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Announcement regarding rewards and prizes to fansites and third-party contributors

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Miss Ladybird
Doomheim
#681 - 2013-10-16 09:57:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Miss Ladybird
Why does CCP act like this is such a difficult situation to analyse, like its really hard to balance up the rights and wrongs of it.

IT IS EASY. All I presonally want is the following:

1) CCP to implement an 'Above the Fray' rule. This means they will never take sides with in game entities again. They will only intervene in the game where the EULA is being broken.

2) CCP item spawning (AKA game meddling) to be immediately limited to:


  • Valid reimbursment cases
  • AT (and similar CCP run tournament) prizes
  • Seasonal gifts (must be gifted to all)


the above list is comprehensive

3) All of SOMERblink's iScorps to be taken back and destroyed immediately

4) All promotion and support for SOMERblink to cease (in keeping with the Above the Fray principle). I also would like a sober and simply worded announcement that SOMERblink is able to scam, might be scamming, and can scam in the future.

5) SOMERblink to be ordered to cease its RMT business. I want each SOMERblink account to receive a 1 week suspension and a fine applied to the founder in isk, equal to half of the total isk paid out under the RMT scheme (this is very lenient, and fair as CCP is partly to blame for not apprehending SOMER earlier, he probably thought what he was doing was ok).

TOO GREEDY?
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#682 - 2013-10-16 09:58:53 UTC
Gul Amarr wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:

A lot of us will be away for EVE Vegas in the coming days and we hope to meet some of you there for a chat.



So basically you're telling us that nobody will receive any rewards after you rewarded eves mafia twice in a row, doing injustice to their competitors (which is every evey eve player, be it a genuine one day old trial or 2003 vet), keeping the price of rewards artificially high.

At the same time, you're telling us you can't come up with a proper reply, because you're at a Mafia-sponsored meeting called "friends of the italian opera" in Vegas.

Yeah - my faith in CCP has been totally restored Roll.


You really need to get that broomstick out of your rear end, dude. Mafia? Really? Every single person who ever deposited money to SOMER did so out of their own free will. Don't for a second pretend that they are forcing people to give them money.

This is still a GAME. The ISK involved is virtual and doesn't even exist. The event in Vegas is a real event that is paid with real money by real people by many more than just SOMER.

My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things!

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Frying Doom
#683 - 2013-10-16 10:06:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Frying Doom
The other thing that this has shown is how lop sided these give always have been.

Listening to Crossing Zebras, they receive 1 free account and were given 2 free tickets to fan fest(entry tickets not airplane or room costs ect..).

Now Crossing Zebras is a great site, look at what Xander went through to try and interview all of the CSM candidates but they apparently deserve almost nothing, plus all of the other great community sites that are given little or nothing.

But a gambling site gets showered in hundreds of billions of isk and they are a for profit site that sponsors community events because it is good advertising. In RL Alcohol, tobacco, gambling sites and even oil companies support community events and sports, they do it for advertising and so it makes them look good or does CCP believe that tobacco companies supported formula one for so many years because they were such great guys interested in the sport and not in increasing their sales.

CCP really has this ass about, personally I like Somer blink but they are not a community site, they are there for profit both RL and in game.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Miss Ladybird
Doomheim
#684 - 2013-10-16 10:13:20 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
...does CCP believe that tobacco companies supported formula one for so many years because they were such great guys interested in the sport and not in increasing their sales.



Excellent put. This captures my thinking exactly.
RAIN Arthie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#685 - 2013-10-16 11:34:17 UTC
In my honest opinion, I belive we all contribute to this sandbox which is EVE ONLINE.
Careby
#686 - 2013-10-16 11:49:37 UTC
Miss Ladybird wrote:
...
3) All of SOMERblink's iScorps to be taken back and destroyed immediately
...

