Player Features and Ideas Discussion

RHML find their use very precisely in BS vs smaller ships. Buffing their range would make them overlap cruise missiles, which is not the goal here.

I invite every one of you to read this brilliant article concerning RHML analysis with actual stats, graphs, and analysis, before making any undocumented feedback on the subject :
http://themittani.com/features/rapid-heavy-missile-launcher-analysis

is any ship gonna get a bonus to these so they arent just crap?

No, it would not. The un-bonused range of cruise missiles is 148.1km; it's 62.9km for heavy missiles. Even with the full +50% missile velocity bonus you're talking about a range of 222.15km for cruise missiles and 94.35km for heavy missiles. Then there's the additional +10% velocity bonus cruise missiles have over heavy missiles. This is before the missile velocity on most battleship hulls, which makes cruise missiles twice as fast as heavy missiles.

And yes, I have thoroughly read and reviewed the article - and agree with the author on most points and his excellent analysis. However, it doesn't take into consideration specific hulls that have an inherent explosion radius (Raven Navy Issue) or explosion velocity (Typhoon) bonus - which makes cruise missiles quite deadly.

Where you see the "overlap" escapes me, because RHMLs are clearly mid-range weapons (both in terms of range and speed). The current proposal for RHMLs solely relegate them to hulls with damage or rate of fire bonuses. The only setup where RHMLs make sense is on something like a Typhoon or Scorpion Navy Issue - which don't have a missile velocity bonus and where you get the equivalent of 8 RHMLs with full skills. Then you could run three hydraulic rigs and hit out to 96.2km with a 105m explosion radius (but this would really come at the expense of any tank).

RHMLs need to receive the missile velocity bonuses as well.


The consensus is that the explosion radius and velocity bonuses would be too OP, but not the range bonus. Including the latter simply gives long-range platforms the option to utilize RHMLs to some extent. I still don't think most of you appreciate that even with the +50% missile velocity bonus these still have half the range and 80% of the DPS of cruise missiles.

besides deleting them before you have introduced them which is what you should do ....
why does it need so many OP faction/officer/deadspace versions?

Are these up on the test server yet?

Yes it does, which is why RHMLs should receive the missile velocity bonuses as well. The numbers bear out that explosion velocity and explosion radius are simply too powerful (much as I like the idea of my Raven Navy Issue having RHMLs that can 1-shot frigates).

Sort out heavy missiles first before you make a balancing problem for yourself in the future.
Heavies need a 15% boost to bring them back in line with the boosted medium guns that they were previously "balanced" with before last patch.

I agree with you when you say that even with range bonuses, heavy missiles would still leave plenty of "range" for cruise missiles.
But you have to consider the fact that almost nobody snipes at more than 150km, and even less with cruise missiles, since at this range you cannot slow down your target, paint it, and warp scramble it. You do ridiculous damages, and people can warp to you, it's even more true now with warp speed changes.

So even if the theoretical range is 222km, in practice you won't see much use after 150km I guess, and I would more say 100.
So that's why I say it's overlapping with cruise missiles. :)

My biggest problem with the fact that these mods ignore some hull bonuses is that it makes it totally irrelevant how far you've trained your battleship skill with some ships. Anybody with Caldari Battleship 2 has the same effectiveness on Raven Navy Issue as someone with Caldari Battleship 5. THAT'S RIDICULOUS.

Maybe the solution is that these hull bonuses are only half as effective with RHMLs, but there should be SOMETHING that pilots get out of actually training their battleship skills up. EDIT: My suggestion is to build in a 50% effectiveness with hull bonuses to their mods themselves, so ALL hull bonuses affect the launchers equally, but only half as much as they do cruises and torps.

You even have an easy explanation from a lore perspective "These systems were not initially designed for battleships so they don't integrate as easily as other battleship launchers."

Lasers can be tracking disrupted, optimal disrupted, and neuted.

Autocannons can be tracking and range disrupted.

Blasters and rails can be tracking and range disrupted, as well as neuted.

But missiles? Nope. No form of any effective e-war against missiles. As long as you're in range, they hit, they do damage, and they kill. This is unbalanced, especially with the introduction of new launchers.

Also, don't say "ECM" or "sensor disruption" because those apply to ALL hulls, not just missile boats.