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Dev Blog: No Honor Among Thieves - Siphon Units in Rubicon

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CCP Falcon
#1 - 2013-10-17 15:33:02 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Gargant
Good afternoon capsuleers!

CCP SoniClover is here with a new Dev Blog, to shed some light on the POS siphoning units that will be coming with EVE Online: Rubicon on November 19th.

While the statistics and numbers are subject to change pending final balancing, please take a look at his new Dev Blog to read all about the moneymaking opportunities that will be coming with this new feature in Rubicon.

Enjoy!

CCP Falcon || EVE Universe Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon

Happy Birthday To FAWLTY7! <3
CCP Paradox
#2 - 2013-10-17 15:33:43 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Paradox
Great!
Just to let you guys know, they will be available on Singularity next week. :)
Keep you eyes open over on the test server feedback forum.
(should be Tuesday or Wednesday)

CCP Paradox | EVE QA | Team Phenomenon

Space Magician
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#3 - 2013-10-17 15:39:03 UTC
Sounds pretty neat. One issue: Using the API, people can tell when stuff is missing from silos. Has this been thought about?

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
l0rd carlos
the king asked me to guard the mountain
#4 - 2013-10-17 15:42:13 UTC
So the owner will not get any kind of notification?

Neat. Maybe this will help roaming gang to "force" people to undock?

Could you do something similar with the pirate array thingy?

Youtube Channel about Micro and Small scale PvP with commentary: Fleet Commentary by l0rd carlos
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#5 - 2013-10-17 15:43:58 UTC
So with stacking you can steal an entire POS's moon goo supply with enough siphons out there?

Nice.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.
Graygor
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-10-17 15:46:30 UTC
Looking good CCP!

"I think you should buy a new Mayan calendar. Mine has muscle cars on it." - Kenneth O'Hara

"I dont think that can happen, you can see Gray has his invuln field on in his portrait." - Commissar "Cake" Kate
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-10-17 15:46:37 UTC
Why has alchemy been exempted when you could have solved this by changing the units of output for alchemy? The biggest market for using these is going to be lowsec reaction chains which have huge usage of alchemy. Was it simply because someone could not figure out how to change 1 to 200?

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
Rain6638
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2013-10-17 15:48:40 UTC
like sucking on a hose in a gas tank

[ 2013.06.21 09:52:05 ] (notify) For initiating combat your security status has been adjusted by -0.1337
Orakkus
ImperiaI Federation
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2013-10-17 15:49:41 UTC
Cool, glad for the update. Got a few questions:

1. D-Scan/Probing - I assume they will be visible on D-scan, but can they be probed down? Personally, I think it would be a bit too easy if they were probeable.

2. How many siphon units can be placed on each individual POS? One, or can there be multiple siphons per POS?

3. Is there plans to expand the Siphon's capabilities to include other industrial aspects?

He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#10 - 2013-10-17 15:49:47 UTC
Aryth wrote:
Why has alchemy been exempted when you could have solved this by changing the units of output for alchemy? The biggest market for using these is going to be lowsec reaction chains which have huge usage of alchemy. Was it simply because someone could not figure out how to change 1 to 200?


No, the version that is coming out in Rubicon is intended to be a very basic version. Thus, we didn't want it to have too wide application. We'll probably add a couple of new versions in the point release, one of which *could* go for alchemy.
CCP Tuxford
C C P
C C P Alliance
#11 - 2013-10-17 15:50:07 UTC
Two step wrote:
Sounds pretty neat. One issue: Using the API, people can tell when stuff is missing from silos. Has this been thought about?


Yes we did. We do track how much is siphoned from what and where it would end up and the API then reports those numbers. It's a bit evil abusing the API in this way but I think it's for the good of the feature.

https://gate.eveonline.com/Profile/CCP%20Tuxford/StatusUpdates
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2013-10-17 15:52:45 UTC
CCP SoniClover wrote:
Aryth wrote:
Why has alchemy been exempted when you could have solved this by changing the units of output for alchemy? The biggest market for using these is going to be lowsec reaction chains which have huge usage of alchemy. Was it simply because someone could not figure out how to change 1 to 200?


No, the version that is coming out in Rubicon is intended to be a very basic version. Thus, we didn't want it to have too wide application. We'll probably add a couple of new versions in the point release, one of which *could* go for alchemy.


Alrighty. It would be nice if an entire segment of the POS industry is not immune to siphons. This has an interesting market dynamic coming if everyone is impacted.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
Zloco Crendraven
BALKAN EXPRESS
Shadow Cartel
#13 - 2013-10-17 15:53:14 UTC
Looking good, but CCP pls;
- Give us the more complex one as soon as possible. One for alchemy and one to steal resources of our choosing.
- Will it send notifications to the POS owners?

BALEX, bringing piracy on a whole new level.
pmchem
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-10-17 15:54:00 UTC
Rubicon is truly adopting the Roman approach: burnt farms and salted fields.

https://twitter.com/pmchem/ || http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/community-spotlight-garpa/ || Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
Phey Onat
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#15 - 2013-10-17 15:54:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Phey Onat
So, if a tower is just pulling raw minerals off an R64, it gets 100/hour. The siphon takes 60/hour and losses 20% of that so the siphon gets 48/hour.

Does that mean that 2 siphons shuts down a simple moon harvestor extractor -> silo setup? Wherein the first siphon gets 48/hour and the second gets 32/hour?
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#16 - 2013-10-17 15:55:44 UTC
will it appear on dscan? The value of those things would be much higher if it wouldn't. Same for the depot (however it should be possible to probe it down of course).

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#17 - 2013-10-17 15:55:53 UTC
Orakkus wrote:
Cool, glad for the update. Got a few questions:

1. D-Scan/Probing - I assume they will be visible on D-scan, but can they be probed down? Personally, I think it would be a bit too easy if they were probeable.

2. How many siphon units can be placed on each individual POS? One, or can there be multiple siphons per POS?

3. Is there plans to expand the Siphon's capabilities to include other industrial aspects?


1. Mobile structures, including the siphon unit, can be probed down (and d-scanned).

2. No limit.

3. Yes, we hope to add a couple of more variations in the point release at least.
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Crunchy Crunchy
#18 - 2013-10-17 15:57:39 UTC
Make it so you can offline and make it cloak please.
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#19 - 2013-10-17 15:58:27 UTC
I'm concerned about the balance here, specifically the interaction of multiple siphons, them costing nothing, and them being 20m3. Given their cost is a rounding error and even a covops can hold 6 or so, every time you siphon a tower there's going to be two siphons.

There's also no actual cost to doing this. You lose nothing if your siphon is noticed and blown up instantly. They pay for themselves incredibly quickly and even just the waste 'pays' for itself overnight.

I think the cost should be bumped up some so that a successful siphoning is profitable, but unsuccessful siphoning has at least a moderate downside. Chaining siphons also seems unbalanced.

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#20 - 2013-10-17 15:58:56 UTC
CCP Tuxford wrote:
Two step wrote:
Sounds pretty neat. One issue: Using the API, people can tell when stuff is missing from silos. Has this been thought about?


Yes we did. We do track how much is siphoned from what and where it would end up and the API then reports those numbers. It's a bit evil abusing the API in this way but I think it's for the good of the feature.


I was talking about that you don't make it send notifications, but any large corp can have enough assets API keys to be able to detect siphoning within an hour.

Does the siphon show up in the lauching pilot's API as well?

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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