I understand the sentiment behind trying to "put things right" but this may be like trying to put the toothpaste back in the tube. Some (most?) of the ships were sold on, in some cases multiple times. And however much blame rests with CCP or Somerset Mahm, it is unlikely that most of the 30 recipients were guilty of anything other than circumstance. I really can't think of a completely satisfactory remedy.

Which brings me to my real point. Assuming you are a player who cares about SOMERgate (some apparently don't), and are waiting to see what is done about it before quitting EVE (some didn't), are you willing to give CCP a realistic way out? Or would you rather put them in a no-win situation?

Obviously no corrective action will make everyone happy, and there are some demands which are too extreme for CCP to accept. I'm sure in time CCP will do something, but how much (or how little) is really enough?

Miss Ladybird
Doomheim
#687 - 2013-10-16 12:04:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Miss Ladybird
Careby wrote:
Miss Ladybird wrote:
...
3) All of SOMERblink's iScorps to be taken back and destroyed immediately
...

I understand the sentiment behind trying to "put things right" but this may be like trying to put the toothpaste back in the tube. Some (most?) of the ships were sold on, in some cases multiple times. And however much blame rests with CCP or Somerset Mahm, it is unlikely that most of the 30 recipients were guilty of anything other than circumstance. I really can't think of a completely satisfactory remedy.

Which brings me to my real point. Assuming you are a player who cares about SOMERgate (some apparently don't), and are waiting to see what is done about it before quitting EVE (some didn't), are you willing to give CCP a realistic way out? Or would you rather put them in a no-win situation?

Obviously no corrective action will make everyone happy, and there are some demands which are too extreme for CCP to accept. I'm sure in time CCP will do something, but how much (or how little) is really enough?



In honesty I dont really want an apology, or for SOMER to be punished.

Just needs to be sorted and not happen again.

Then again I am genuinely probably going to stop playing eve. There are far too many other games out there without all this rubbish associated with them.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#688 - 2013-10-16 13:16:34 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Miss Ladybird wrote:
Why does CCP act like this is such a difficult situation to analyse, like its really hard to balance up the rights and wrongs of it.

IT IS EASY. All I presonally want is the following:

1) CCP to implement an 'Above the Fray' rule. This means they will never take sides with in game entities again. They will only intervene in the game where the EULA is being broken.

2) CCP item spawning (AKA game meddling) to be immediately limited to:


  • Valid reimbursment cases
  • AT (and similar CCP run tournament) prizes
  • Seasonal gifts (must be gifted to all)


the above list is comprehensive

3) All of SOMERblink's iScorps to be taken back and destroyed immediately

4) All promotion and support for SOMERblink to cease (in keeping with the Above the Fray principle). I also would like a sober and simply worded announcement that SOMERblink is able to scam, might be scamming, and can scam in the future.

5) SOMERblink to be ordered to cease its RMT business. I want each SOMERblink account to receive a 1 week suspension and a fine applied to the founder in isk, equal to half of the total isk paid out under the RMT scheme (this is very lenient, and fair as CCP is partly to blame for not apprehending SOMER earlier, he probably thought what he was doing was ok).

TOO GREEDY?


Miss Ladybird's suggestion for resolution of the issue seems appropriate, in case CCP's verdict deems Somer Blink's actions illegitimate and forbids other entities/players to engage in similar conduct.

Action number 3), as Careby observed, may be nonetheless impossible to execute without affecting/reimbursing foreign players who might have already bought those ships.

Regarding point 5) it is my opinion that 1 week suspension would be too lenient as punishment for a RMT offense, as that kind of suspension is normally what CCP apllies to simple misconducts like player verbal abuse offenses.
Furthermore I agree that not only Somer Blink is to be held accountable for carrying on with the misconduct, but a fact finding process should also be conducted by CCP's internal affairs department to investigate the alleged involvement of CCP employees with Somer Blink. Neglecting the enforcement of the game's EULA rules of conduct (if that turns out to be the case) and even supporting and advertising the fraudulent scheme are unnacceptable actions that should not remain unpunished, in the same way that other similar actions performed by other CCP employees in the past did not.

