe (MAYBE!!) third in EVE Online?

Picture me unimpressed.


I think you mean that you expect you will. Or even more accurately: that you hope you will. Remember that SC is still nothing more than a web page full of promises and a lot of people who are very much in a position to get an expensive lesson in what cognitive dissonance means.

And it will remain that way for a minimum of another :18 months:...

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#843 - 2014-01-05 23:27:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Malcanis wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
ISD Gallifreyan wrote:
Off topic Post regarding another game with no input to the discussion at hand removed.


I feel like no game will be everything for everybody.
I encourage everyone who is curious about Star Citizen to try it when it releases.

Eve will be there when you find out it is not perfect either.
Come back to Eve and tell your CSM rep how Eve can be better.

Everyone Here who stays subbed and work hard everyday, (Either at CCP or as Players Creating Content) will be trying to make Eve the best it can be.

Lessons will be learned. Either way.

Arguing about a game that is not actually competition until it releases is just ship spinning.



Are you aware that, despite CCP having 6 years of headstart, I will play with an avatar first in Star Citizen, second in Elite: Dangeorus and maybe (MAYBE!!) third in EVE Online?

Picture me unimpressed.


I think you mean that you expect you will. Or even more accurately: that you hope you will. Remember that SC is still nothing more than a web page full of promises and a lot of people who are very much in a position to get an expensive lesson in what cognitive dissonance means.

And it will remain that way for a minimum of another :18 months:...


Do you know what annoys me of you the CCPites? Rather than tell how great is going to be EVE, you just tell how bad could be Star Citizen.

I will let you figure on your own what does that mean on the actual merits of what you defend.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#844 - 2014-01-06 05:09:05 UTC
Truth kinda stings, eh?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#845 - 2014-01-06 10:34:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
And meanhwile, crowdfunding for Star Citizen has reached another milestone, unlocking the 36 million stretch goal.

In the related Letter from the Chairman , Chris Roberts stresses how the goal has been unlocked as the Austin office was relocating (thus, all operations were shut down) and no special Holidays promotion has been released -so the goal has been achieved solely through word of mouth and people who trust the project.

There's also some details on future works, from the inmediate of setting the release goals for the dogfighting module, with input from player feedback, to a general meeting of all teams to schedule and coordinate in detail this year's work.

The stretch goal unlocked by the 36 million goal it's a special system, namely a black hole event horizon:

Tamsa System – Located near the fringe of Banu space, Tamsa System features a massive central star that has collapsed into a black hole. Only two planets remain in the system, a chthonian world and a gas giant located far from the black hole’s event horizon.

The stretch goal voted by the players for the 38 million mark is a fully aquatic world (I love it, as I voted that!):

Cano System is home to a G-Type Main Sequence Star that’s almost identical to Earth’s. Of the four planets in the system, only one is inhabited: Carteyna. Located on the edge of habitable zone, Carteyna is a classic waterworld. Fortunately, its planetary axis constantly keeps the northern hemisphere away from the sun, which allowed for the water to freeze into the landmasses used as the initial landing zones in 2587. Multiple attempts have been made to try to convert the thick atmosphere into something breathable, but the process never seemed to stick. In fact, over the years, every time there’s a new technological development in geo-engineering, they test it out here on Carteyna only to yield the same result. Almost fifty years ago, scientists discovered microscopic organisms in the very early phases of life in the depths of the oceans. This caused a massive uproar throughout the UEE at the prospect that they had been attempting to terraform a developing world. Carteyna was immediately placed under the Fair Chance Act. Unfortunately, Humans had been living here for almost over three hundred years and the families that had been here for generations felt that they had earned rights as residents. After years of debate in the political and scientific community, the population was allowed to stay, but only under certain conditions: future terraforming attempts have been outlawed and the Human population has been consolidated to a single arcology to minimize their impact on their environment and the development of whatever species is growing in the deep.

Terryfic concept, I can't wait to see that planet! Lol

Also is going on the votation for the 39th million goal, the penultimate System being picked by the community.

Last but not least, Chris Roberts brags a bit about how player feedback has led to a redesign of the Freelancer cockpit, now featuring improved visbility as was demanded by the players after testing it at the Hangar module.

Star Ctizen may be a case of follie à deux, but, what a splendiferous madness!

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Onyx Nyx
The Veldspar Protectorate
#846 - 2014-01-06 12:44:07 UTC
As a space-nerd, it is heart warming to see Chris Roberts to be so passionate about planets that they needed 36 million dollars to get it just right. Because making planets in games IS hard!

I kill kittens, and puppies and bunnies. I maim toddlers and teens and then more.

  • Richard (http://www.lfgcomic.com/)
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#847 - 2014-01-07 02:55:56 UTC
ISD Gallifreyan wrote:
Off topic Post regarding another game with no input to the discussion at hand removed.


I feel like no game will be everything for everybody.
I encourage everyone who is curious about Star Citizen to try it when it releases.

Eve will be there when you find out it is not perfect either.
Come back to Eve and tell your CSM rep how Eve can be better.

