EVE General Discussion

The main purpose of banking system for its owners is ability to gain political and social power with crediting system. In eve if you try to force your will through crediting system.. you just won't be able to get your money back, it means you don't have real power over money flows. That is why I say banks in eve are just poor imitation and not "alive".



And again you try to bend the meaning. Kindergarden is a place for little children, and 25+ y.o. "capsuleers" in a "dark universe" are obviously not little children. The essence of a sandbox-style game is ability to build and to break. Some people build things, other people break those things, and for the first group of people the "breakers" are scum and evil.
If somebody wants to just sit like a kid and draw his doodles, without anybody to throw sand in his eyes.. okay. He chose the wrong game.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those "breakers" but I would find EVE boring without them.


Oh no, RL-ish banks in eve would be much worse. Against RMTing alliances you can fight, you can disrupt their botting, you can "win with skill" or at the very least be a serious threat. But against an organization which can - without limits - make corporations bankroupts, bribe people, hire any mercenaries, freely manipulate prices on the market -- you cannot win, you just obey or forget about any political strength.
Of course banks can't gain such power in a moment, but in eve after 1-2 years they will control the market (given they have RL-ish mechanics ingame). And I don't want to see in Eve's economy a situation similar to that in real life.

p.s. Seems this discussion's got pointless. Switching to read-only mode.

"Rumble in the Bronx"


And the whole RMT aspect is just a cherry on top of the whole episode. Any kind of giveaway program which is not completely transparent is unacceptable, and I hope CCP doesn't just respond to that aspect, ignore the whole secret giveaway part, and then silently discontinue the program (a-la NeX store).



CCP didn't fire T20 or (as far as I know) destroy the spawned BPOs when what he was doing was secret. They're not going to fire CCP Navigator (nor, in my opinion, should they) when he was acting with full knowledge of the decision makers at CCP.

I don't ignore them. They are not "evil" per se but have been mismanaged through a series of manouvres to greatly spread their usage while still saving their intrinsic value. In an healthy environment PLEXes provide for:

1) a first line of defense against RMT
2) a way to reward with "free" game time those who are good at amassing ISK
3) advanced end game for traders.

but they have bad sides and corresponding counter points:

1) the first line of defense against RMT is done by competing with RMTers with CCP created RMT. This is ethically muddy at best.. These days threads show how bad it gets when CCP enters the RMT domain and consort with it.

2) not only they reward who's good at amassing ISK, but they GREATLY reward botters, multiboxers, RMTers (both as laundering and wealth transfer medium) and also - and here's what I HATE - those who want to tilt the sandbox in their favor by using vast RL wallets to buy their way to EvE success.

This is the definition of "golden ammo" if there's one.

And all seem BLIND and don't (want to) see it.

In a ultra-competitive sandbox game featuring some of the brightest minds in the MMO landscape, undeserving individuals and groups purchase their way to success.

3) PLEXes have multiplied the destabilizing effects of ISK overabundance, the latter having gone out of control for entire years in a game where economy is all.




It's a symbolic location where big battles have been fought. I won't claim it's as famous as New York, Rome or Venice but it had a role in our collective history and probably worth a Google. At least to not show ignorant on general culture.




No, "bad people" would be evil geniuses a la Bad Bobby or many a brilliant corp thieves, alliance saboteurs, even Goons (even if much of their "evilness" is role played, many are cool guys.

A*holes on the other hand, are just that: no added value a*holes and background fastidious noise.




I don't suggest removing supercaps inflation but just to remove the factors that let it happen.
If those factors disappeared, supercaps due to natural "destruction cycle" would return down to an healthy value.

Sadly, botting is not going to go away just because you hope so. 10 years and it's still there.

Also, you don't know how many can't care the less to lose $1000 in a ship explosion. I live in a place full of rich Russians and Germans (but also English people and others) who give $200 to $500 tips to resturant waiters and where shops sell $50k wrist watches and $1000 perfumes.