This is however one of the possible outcome scenarios for CCP.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#689 - 2013-10-16 13:18:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Rammix wrote:

1 - Capital blobs are a realistic thing, so it's a right thing. If ccp removed such thing it would be a strongly artificial restriction and thus unrealistic.

2 - Those little girls who can't stand different types of scum (who's presence is realistic, again) should just find a game where they can go catching butterflies and happily hugging each other.

3 - Quantity always at some degree turns into quality. So one more time it's realistic when people win with amount of ships, and is also realistic and present in eve that there are ways to use smaller fleets with comparable effectiveness.

4 - With this I have to agree. But completely realistic physics would make the (relatively) hardcore game even more hardcore and fan-oriented.

5 - Oh, many people leave eve in their first days because "it's too complicated" or because they have to choose their path for themselves and nobody takes them by the hand to lead. There are plenty of such people.
Those who stay - either follow their friends who are already in, or don't have a problem with "complexity" and variety of choices.


1 - Capital blobs are a realistic result of ultra-massive RMT brought to the extreme. Stop pretending it's because of legit effort, this very thread shows the situation, the (too) smart players and a company that closes one eye including vs null sec RMT corps.

2 - What do those types of scum add to the game? It's like going to old Bronx and saying: "all those dog piles help keeping the awesome ambience!"

3 - See point 1. I want to see the same guys happily losing 47B worth of capital ships (just to talk about a recent battle) without blinking, without support from RMT ISK.

4 - It's unlikely SC will have realistic physics. But it'll implement enough to not appear to be a double clicks driven submarine sim. When playing skilled of course, for all the others there's Masterca... ehm Orbit at nn meters.

5 - It certainly does not apply to SC "EvE dissenters". SC is going to be identically "open ended", in fact it's close to EvE's basic principles enough, for a lot of EvE players to watch it closely.


Rammix wrote:

If you don't like the social basis of eve - relative anarchy of immortal capsuleers - why do you play it?


*I* don't mind. In fact I am still here. Others seem to mind, maybe because sitting with utter a*holes does not immediately feel like it's a big value addition to the game.


Rammix wrote:

I don't see a problem here. What couldn't be produced in big quantities a couple of years ago - now can be produced, it's just natural that amount of resources available to industry grows, as grows the industrial infrastructure itself. There are just more people gathering resources and more people playing tycoon-style game.


What did not exist years ago was PLEX (officially supported RMT). PLEX is a perfect ISK exchange machine (aka wallet segregation breaker or ISK velocity increaser) that lets heavy ISK faucets grinders meet heavy ISK consumers (null sec alliances). Too often the ISK faucet grinders are botters and RMTers. The can buy thousands of PLEXes with dirty ISK and launder it as they place them for sale at convenient prices.


Rammix wrote:

You can't introduce law to a game unless you force ideology upon the players. First, there must be a state to make up and maintain law (which the banking system will stand upon).


It's a sandbox game, meant to provide us tools to plan and draw our own life plots. If I want to become a trusted service I should be allowed access to *opt in* tools to certify the goodwill. That is self imposed policies and restrictions. A personal choice that lets other people think: "that guy gave up on impunity, he has to behave, we can trust his services".

Now, I personally don't have many issues, if you check the MD forum you will see I got even > 100B ISK just on my word but the game can't be designed around me, Chribba, Grendell and an handful others. Self imposed, opted in trustworthiness should be just another of the plethora of tools this game makes available to us.


Rammix wrote:

BTW, I personally would HATE banking system in Eve, because I hate it IRL - usury is a legitimized way for few people to be parasites on many. The only form of banking I wouldn't hate - with 0% credits based on fixed one-time fee for usage.
I think there are not so many people who would like to pay to banks both IRL and ingame.