Everyone Here who stays subbed and work hard everyday, (Either at CCP or as Players Creating Content) will be trying to make Eve the best it can be.

Lessons will be learned. Either way.

Arguing about a game that is not actually competition until it releases is just ship spinning.




For now i agree, but do keep in mind 2 things that star citizen will offer that has major implications for the game universe, and wich EVE will never offer even in a million years:

1: Dedicated tools for end users to create their own content, so they're not dependent on what CIG does, or their displeasure of the content in the game.

2: The ability to run their own servers with said user created content.


Years down the line, these 2 things allows star citizen to be radically different as there may be several versions depending on the content on that specific server, and all the end user has to do is download the custom content and install it.....Star wars mod, babylon 5 mod, gallactica mod.....List goes on and on.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#848 - 2014-01-08 21:22:02 UTC
I will just say this. I have played eve for nearly 10 years, will be 10 official the end of march, but Da will be 10 april 1st, I have heard how many games will kill eve the short list: Star Wars Galaxy, Star Trek Online, Black Prophecy, and a few others. None of them did, and tbh no game will 'kill eve'. If SC actually lives past its first year, not to mention really sees the light of day, and doesnlt suck, it will either: Draw players away from eve to such a degree that it won't really do anything, and they will pull in people from other games, like Star Trek Online. OR It will pull enough people that eve can not survive.

Either of these would cause the following:

1) CCP doesn't care and ignores the non threat, or the threat of SC

2) CCP is forced to relook at what they have and start making changes in order to compete which could save or kill eve

3) CCP panics and does stupid stuff ala the SWG NPE and eve dies a horrible death.

The problem right now with SC is its not anything but paper. 'oh I need an extra million to make this' *gets it* doesn't mean anything. For it could very simply be they can not do what they wanted due to unforeseen limitations, or the whole thing never sees the light of day. Hype is hype till there is something to actually play. Much like CCP's WoD which people are drooling over but is not even close to being finished. So who knows.

The point is, you can not compare the two, as no one has played SC yet. And paper != reality. Ask countless other games that promised the world and fell flat.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#849 - 2014-01-08 23:22:12 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
ISD Gallifreyan wrote:
Off topic Post regarding another game with no input to the discussion at hand removed.


I feel like no game will be everything for everybody.
I encourage everyone who is curious about Star Citizen to try it when it releases.

Eve will be there when you find out it is not perfect either.
Come back to Eve and tell your CSM rep how Eve can be better.

Everyone Here who stays subbed and work hard everyday, (Either at CCP or as Players Creating Content) will be trying to make Eve the best it can be.

Lessons will be learned. Either way.

Arguing about a game that is not actually competition until it releases is just ship spinning.




For now i agree, but do keep in mind 2 things that star citizen will offer that has major implications for the game universe, and wich EVE will never offer even in a million years:

1: Dedicated tools for end users to create their own content, so they're not dependent on what CIG does, or their displeasure of the content in the game.

2: The ability to run their own servers with said user created content.


Years down the line, these 2 things allows star citizen to be radically different as there may be several versions depending on the content on that specific server, and all the end user has to do is download the custom content and install it.....Star wars mod, babylon 5 mod, gallactica mod.....List goes on and on.


Modded servers/clients can make a hell of a difference. NOT implementing that would be a terribly serious mistake on CIG's side. Players always win the race against developers (as consuming content is WAY faster than producing it), but when the player become producers... KA-BOOM! Magic ensues.

CIG is already stepping in that direction, as the Next Great Starship contest is drawing in highly skilled "amateurs" right into the core of the game. And anyone willing to mod will learn "how it is done" by watching the contest...

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#850 - 2014-01-09 01:27:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarvos Telesto
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase if a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.

EvE isn't game, its style of living.

digitalwanderer
DW inc
#851 - 2014-01-09 01:37:48 UTC
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase where a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.




Eve does it too......Look no further than the abomination of gametime cards, and people buying those up from CCP's website, and then selling them in the game, and with all that isk, it allows the purchase of supercarriers and titans if the users in question have the available funds for it.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#852 - 2014-01-09 13:32:57 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase where a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.




Eve does it too......Look no further than the abomination of gametime cards, and people buying those up from CCP's website, and then selling them in the game, and with all that isk, it allows the purchase of supercarriers and titans if the users in question have the available funds for it.


True but all the ISK in the New Eden won't give you the ability to fly a super. Yes you have to buy the skill books and implants but it's not like "Oh I bought 50 PLEX with RL money today so now I can fly a Nyx".

I don't play Star Citizen so I don't know if RL money gives you the ability to fly ships.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#853 - 2014-01-09 14:45:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
IIshira wrote:
digitalwanderer wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase where a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.




Eve does it too......Look no further than the abomination of gametime cards, and people buying those up from CCP's website, and then selling them in the game, and with all that isk, it allows the purchase of supercarriers and titans if the users in question have the available funds for it.


True but all the ISK in the New Eden won't give you the ability to fly a super. Yes you have to buy the skill books and implants but it's not like "Oh I bought 50 PLEX with RL money today so now I can fly a Nyx".