I don't want to outsmart them and be insanely rich in EvE... and then just see one of them come in and create tens of billions with a credi card.

It's the SAME IDENTICAL TOPIC of this thread: people who play the sandbox that see others getting favoritism.

/me blinks, at first blush this seems likje a reasonable idea but then I thought about it.

People who have left Eve having a say in how the game should be or become. Think about all the folks who came looking far a themepark, their hands held, all wanting to make Eve into something it is not.

No, if you want a say then somebody has ta pay. Hopefully on your exit poll you made clear why you were leaving . . . THAT was your chance.

m

I did do that on my Exit poll on one of my accounts and although I shut down 5 that's still ok cos that's my voice. While I see where your coming from this is a different situation to the one you mention due to me being a long term player who enjoyed what eve was. I tend to agree with kate more but you have the right to think like that.

Kate, I agree that the results will be slightly skewed no matter how you slice it. That is why we are poolling in multiple methods, here in the forums and via the larger shotgun spread of the CCP mail version.

Here in the forums is an sub community. The people who metagame who do more than just PLAY the game. (Or play a larger part of it) WE care, enough to spend time writing and discussing the issues of the game.

But do you think we represent the majority of the players?

Do they deserve a voice and a say if they cannot be bothered to come onto the forums and educate themselves?
If they do deserve that voice how do we give it to them?

m

as a sample; yes i think the people on the forum provide a fair representation of the playerbase. we have miners on the forums, we have mission runners, we have people who love null sec and all it's shenannigans. the forums are probably one of the few places you will find a group of players so diverse. granted, that doesn't mean the forums are the only place you should pull opinions from though.

that's a bit of an unfair question; if they don't come and educate themselves why should they be allowed to have a say? half of the reason the original topic got locked is because i decided to (rather foolishly) point out some one had genuinely missed the point at which they decided to derail the thread instead of educating themselves (and i subsequently couldn't let it go and kept pressing as to why he thought his real life was of any importance to the discussion what so ever thus eventually forcing the thread to be locked, which hilariously demonstrated that CCP ALSO missed the point by directing us to two unrelated threads).
regardless of where they go, if they don't understand the issue then no they shouldn't have a voice. then again how you demonstrate understanding of an issue that has become this messy and polluted in order to answer a few questions that might make ccp do or not do something is an exercise in futility.

all in all i'm still slightly perplexed as to how CCP thought this issue wasn't going to eventually blow up in their face to begin with...



people who have canceled their accounts have done so because they feel strongly about the issue. why should their account be valued any less?

perhaps the compromise is to survey all current players, and all players who's accounts have gone inactive less than x time ago. and by the time the survey goes out it'll probably be at least 2 months since the whole situation became common knowledge.

CCP giving any in-game entity anything in-game is wrong.

CCP have demonstrated time and time again they have plenty of awesome out of game things they can give to people as "rewards" and "thank yous" and such like.
**** me, look at the models they gave away at eve vegas. they are pretty awesome, give those to people who do cool stuff.

Do I think the CSM represents everybody? hell no, wish it did, though.

They changed the election method with the our most current run, now I think they need to change the outreach and campaign styles. If the mountain won't come to Mohamed . . .

and because I don't think we 14 are the 'true representatives' is why I support trying to talk to the greater public via polls as well as here in forums and in channels when I get the chance.

CCP rewarding effort by communities and individuals is not wrong, but I am sure that is not what you meant. What you are saying is that all rewards need to be out of game as opposed to ingame advantages. But if it is non trade and just 'Barbie stuff will it be appreciated/valued? Best I have heard so far is planetary naming which they talked about doing for a Dust Tourney recently. I mean, How many planets are there?

m

Because they're not capsuleers anymore. Leaving eve they waive the right to affect it.
An example to clarify this: If you leave some country and stop being its citizen you won't have vote there.
It's just logical and fair.