You would hate it but we had highly popular banks so the topic is popular. Also I find it peculiar to call "parasite" somebody who has to manually process ALL the withdrawal tellering process, person by person, transaction by transaction, and also pay interests to the account holders on top of it.
Argus Sorn
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#690 - 2013-10-16 13:50:33 UTC
I agree this is something to which the solution seems quite easy, but I also think it's a big deal to CCP and therefore they want to make sure all parties are consulted properly.

The more I chew this issue over, the more frustrated I get - I admit that.

When CCP tried to sell 'gold ammo' through the Aurum store, there was an outrage and they 'responded'. They were reportedly recalcitrant and responsive.

But now, what it looks like, at the very least is that they found a way to run a proxy Aurum store, one that players fell for hook, line and sinker. CCP gives items to SOMER, who then raffles them off. Every raffle ticket bought with "Somer isk" is cash dollars for CCP, MarkeeDragon, and SOMERblink. For those of you who have been SOMER supporters - you have been participating in a giant Aurum style gold ammo store, supported by RMT'ing and endorsed by CCP. You've been feeding CCP, SOMER and MarkeeDragon your hard earned money, not for gold ammo or isk, but for merely a CHANCE at winning gold ammo or isk.

We need full disclosure on this issue. Was there some sort of collusion between Markee, SOMER and CCP to make cash for all of them while auctioning off rare ships that were gifted to SOMER by CCP under the guise of "EVE Vegas"?

Perhaps it is more likely CCP just didn't realize what they were getting themselves into - but this is the problem with doing business with in game and out of game entities, it creates at least the perception of deal making. I'd personally would like to know how many GTC's have been sold through SOMER and Markee since SOMER began offering them.

We should keep demanding answers, but I understand, given the fact that CCP may very well have been participating in a giant AURUM store style cash making scheme - the need for time.




DNSBLACK
Dirt Nap Squad
#691 - 2013-10-16 13:52:15 UTC  |  Edited by: DNSBLACK
raven666wings wrote:
Miss Ladybird wrote:
Why does CCP act like this is such a difficult situation to analyse, like its really hard to balance up the rights and wrongs of it.

IT IS EASY. All I presonally want is the following:

1) CCP to implement an 'Above the Fray' rule. This means they will never take sides with in game entities again. They will only intervene in the game where the EULA is being broken.

2) CCP item spawning (AKA game meddling) to be immediately limited to:


  • Valid reimbursment cases
  • AT (and similar CCP run tournament) prizes
  • Seasonal gifts (must be gifted to all)


the above list is comprehensive

3) All of SOMERblink's iScorps to be taken back and destroyed immediately

4) All promotion and support for SOMERblink to cease (in keeping with the Above the Fray principle). I also would like a sober and simply worded announcement that SOMERblink is able to scam, might be scamming, and can scam in the future.

5) SOMERblink to be ordered to cease its RMT business. I want each SOMERblink account to receive a 1 week suspension and a fine applied to the founder in isk, equal to half of the total isk paid out under the RMT scheme (this is very lenient, and fair as CCP is partly to blame for not apprehending SOMER earlier, he probably thought what he was doing was ok).

TOO GREEDY?


Miss Ladybird's suggestion for resolution of the issue seems appropriate, in case CCP's verdict deems Somer Blink's actions illegitimate and forbids other entities/players to engage in similar conduct.

Action number 3), as Careby observed, may be nonetheless impossible to execute without affecting/reimbursing foreign players who might have already bought those ships.

Regarding point 5) it is my opinion that 1 week suspension would be too lenient as punishment for a RMT offense, as that kind of suspension is normally what CCP apllies to simple misconducts like player verbal abuse offenses.
Furthermore I agree that not only Somer Blink is to be held accountable for carrying on with the misconduct, but a fact finding process should also be conducted by CCP's internal affairs department to investigate the alleged involvement of CCP employees with Somer Blink. Neglecting the enforcement of the game's EULA rules of conduct (if that turns out to be the case) and even supporting and advertising the fraudulent scheme are unnacceptable actions that should not remain unpunished, in the same way that other similar actions performed by other CCP employees in the past did not.