I don't play Star Citizen so I don't know if RL money gives you the ability to fly ships.


Get ISK, go to Characters Bazaar, buy char, buy supercap, enjoy. Blink

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#854 - 2014-01-09 18:23:27 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
IIshira wrote:
digitalwanderer wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase where a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.




Eve does it too......Look no further than the abomination of gametime cards, and people buying those up from CCP's website, and then selling them in the game, and with all that isk, it allows the purchase of supercarriers and titans if the users in question have the available funds for it.


True but all the ISK in the New Eden won't give you the ability to fly a super. Yes you have to buy the skill books and implants but it's not like "Oh I bought 50 PLEX with RL money today so now I can fly a Nyx".

I don't play Star Citizen so I don't know if RL money gives you the ability to fly ships.


Get ISK, go to Characters Bazaar, buy char, buy supercap, enjoy. Blink


True but SOMEONE had to train that account for years. Of course playing someone else's pilot you can do that. What you can't do is give CCP $ and they'll say sure well make it where you can fly a super.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#855 - 2014-01-09 18:47:08 UTC
Can't do that in Star Citizen either. Capital ships aren't available for purchase at the RSI store. Bengal carriers and such are only available ingame.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#856 - 2014-01-09 18:55:23 UTC
Awesome concept art recently uploaded by concept artist Elijah McNeal and linked by someone in RSI chat: http://cghub.com/images/view/779002/
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#857 - 2014-01-09 21:23:14 UTC
IIshira wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
IIshira wrote:
digitalwanderer wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
I was excited about Star Citizen but i change view on thig game, this whole project is designed to earn money form MT.

Look at Star Citizen store, a mastepice of microtransaction design, this whole game is more about microtransaction and greed than game it self.

Im very pessimistic about it, dont be dissapointed after relase where a lot of people pay to win. or just pay to get restricted ship models etc.




Eve does it too......Look no further than the abomination of gametime cards, and people buying those up from CCP's website, and then selling them in the game, and with all that isk, it allows the purchase of supercarriers and titans if the users in question have the available funds for it.


True but all the ISK in the New Eden won't give you the ability to fly a super. Yes you have to buy the skill books and implants but it's not like "Oh I bought 50 PLEX with RL money today so now I can fly a Nyx".

I don't play Star Citizen so I don't know if RL money gives you the ability to fly ships.


Get ISK, go to Characters Bazaar, buy char, buy supercap, enjoy. Blink


True but SOMEONE had to train that account for years. Of course playing someone else's pilot you can do that. What you can't do is give CCP $ and they'll say sure well make it where you can fly a super.



Still doesn't change that it is pay to win even if you have to buy plexes and a player that's for sale that has trained those skills....You don't care how long it took for that char to train those skills at all, so plexes should be gone and so should selling chars.....Bring back the old style of EVE gameplay of 2003 where you were on your own, and there was no way to accelerate aspects of the game like there is today.


The game has been watered down beyond belief these days.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#858 - 2014-01-09 21:31:42 UTC  |  Edited by: digitalwanderer
raven666wings wrote:
Can't do that in Star Citizen either. Capital ships aren't available for purchase at the RSI store. Bengal carriers and such are only available ingame.



For now, only the idris corvette will be available in extremely limited numbers, for wich people that pledged for those payed 1200$, so they're not exactly cheap, but the current amount already pledged to complete the game, and go much beyond, already includes frigates and destroyers and cruisers and battlecruisers that will be player ownable and flyable in game.


So if a lowly corvette like an idris is 1200$, wich is the smallest of the capital ships( it's only 140 meters long with a crew of 10 afterall), how much do you think will the bigger capital ships mentioned above be price wise if bought thru the CIG store, or how much work will be involved in game to get one of these?


I used to remember EVE back in the day when getting into a cruiser took 1 month and 3 months to get into a battleship, and all you could do is mine with the friggin thing since the owner didn't have enough time to train the combat skills for it.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#859 - 2014-01-09 22:35:37 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Yep, technically this game is the one that could be interpreted as pay to win, since you can even come here and convert real money into a highly trained character that will give you an edge over new players on new characters.
Micro-transactions on game items like ships/weapons/boosters/vanity/etc when well implemented (as opposed to the way they were implemented in games ruined by EA) give the company extra revenue and allow casual players to enjoy the game aswell. They don't make the game pay to win as long as you can get all the sold items with ingame money too at reasonable prices.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#860 - 2014-01-19 22:14:58 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Malcanis wrote:
I think you mean that you expect you will. Or even more accurately: that you hope you will. Remember that SC is still nothing more than a web page full of promises and a lot of people who are very much in a position to get an expensive lesson in what cognitive dissonance means.

And it will remain that way for a minimum of another :18 months:...


As an aspiring CCP employee you should be more careful with your posts when opinating about the competition and not let flames consume your speech like this. Usage of sentences like "They are totally different games", "I hope Star Citizen succeeds" and "I will be playing both" are more appropriate public addressing measures and will not jeopardize public relations and diplomacy.