Player Features and Ideas Discussion

& now your entire DPS is based on ogres. And you have no speed.
Meaning that during that 8 seconds anything small with a MWD burns out of your web range, then laughs at your inability to hurt them. While anything large enough for you to catch during your 8 seconds locking time can handle 5 ogres.

Still. Dropping Drone DPS, raising gun DPS solves all this issue. Because then simply the sacrifice of fitting a high slot utility instead of a gun makes for a significant DPS drop. Rather than all your DPS being PG & CPU free.

Ignoring that fact that ship has double web and scrambler on it?

Moving drone DPS to laser DPS makes the ship less effective for exploration fits and only helps surprise PvP fits.

Double webs + scram have limited range.
You have Cloak lock delay + lock time.
You have slow cruiser initially, with only AB to try and close range.
You can't start within 2500m or you decloak yourself anyway.

Sure you might catch the odd person.
But even then you only have 700 DPS which still won't apply perfectly due to sig size unless you are shooting a BS, since even if it's under their tracking, if it's under sig size & moving even 1m/s sig size affects DPS & 45k EHP. And are entirely drone reliant.
This is no more threatening that the cloaky T3's already are.

So what you are trying to tell me is that Cloaky T3's are OP & will break the game by being able to combat probe..... Oh wait. They haven't broken the game for years of existence already. From this I can only conclude that you are defending your T3 ships unique abilities in order to force everyone else to train T3's, rather than having viable options in the Pirate/T2 ship range to combat probe.

Yes, pushing DPS to guns won't drop the surprise gank fit DPS. Well, it actually will a bit since it will be a bonus to lasers, while the gank fits have been based on blasters. Nor does it need to drop the surprise gank fits anyway, since anyone flying in an anom should be expecting that kind of hot drop, given they only have 5 seconds from when someone hits local to warp out now before the interceptor lands on grid and tackles them possibly, if the interceptor guesses the right anom. After which the Battle cruisers follow fairly soon. So.... Gank DPS with very few targets is not a problem.

What do you have against the noble platypus?

A: Cloaky T3 haven't broken the game for years & years. As I actually pointed out. And they have close to the same paper DPS, better applied DPS, and far more tank. As has been pointed out repeatedly through this thread.
And B: Oh no! Choices! Sacrifices! How dare you have to make a choice.
CCP have said, post 1 these are meant to be Laser/Drone ships. Currently they are not. Pushing them more towards laser DPS a bit also creates more fitting choices, and makes room for the Nestor to have 125 drone bay as a bonus above the cruiser (at 100 or 75), while removing the complaint of drone assist (which works with the other drone cruisers as well obviously) bypassing cloak targeting delay.

Christ!! where to start .....

1. People do not react instantly to you decloaking. The only people you don't catch are the ones that are already aligned and up to speed, and this is very rare. You can bump to prevent a warpoff before you get a lock. Nothing bigger than a frigate will ever react fast enough to get out of overheated web range when you decloak 2km away. MWD blooms the sig and makes you lock almost instantly.

2. You're disregarding the neuts entirely. A cruiser that takes less Ogre DPS is completely ****** by the neuts and will be capped out in two cycles.

3. You can use sentry drones. You have the drone bay for it. 5 Gardes is 666 DPS and has 100% application to anything that's double webbed, regardless of what it is.

4. Cloaky Proteus tops out at 570 DPS. It has three midslots which means only one web max, which will definitely cause damage application problems with the blasters against anything smaller than a BS if you use Void. It's much better than a T3 cloaky. 700 DPS and 3 medium neuts is a lot more lethal than 570 DPS.

This ship is not going to be fit this way often (due to low EHP and CPU) In this guise yes it is OP but at a price. T2 rigs + faction CPU mod + ship cost. You want to hope it is OP. You can make pretty much any ship OP if you spend enough isk on it, don't cry simply because 1 person has no respect for his wallet and posted an OP fit.

What about interdiction nullifier?
I think it should be on both ships.

The second cruiser with this ability for less money - that's great.

I think that SOE is more about exploration than combat...

[dreams]
Nestor - if it will have a covert ops cloak, interdiction nullifier, fast align and bonuses to scanning (sacrificing dps, ehp and all other stuff) - will be a really unique ship.
[/dreams]

If the purpose of a vessel is intended to be in one direction (lowsec and nullsec exploration, in this instance), and a few others gimp the fit in order to make it a glass cannon, who cares? That's been a part of Eve since the beginning. The fits posted that output such huge DPS numbers are absolutely nothing you couldn't do with a cloaky Gila, Ishtar, Dominix, or Rattlesnake - except those ships can't warp cloaked.

Big deal. You still have to deal with targeting delay, being unable to cloak while targeted, the probability of having to abandon drones, and all of the other limitations that accompany using drones as a primary source of DPS in PVP.

We're not talking assigning massed drones to an instalock frigate here; these will be used on a limited basis, and in limited numbers, often solo, or with other ships such as Recons for support, making them a drone-based version of a stealth bomber, in that regard - a powerful weapon system with cloaking ability, and built-in limitations.

If you want to see how this works in PRACTICE, instead of theory, get on the test server, and ambush a ratting Ishtar with one of these fitted for 700 DPS - tell us how many times you get your butt handed to you.