This is however one of the possible outcome scenarios for CCP.



I think what you are saying is " resolution with out restitution is meanless". There is no moving forward until the sandbox is restored and ccp integrity is made whole again. I sit and countinue to give them as much rope as the need. They have at least earned that. Now that ccp has added the eve vegas log to the fire the restitution price is going up.

I would be curious to see how many people following this thread also feel this way.
Argus Sorn
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#692 - 2013-10-16 14:02:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Argus Sorn
The real penalty for SOMER should be players no longer patronizing them.

They are only successful because the player base gives them a pass.

No mistake:

They are not only an RMT entity, but they are an RMT entity working alongside CCP and MarkeeDragon to make cash off of EVE through micro transactions. Whether or not it is intentional is irrelevant - if you patronize SOMERblink you are helping to pay CCP and MarkeeDragon.

SOMERblink is not only an RMT entity but a proxy for an EVE micro transaction economy - the very thing we raged against once before.

If you were outraged by monoclegate and gold ammo then you should be doubly outraged by this as it is the same thing, perhaps worse. Even if CCP was not intentionally using SOMER as a proxy for their vision of the AURUM store, they were doing so through complacency. Replace AURUM with SOMERisk and gold ammo with SOE ships, trips to Iceland, ISW Scorps, and you have the very thing we feared, the very thing we protested against, and the very thing CCP told us they were not going to do.

So if you want to continue to support SOMER in spite of them being an RMT, cash making scheme for themselves, MarkeeDragon and CCP - go right ahead, but realize you are supporting micro transactions and RMT by doing so. Personally I suggest players boycott SOMER completely. There are other gambling organizations out there, some with a very good reputation as well that do not deal in cash transactions. And if you are concerned about SOMER's "charity" - I am sure the other organizations would be just as happy to help donate some isk SCL, and others if they get the sort of business that SOMER enjoyed.
DNSBLACK
Dirt Nap Squad
#693 - 2013-10-16 14:29:20 UTC  |  Edited by: DNSBLACK
CCP have a fun trip to Vegas. Iam sure you have made enough money off somer GTC sales to have a really great time. Don't worry about us paying subscribers feeling betrayed, we will be here when you get back waiting by the forum door to hear your response. I guess our 15 dollars are not that important when compared to getting people hooked on gambling and selling eve stuff thru somer. The longer you wait the larger the army grows and what I find amazing you don't really see the problem yet. I was told that my support would bomrang on me but slowly it is growing and after the last response it is even getting larger.

DNSBlack
Shai 'Hulud
#694 - 2013-10-16 15:41:32 UTC
CCP Guard wrote:
We're also looking at the EULA questions brought up in this discussion, another matter that will take some time and input from relevant stakeholders in the company.

You have now admitted to being aware of the EULA violations with SOMER's operations. If the clock wasn't ticking before, it certainly is now. Every transaction they make money on between now and when you make a decision is officially on you, not them. I wonder how much time other RMT operations are allowed to run AFTER CCP is aware of them?...

P.S. - I don't actually believe CCP didn't know about this before, but now they have admitted such.

The most useful slaves are those that believe themselves to be free

Argus Sorn
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#695 - 2013-10-16 15:55:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Argus Sorn
Shai 'Hulud wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
We're also looking at the EULA questions brought up in this discussion, another matter that will take some time and input from relevant stakeholders in the company.

You have now admitted to being aware of the EULA violations with SOMER's operations. If the clock wasn't ticking before, it certainly is now. Every transaction they make money on between now and when you make a decision is officially on you, not them. I wonder how much time other RMT operations are allowed to run AFTER CCP is aware of them?...

P.S. - I don't actually believe CCP didn't know about this before, but now they have admitted such.



The "thing to do" would be to shut down SOMER's RMT'ing (the 200m isk per GTC purchase) PENDING the completion of the investigation.

The fact that SOMERblink is an RMT scheme as well as a form of micro transaction economy is a big deal - and does require some time to investigate I would imagine.

I would assume they are looking at how much isk has been sold, as well as any connections, if any, between devs, SOMER and MarkeeDragon. The "who knew what?" of this, if you will. So once again - patience is important. For CCP's side of it, they need to make sure that if we are going to be kept waiting, we get some solid answers.

In the meantime, I have to wonder why they haven't given SOMERblink some monocles to auction off...
DNSBLACK
Dirt Nap Squad
#696 - 2013-10-16 16:07:12 UTC  |  Edited by: DNSBLACK
Somer if I were u I would run some blink credit specials during eve Vegas. Buy 2 GTC get 1 billion blink credits.

WHY DO YOU ASK.

Well if CCP rules in your favor then you will have a stream of GTC sellers cashing in on your Market. I can't wait to by GTC from the goon site and get goon credits. I know they will have some special deal about owning a system in game for goon credits woot.

If CCP rules against you then you can cash in while they are vacation in Vegas. You need to move as many GTC as you can while your paid off CCP employees are still working for the company. Also make sure you move all your isk out to friends and alts so they can't take that away from you.

The fall out from this will grow if it isn't handled before Vegas CCP. I guess this is what happens when you spend thousands of dollar to form a consumer advocacy group and don't use them. I wonder if there was this much thought and process done before CCP community devs decided to use somer. According to the CSM minutes of old and talking to current and past CSM members I would have to say NOPE. I hope you are beginning to see there is a bigger crisis then you think.

Hey and since you look the other way for somer and ignored your own Eula. I am calling for every account that got band for buying isk to be restored and all of thier wallets to be returned to the original amounts. See how your EULA no longer applies and we are managing by the seat of our pants.
Shai 'Hulud
#697 - 2013-10-16 16:08:24 UTC
Argus Sorn wrote:
Shai 'Hulud wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
We're also looking at the EULA questions brought up in this discussion, another matter that will take some time and input from relevant stakeholders in the company.

You have now admitted to being aware of the EULA violations with SOMER's operations. If the clock wasn't ticking before, it certainly is now. Every transaction they make money on between now and when you make a decision is officially on you, not them. I wonder how much time other RMT operations are allowed to run AFTER CCP is aware of them?...

P.S. - I don't actually believe CCP didn't know about this before, but now they have admitted such.



The "thing to do" would be to shut down SOMER's RMT'ing (the 200m isk per GTC purchase) PENDING the completion of the investigation.

The fact that SOMERblink is an RMT scheme as well as a form of micro transaction economy is a big deal - and does require some time to investigate I would imagine.

I would assume they are looking at how much isk has been sold, as well as any connections, if any, between devs, SOMER and MarkeeDragon. The "who knew what?" of this, if you will. So once again - patience is important. For CCP's side of it, they need to make sure that if we are going to be kept waiting, we get some solid answers.

In the meantime, I have to wonder why they haven't given SOMERblink some monocles to auction off...

I agree with patience, selectively. At this time this is not something to debate. SOMER is clearly in violation of the current EULA, and I don't think they need to have a discussion on whether rule breaking should be allowed (again, they have now admitted to being aware of the issue here). All they have to do is enforce their current rules.

If they want to have a discussion about the validity of those rules, and potential changes they would like to make to them going forward, then that is fine. But that should be done after they have enforced their current rules.

In the end this is just another form of special treatment for SOMER.

The most useful slaves are those that believe themselves to be free

Argus Sorn
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#698 - 2013-10-16 16:13:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Argus Sorn
Shai 'Hulud wrote:
Argus Sorn wrote:
Shai 'Hulud wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
We're also looking at the EULA questions brought up in this discussion, another matter that will take some time and input from relevant stakeholders in the company.

You have now admitted to being aware of the EULA violations with SOMER's operations. If the clock wasn't ticking before, it certainly is now. Every transaction they make money on between now and when you make a decision is officially on you, not them. I wonder how much time other RMT operations are allowed to run AFTER CCP is aware of them?...

P.S. - I don't actually believe CCP didn't know about this before, but now they have admitted such.



The "thing to do" would be to shut down SOMER's RMT'ing (the 200m isk per GTC purchase) PENDING the completion of the investigation.

The fact that SOMERblink is an RMT scheme as well as a form of micro transaction economy is a big deal - and does require some time to investigate I would imagine.

I would assume they are looking at how much isk has been sold, as well as any connections, if any, between devs, SOMER and MarkeeDragon. The "who knew what?" of this, if you will. So once again - patience is important. For CCP's side of it, they need to make sure that if we are going to be kept waiting, we get some solid answers.

In the meantime, I have to wonder why they haven't given SOMERblink some monocles to auction off...

I agree with patience, selectively. At this time this is not something to debate. SOMER is clearly in violation of the current EULA, and I don't think they need to have a discussion on whether rule breaking should be allowed (again, they have now admitted to being aware of the issue here). All they have to do is enforce their current rules.

If they want to have a discussion about the validity of those rules, and potential changes they would like to make to them going forward, then that is fine. But that should be done after they have enforced their current rules.

In the end this is just another form of special treatment for SOMER.



Well I would hope SOMER would get the same treatment as any other RMT entity.

Anything else might kill CCP and EVE.

Although I will admit that the manner in which they are conducting this RMT and micro transaction scheme is a bit complicated and people have had a tendency to overlook it.

If CCP started selling IW Scorps and SOE ships in the Aurum store the game would sink in a week.

But sell them through SOMERblink and it slips in under everyone's nose.
Money Makin Mitch
Paid in Full
#699 - 2013-10-16 16:30:36 UTC
Argus Sorn wrote:

In the meantime, I have to wonder why they haven't given SOMERblink some monocles to auction off...

they did, it just keeps slipping through the cracks. they received 4 rare monocles iirc. so, they have been the recipient of not 1, not 2, but at least 3 rewards so far.
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#700 - 2013-10-16 16:31:18 UTC
A quick status report from the CSM side.

We had a 30 minute meeting with CCP Dolan on Monday about a CSM initiative to survey the community. The result of that meeting was constructive, and resulted in a 90 minute meeting Tuesday with CCP Dolan, CCP Navigator and CCP Guard.

During the second meeting, it was agreed that the first step in the process of resolving these issues is to get a better read on community opinions about acceptable practices.

To do this, CSM will be running two forum surveys, in a manner similar to our crowdsourcing initiatives. These will focus on Appropriate Fansite Incentives and Acceptable Fansite Business Models, and will be structured in a way that we hope will encourage good debate.

At the same time, CCP will be running identical surveys through their established subscriber survey methods, so that we have data on the opinions of the general community in addition to the forum community.

We are currently working with CCP to finalize the list of survey questions. We hope this will be completed in a few days, and the forum surveys will go live as soon as possible thereafter. However, things may slip a bit because of EVE Vegas.

CSM welcomes your input as we finalize the survey questions. Our current plan is that each question will be a statement, with 4 possible responses: "This is OK", "This is a grey-area", "This should not be allowed", and "I have no opinion".

Here are some sample statements to give you an idea of the style:

Fansite incentives:

* CCP can provide PLEX as prizes for contests on fansites.

* Fansites should receive incentives in proportion to their benefits to the community.

Business Models:

* I provide a service to the EVE community, and if they want to thank me, they can give me ISK.

* I provide a service to the EVE community, and if they want to thank me, they can give me real money.

We are particularly interested in questions that explore the grey areas.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery