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Star Citizen v EVE

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Bluespot85
What IU Doing
Brothers of Tangra
#321 - 2013-09-01 17:13:25 UTC
Hi, I’ve taken a good look at Star Citizen and I like the look of it alot. I also notice something at Star Citizen that seems to be missing within Eve online and that is passion and attention to detail.

There seems to be no more passion from ccp management to continue to make a great game. All passion from ccp seems to be directed in making new products connected to eve online.

There has been no discernable new content added to eve online since wormhole space.

In the last 2 years there has been nothing but fixing and balancing broken ships-this is not new content no matter how you dress it up.

It has taken ccp 10 years 4 months to fix t1 industrials. Fixing things that you introduced in a broken state and then left for over a decade is something that you should be doing alongside new content development, not instead of.

To plan nothing but fixes and balancing to ships that you introduced into the game in a broken state for years is not going to keep the existing player base happy for ever.

I’d say from observations that CCP management in no longer focused on the long term vision and direction for eve online from a creative perspective, but rather they simple react to whatever the player base/csm are unhappy with “today”. This represents bad leadership and is reflected in the future eve online development cycle.

After 10 years 4 months we only have 1 tech 3 item !!!!

In case people on this forum and newer game developers don’t realise, there was meant to be a steady progression in tech from 1-4. The acquisition of these items opens up a huge amount of new content ideas, but if development of bounty hunting is anything to go buy then no thanks. I’d rather play something new that has polish and attention to detail at the outset rather than a decade later, which star citizen appears to be doing now.

Overall, I pity the people who will put in time and effort into playing dust 514, world of darkness and valkyrie, because your going to be expecting loads of cool content for years on end that just simply isn’t going to materialise.

I don’t think Star Citizen will cause eve to die and all of that, but I think some of the player base would be inclined to agree that after reading the future planned development cycle, eve online has passed its peak, as all games do.

How can it not have?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#322 - 2013-09-01 18:09:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
Bluespot85 wrote:


There seems to be no more passion from ccp management to continue to make a great game.


I can tell you for a fact that this is not true. How many times does it have to be said that the last couple of years have been about addressing the technical debt and polish/iteration backlog? Which CCP have accomplished very well - I almost wish that they'd give us a taste of the Incarna/Tyrannis ere client for a few days, just to remind us all of how much they've improved EVE in the myriad small (and sometimes not so small) ways. Look, T1 ships that are worth something! Look, fights that aren't blackscreen fests! Look, countless minor improvements to the UI! And so on.

We've just had 4 expansions in a row that have been essentially all about "attention to detail". EVE is all the better for it. I certainly agree that it's time to start truly expanding the game again, but if that necessary foundation work hadn't been done, I wouldn't be agreeing.

Go watch Seagull's keynote presentation from this year's fanfest and tell me there's no passion there, I DARE you.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#323 - 2013-09-01 18:41:36 UTC
Bluespot85 wrote:
Hi, I’ve taken a good look at Star Citizen and I like the look of it alot. I also notice something at Star Citizen that seems to be missing within Eve online and that is passion and attention to detail.

There seems to be no more passion from ccp management to continue to make a great game. All passion from ccp seems to be directed in making new products connected to eve online.

There has been no discernable new content added to eve online since wormhole space.

In the last 2 years there has been nothing but fixing and balancing broken ships-this is not new content no matter how you dress it up.

It has taken ccp 10 years 4 months to fix t1 industrials. Fixing things that you introduced in a broken state and then left for over a decade is something that you should be doing alongside new content development, not instead of.

To plan nothing but fixes and balancing to ships that you introduced into the game in a broken state for years is not going to keep the existing player base happy for ever.

I’d say from observations that CCP management in no longer focused on the long term vision and direction for eve online from a creative perspective, but rather they simple react to whatever the player base/csm are unhappy with “today”. This represents bad leadership and is reflected in the future eve online development cycle.

After 10 years 4 months we only have 1 tech 3 item !!!!

In case people on this forum and newer game developers don’t realise, there was meant to be a steady progression in tech from 1-4. The acquisition of these items opens up a huge amount of new content ideas, but if development of bounty hunting is anything to go buy then no thanks. I’d rather play something new that has polish and attention to detail at the outset rather than a decade later, which star citizen appears to be doing now.

Overall, I pity the people who will put in time and effort into playing dust 514, world of darkness and valkyrie, because your going to be expecting loads of cool content for years on end that just simply isn’t going to materialise.

I don’t think Star Citizen will cause eve to die and all of that, but I think some of the player base would be inclined to agree that after reading the future planned development cycle, eve online has passed its peak, as all games do.

How can it not have?


Well, I don't think they lost interest nor passion, but certainly the "want" and the "can" for EVE are not looking good.

Apparently there is a new development plan that will include new stuff. But, will it be truly new, or just more of the same? Will they do anything for PvE, hiseccers, solo gameplay, casual gameplay? Or will just keep catering to the same little bunch who like the "core" gameplay and are content with ship restats and more of the same reheated porridge forever?

Can they stop digging themselves into their niche? How about selling the game to other players, new or disenchanted, rather than offer rebates and force everyone to have multiple accounts and multibox to "stay competitive"? How about agreeing, for a single time, that if most people stay in hisec, there's where new content is needed?

And all in all, even if they want to expand the game beyond its diminutive fanatical cult niche... can they? Is the CSM of use to them? Do they have the tools to learn about the real player base and not just the most vocal organized tiny minority?

I don't doubt they still love the game. But when it's time to let it go, it's time to let it go. Sometime you just must put your pet to the eternal sleep. And CCP is looking for new puppies.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Bluespot85
What IU Doing
Brothers of Tangra
#324 - 2013-09-01 20:23:48 UTC
Well I watched it and I disagree, I see people happy in their work but I'm not seeing real passion for any new content as there is none on the horizon. How can people get passionate about fixing ships that in some cases will be their forth change since release?

We have not had "4 recent expansions" We've had 4 lots of balancing/fixes. That amounts to the same thing if you apply it to another game. Tier 3 battlecruisers are the same as giving each class a new sword. It's not an expansion.

I'm not falling for the latest gag from CCP in respect of Valkyrie. Many years ago I would have truly believed that after watching that video, I'd be flying this character in a dogfight, freelancer style, all guns a blazing. That my trained skills would mean something.

After becoming aware that CCP are happy to fill in gaps at fan fest with material that never makes it into this game, one has to presume that eve Valkyrie will be released on a platform that I don't own, or cant play with this character, or some other unforeseen obstacle/logistic/time sink/problem/issue.

It's a pity somebody has never made a compilation video of all the fan fest content that never made it into game. All of it put together would make a good game. Hilarious if you really think about it.

I hope that when eve online does at some stage have good competition, they don't go down the route of dumbing everything down like they do in others games entering decline.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#325 - 2013-09-02 03:25:41 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Bluespot85 wrote:


There seems to be no more passion from ccp management to continue to make a great game.


I can tell you for a fact that this is not true. How many times does it have to be said that the last couple of years have been about addressing the technical debt and polish/iteration backlog? Which CCP have accomplished very well - I almost wish that they'd give us a taste of the Incarna/Tyrannis ere client for a few days, just to remind us all of how much they've improved EVE in the myriad small (and sometimes not so small) ways. Look, T1 ships that are worth something! Look, fights that aren't blackscreen fests! Look, countless minor improvements to the UI! And so on.

We've just had 4 expansions in a row that have been essentially all about "attention to detail". EVE is all the better for it. I certainly agree that it's time to start truly expanding the game again, but if that necessary foundation work hadn't been done, I wouldn't be agreeing.

Go watch Seagull's keynote presentation from this year's fanfest and tell me there's no passion there, I DARE you.




And for those that have been playing non stop ever since the game was released in 2003, and now pretty much have nothing left to aim for?......I'll take more than passionate speaches for the old farts of the game, even if we're a minority given that a lot of players have given up out of sheer boredom.
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#326 - 2013-09-02 10:08:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Alpheias
digitalwanderer wrote:

It's a different game altogether for the simple difference that the ships pack so much detail on them, that having hundreds of them in a huge fight isn't just about server lag, but one's PC actually even hoping to render all that with anything even remotely resembling playable performance and not just a slide show, hence for that reason the fights with be instanced and in much smaller numbers and not just one where massive numbers will play a decisive factor in winning...


You are absolutely correct, it is a different game, it looks like space shooter. EVE is none of those things.

digitalwanderer wrote:

Second, the whole time slows down in EVE when a large fight is happening has never been something i like personally, and it removes the player even more from any sort of immersion that the game has to offer.


Having "instanced fights" is not immersion breaking?

digitalwanderer wrote:

Third, at least for the available ships released so far, all of them will be able to land on planet surfaces comming thru the atmosphere, even a 140 meter long idris corvette will do it( which looks gorgeous btw), which is something we've been drooling about in EVE for years, and CCP showed a video of an amarr frigate flying on the surface of a planet in the early years of the game, but nothing came of it unfortunately.


When you say that you will be landing on planets, will you (the player) be doing calculations for a landing trajectory or will it follow Freelancer with its arcade style of landing?

digitalwanderer wrote:

Fourth:, the game has real neutonian physics, which allows maneuvers that eve does not, like flying in a specific direction, rotating the ship on it's axis in a different direction while killing the engines and never slowing down at all( we are in space afterall), and one might even fire the ships weapons while flying backwards.....All in first person view, while ship mates on the larger ships, man the turreted guns on ships like the constellation or idris corvette, and even deploy the p52 snub fighter on the constellation, and 2~3 fighters in the idris for it's defence.

The game was expected to earn 2 million to continue it's developement, and it's past the 17 miliion mark and on it's way to 18 million, at which point battlecruisers get released in the game, and there's 230k+ backers, making the highest publically funded game with nothing needed from publishers to water it down and make the game playable on every hardware out there....Blink


Personally, it never bothered me that EVE wasn't developed with Newton's laws in mind and keep in mind that PhysX was developed 2004 and it wasn't until much, much later we began to see physics engines being a core component in games. I think it is simply unrealistic to imagine CCP at the time of developing EVE to include a separate engine for physics. I have always viewed EVE as more of an RTS than a twitchy fighter game.

If Star Citizen features Newtonian mechanics, I sincerely hope that they implement a realistic planetary model with different mass, different gravity, inclination vectors and so forth to create a proper experience for the player when landing on planets or Star Citizen will just fall through as a Freelancer 2.0 with prettier graphics but with cherry picking when it comes to realism which frankly would be a huge disappointment.

I don't think the game will be playable on every hardware out there when in a interview with german PC Games Hardware Chris Roberts goes on saying:

Star Citizen: System requirements - 8 GB RAM and 64 bit are the minimum

Chris Roberts has graphically put his team with the specific objective of Star Citizen a new milestone. In the interview, he made it clear that the hardware requirements would not, therefore, now aim for the existing state of the art. For optimal settings you'll need a high-end PC with the technology in 1.5 years. A recent GTX 770 will be expected to be adequate only for medium settings. The goal is that Star Citizen should run fluently with maybe a future GTX 880 or 980 - comparable AMD cards including of course, you would prefer a manufacturer here.

But the gaming PCs, some will be demanded not only for the graphics card: Star Citizen is absolutely need a 64-bit operating system. The reason for this is simple, as well as 8GB of memory to represent the absolute minimum. This applies not for the first hangar module, but even if the end of the module will be published dogfighting, the more memory might be necessary.Whether there would be advantages to have installed more RAM in the system, he could not say, but it is quite likely at this time. For processors, the same applies. Four cores should do the trick and will be needed if more should be done depending on the technical development of the next 12 months. As the scale of the cores will be then that he could not precisely estimate how the effect of HT.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#327 - 2013-09-02 15:04:04 UTC  |  Edited by: digitalwanderer
Alpheias wrote:


Having "instanced fights" is not immersion breaking?



If it limits the fights to 50 ships or less and where the tactics and fittings and roles of all ships are meaningfull again, i don't see a problem with it......It is far better than 500+ ship fights and if a lot of those hostile ships make you primary, and focus fire on you, you're dead in a single second, never mind the whole time slowing down effect added for these big fights.

Quote:


When you say that you will be landing on planets, will you (the player) be doing calculations for a landing trajectory or will it follow Freelancer with its arcade style of landing?



I have no idea to be honest, but having it is already better than nothing at all, and it was CCP that hinted at flying on planet surfaces with that video, which was released on the second year of the game( around 2004 basically), and here we are in 2013 and nothing came of it.......There's no excuses for this.




Quote:


Personally, it never bothered me that EVE wasn't developed with Newton's laws in mind and keep in mind that PhysX was developed 2004 and it wasn't until much, much later we began to see physics engines being a core component in games. I think it is simply unrealistic to imagine CCP at the time of developing EVE to include a separate engine for physics. I have always viewed EVE as more of an RTS than a twitchy fighter game.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_War_2:_Edge_of_Chaos


It was released in 2001 and well before PhysX even existed and had a full physics engine and i played it extensively, so the existence of a physics API already on the market is not a factor if the developer wants it in their game...If they want it, they can write their own even if it increases their workload.


Quote:

If Star Citizen features Newtonian mechanics, I sincerely hope that they implement a realistic planetary model with different mass, different gravity, inclination vectors and so forth to create a proper experience for the player when landing on planets or Star Citizen will just fall through as a Freelancer 2.0 with prettier graphics but with cherry picking when it comes to realism which frankly would be a huge disappointment.



The descriptions of the systems released so far lists their size and mass and gravity if i remember correctly, but we'll only know when the planetary interaction module is released, which will only happen after the dog fighting module is released this xmas, so it'll only happen next year.


Quote:

I don't think the game will be playable on every hardware out there when in a interview with german PC Games Hardware Chris Roberts goes on saying:

Star Citizen: System requirements - 8 GB RAM and 64 bit are the minimum

Chris Roberts has graphically put his team with the specific objective of Star Citizen a new milestone. In the interview, he made it clear that the hardware requirements would not, therefore, now aim for the existing state of the art. For optimal settings you'll need a high-end PC with the technology in 1.5 years. A recent GTX 770 will be expected to be adequate only for medium settings. The goal is that Star Citizen should run fluently with maybe a future GTX 880 or 980 - comparable AMD cards including of course, you would prefer a manufacturer here.

But the gaming PCs, some will be demanded not only for the graphics card: Star Citizen is absolutely need a 64-bit operating system. The reason for this is simple, as well as 8GB of memory to represent the absolute minimum. This applies not for the first hangar module, but even if the end of the module will be published dogfighting, the more memory might be necessary.Whether there would be advantages to have installed more RAM in the system, he could not say, but it is quite likely at this time. For processors, the same applies. Four cores should do the trick and will be needed if more should be done depending on the technical development of the next 12 months. As the scale of the cores will be then that he could not precisely estimate how the effect of HT.



You're talking to someone with a 12 000$ PC comprised of dual 6 core Xeon's, 64 GB of ram, mutiple SSD's and 4 video cards in quad crossifre and everything is water cooled....Yes, i am a hardware enthusiast of the highest degree and if finally i see a game that pushes the limits of every hardware configuration out there, then it's about ******* time.


I am sick and tired of games that try to run on everything out there, even platforms that are now 6+ years old like the PS 3 and Xbox 360, support only DX9 and by today's standards, have a pathetic amount of memory onboard, and even CCP is feeling it since Dust 514 is limited to the PS 3, as they coudn't get a deal going with Microsoft, and now both these older consoles are going to get replaced with the PS 4 and the new xbox, which both have X-86 CPU's and not the RISC type processors that the PS 3 uses, so backwards compatibility is screwed if you want to play the same games on the newer consoles.


CCP is Learning the hard way that they're shoud have been a PC port of Dust 514, plain and simple, and i'll never buy a console for a single game, period.
voetius
Grundrisse
#328 - 2013-09-02 16:25:56 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
Alpheias wrote:


Having "instanced fights" is not immersion breaking?



If it limits the fights to 50 ships or less and where the tactics and fittings and roles of all ships are meaningfull again, i don't see a problem with it......It is far better than 500+ ship fights and if a lot of those hostile ships make you primary, and focus fire on you, you're dead in a single second, never mind the whole time slowing down effect added for these big fights.

Quote:


When you say that you will be landing on planets, will you (the player) be doing calculations for a landing trajectory or will it follow Freelancer with its arcade style of landing?



I have no idea to be honest, but having it is already better than nothing at all, and it was CCP that hinted at flying on planet surfaces with that video, which was released on the second year of the game( around 2004 basically), and here we are in 2013 and nothing came of it.......There's no excuses for this.




Quote:


Personally, it never bothered me that EVE wasn't developed with Newton's laws in mind and keep in mind that PhysX was developed 2004 and it wasn't until much, much later we began to see physics engines being a core component in games. I think it is simply unrealistic to imagine CCP at the time of developing EVE to include a separate engine for physics. I have always viewed EVE as more of an RTS than a twitchy fighter game.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_War_2:_Edge_of_Chaos




I don't have any grudge against SC, I think a bit of competition for Eve will be healthy, plus I've played alot of the single player space sims like Freelancer, Elite, DarkStar One, X-Wing, Tie Fighter, etc. On the subject of newtonian physics VegaSpace had them and it was kind of cool but it wasn't enough of a wow feature to get the punters rolling in TBH.

I'm just as interested in seeing what happens with Elite Dangerous Blink
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#329 - 2013-09-02 16:57:19 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
If it limits the fights to 50 ships or less and where the tactics and fittings and roles of all ships are meaningfull again, i don't see a problem with it......It is far better than 500+ ship fights and if a lot of those hostile ships make you primary, and focus fire on you, you're dead in a single second, never mind the whole time slowing down effect added for these big fights.


I still think TiDi is a better solution than the node crashing because of large fleet fights and again, personal opinion but I really don't see the difference between 500 and 50 when primary, secondary and tertiary targets are still going to be called out.

digitalwanderer wrote:

I have no idea to be honest, but having it is already better than nothing at all, and it was CCP that hinted at flying on planet surfaces with that video, which was released on the second year of the game( around 2004 basically), and here we are in 2013 and nothing came of it.......There's no excuses for this..


CCP never hinted. They showed off a conceptualized idea that was a experiment and a lots of what-ifs and as far as I know, Chris Roberts hasn't shown any atmospheric flight or landing either so in my mind, that is as much hanging in the air as CCP's concept of planetary flight of ever becoming a realization.

digitalwanderer wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_War_2:_Edge_of_Chaos

It was released in 2001 and well before PhysX even existed and had a full physics engine and i played it extensively, so the existence of a physics API already on the market is not a factor if the developer wants it in their game...If they want it, they can write their own even if it increases their workload.


Ok. You got me. I missed IW2 but IW2 was way ahead of its time too, it still took years before physics almost became a mandatory thing in games so my point remains.

digitalwanderer wrote:

The descriptions of the systems released so far lists their size and mass and gravity if i remember correctly, but we'll only know when the planetary interaction module is released, which will only happen after the dog fighting module is released this xmas, so it'll only happen next year..


So very much in the air and nothing set in stone.

digitalwanderer wrote:
You're talking to someone with a 12 000$ PC comprised of dual 6 core Xeon's, 64 GB of ram, mutiple SSD's and 4 video cards in quad crossifre and everything is water cooled....Yes, i am a hardware enthusiast of the highest degree and if finally i see a game that pushes the limits of every hardware configuration out there, then it's about ******* time.

I am sick and tired of games that try to run on everything out there, even platforms that are now 6+ years old like the PS 3 and Xbox 360, support only DX9 and by today's standards, have a pathetic amount of memory onboard, and even CCP is feeling it since Dust 514 is limited to the PS 3, as they coudn't get a deal going with Microsoft, and now both these older consoles are going to get replaced with the PS 4 and the new xbox, which both have X-86 CPU's and not the RISC type processors that the PS 3 uses, so backwards compatibility is screwed if you want to play the same games on the newer consoles.

CCP is Learning the hard way that they're shoud have been a PC port of Dust 514, plain and simple, and i'll never buy a console for a single game, period.


This really reads to me as angry incoherent rabble. Try again when you are calmer, and perhaps use a spelling checker with your $12,000 PC?

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#330 - 2013-09-02 17:23:42 UTC  |  Edited by: digitalwanderer
Alpheias wrote:

I still think TiDi is a better solution than the node crashing because of large fleet fights and again, personal opinion but I really don't see the difference between 500 and 50 when primary, secondary and tertiary targets are still going to be called out.



I have been playing eve since 2003, at a time when the game was Lucky to have 3000 to 5000 people logged in depending if it's a weekday or a weekend, and where most of those were still in high sec space doing their thing, so the first aliances in 0.0 had relatively little numbers, and fights involved way less than 50 ships on both sides in total and even then took days to organize, not at a snap of a finger, and it was the most fun fights i ever had since fittings mattered, tactics matered and everyone haad to be pulling their part, with the extra bonus that there wasn't much in terms of server lag given the low numbers...


Quote:

CCP never hinted. They showed off a conceptualized idea that was a experiment and a lots of what-ifs and as far as I know, Chris Roberts hasn't shown any atmospheric flight or landing either so in my mind, that is as much hanging in the air as CCP's concept of planetary flight of ever becoming a realization.



So why bother showing it in the first place?, or wasting any sort of time developer time creating it?, if it's never going to be in the game......Sounds like teasing players and wasting development time for nothing if that's the case.


Quote:

So very much in the air and nothing set in stone.


Well considering what CCP did with flying on planet surfaces( AKA **** all), i don't think star Citizen can do any worse by comparison, but we'll see next year when A-L-P-H-A release of the planetary module is available.


Quote:

This really reads to me as angry incoherent rabble. Try again when you are calmer, and perhaps use a spelling checker with your $12,000 PC?



Fine, a couple of pictures is Worth 10 000 words:

http://s765.photobucket.com/user/Superfly101_02/media/P1030522.jpg.html


http://s765.photobucket.com/user/Superfly101_02/media/P1030506.jpg.html


And as for dust 514 and it being restricted to the PS3 with no PC version, and the fact that the PS4 will be out before chrisstmas, it'll be more development money pissed away as people switch to the PS4 and there's no backwards compatibiity with the PS3 Library....That includes dust 514.
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#331 - 2013-09-02 17:54:05 UTC
Personally, I'll enjoy both. Given Star Citizen is new and involves actual piloting though, you'll probably find me in combat/active much more over there.

I've been with EVE for quite some time now and wouldn't give it up, but I've always been better at First Person Piloting and enjoy it much more when Fighting. I feel it gives me the edge I need to do well, but I've never fought anything but AI before either. Will be an interesting experience whether I do well or badly.

zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#332 - 2013-09-02 18:05:42 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
[quote=Alpheias]..stuff..


@ both of you:

multi-quoting arguments are awesome don't you think? Ugh

Nice PC; couldn't give a frag. Honestly, I run it on my old 460 GTX SC which is somewhat less than minimum spec and haven't had a problem with that. I am hoping to upgrade to a 660, 670, or something shortly, but mostly just because I want to and I know the 460 will suffer for dog fighting in all likelihood.

That thing is overkill for just about anything, which is why it doesn't really impress me. Pointless capability unless you really have some good reason to require it, like intense 3D modelling of million+ poly objects or something. Even then, you're still better off with the right GPUs, if only marginally.

Star Citizen is looking well put together and well planned at the moment. I like what I see so far anyway; no reason to believe it isn't going to meet expectations. Possibly even exceed them.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#333 - 2013-09-02 18:14:11 UTC
Bluespot85 wrote:
Hi, I’ve taken a good look at Star Citizen and I like the look of it alot. I also notice something at Star Citizen that seems to be missing within Eve online and that is passion and attention to detail.

There seems to be no more passion from ccp management to continue to make a great game. All passion from ccp seems to be directed in making new products connected to eve online.

There has been no discernable new content added to eve online since wormhole space.

In the last 2 years there has been nothing but fixing and balancing broken ships-this is not new content no matter how you dress it up.

It has taken ccp 10 years 4 months to fix t1 industrials. Fixing things that you introduced in a broken state and then left for over a decade is something that you should be doing alongside new content development, not instead of.

To plan nothing but fixes and balancing to ships that you introduced into the game in a broken state for years is not going to keep the existing player base happy for ever.

I’d say from observations that CCP management in no longer focused on the long term vision and direction for eve online from a creative perspective, but rather they simple react to whatever the player base/csm are unhappy with “today”. This represents bad leadership and is reflected in the future eve online development cycle.

After 10 years 4 months we only have 1 tech 3 item !!!!

In case people on this forum and newer game developers don’t realise, there was meant to be a steady progression in tech from 1-4. The acquisition of these items opens up a huge amount of new content ideas, but if development of bounty hunting is anything to go buy then no thanks. I’d rather play something new that has polish and attention to detail at the outset rather than a decade later, which star citizen appears to be doing now.

Overall, I pity the people who will put in time and effort into playing dust 514, world of darkness and valkyrie, because your going to be expecting loads of cool content for years on end that just simply isn’t going to materialise.

I don’t think Star Citizen will cause eve to die and all of that, but I think some of the player base would be inclined to agree that after reading the future planned development cycle, eve online has passed its peak, as all games do.

How can it not have?



By design. The vast majority of the vocal player-base has agreed that this is the best course of action to my knowledge. Refining the game has improved a great many things about EVE to date, with most of it occurring in the last couple years.

I don't know about passion, but it seems an organized, and community feedback oriented development process is working very well for EVE. Just a few years ago, I'm fairly certain I thought the game was slowly degrading and dying. Falling behind the times and failing to meet the expectations of new players while lacking the clean appeal of a well polished game.

Polishing usually occurs when the paint fades and gets dull with age and wear; seems to me like EVE is really just starting to shine.

zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#334 - 2013-09-02 21:49:49 UTC
Mars Theran wrote:
digitalwanderer wrote:
[quote=Alpheias]..stuff..


@ both of you:

multi-quoting arguments are awesome don't you think? Ugh

Nice PC; couldn't give a frag. Honestly, I run it on my old 460 GTX SC which is somewhat less than minimum spec and haven't had a problem with that. I am hoping to upgrade to a 660, 670, or something shortly, but mostly just because I want to and I know the 460 will suffer for dog fighting in all likelihood.

That thing is overkill for just about anything, which is why it doesn't really impress me. Pointless capability unless you really have some good reason to require it, like intense 3D modelling of million+ poly objects or something. Even then, you're still better off with the right GPUs, if only marginally.



I do a lot of file compression/ decompression and also play around with blender( a 3D modeling program), which both benefit from a lot of CPU cores, and since star Citizen will also release it's own content Tools, it's not out of the question that i create my own ships and even run my own star Citizen server eventually, apart From doing a lot of gaming of course, where the four HD7970's get some good exercise trying to run those 3 displays in eyefinity.....each display is 27" and has a native resolution of 2560*1440, or 8000*1440 in eyefinity with bezel compensation.


In short it's a box that does anything it wants and doesn't really care how demanding the software is, which was the point of it's creation, so let's see just how well star Citizen will manage to push it, if the goal of the game is to bring even the highest end systems to their knees....Twisted
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#335 - 2013-09-03 12:04:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Alpheias
Multi-quoting because it makes Mars Theran really unhappy. Twisted

digitalwanderer wrote:

I have been playing eve since 2003, at a time when the game was Lucky to have 3000 to 5000 people logged in depending if it's a weekday or a weekend, and where most of those were still in high sec space doing their thing, so the first aliances in 0.0 had relatively little numbers, and fights involved way less than 50 ships on both sides in total and even then took days to organize, not at a snap of a finger, and it was the most fun fights i ever had since fittings mattered, tactics matered and everyone haad to be pulling their part, with the extra bonus that there wasn't much in terms of server lag given the low numbers...


Those were the days. I still remember when I lost my shiny Maller to Zap and crew in Venal like it was yesterday, the fights in Stain and Curse during the first war (was in MASS at the time) and particularly in DSS-. Mhmm.. the memories.

digitalwanderer wrote:

So why bother showing it in the first place?, or wasting any sort of time developer time creating it?, if it's never going to be in the game......Sounds like teasing players and wasting development time for nothing if that's the case.


Why not? Same thing can be said about Star Citizen to be fair.

digitalwanderer wrote:

Well considering what CCP did with flying on planet surfaces( AKA **** all), i don't think star Citizen can do any worse by comparison, but we'll see next year when A-L-P-H-A release of the planetary module is available.


I think Star Citizen can do a lot worse. It can be a glorified Freelancer 2.0 with prettier graphics with a arcadestyle-like combat and its only real competition would the X series, Rebirth being released in November too.

digitalwanderer wrote:

Fine, a couple of pictures is Worth 10 000 words:

http://s765.photobucket.com/user/Superfly101_02/media/P1030506.jpg.html

And as for dust 514 and it being restricted to the PS3 with no PC version, and the fact that the PS4 will be out before chrisstmas, it'll be more development money pissed away as people switch to the PS4 and there's no backwards compatibiity with the PS3 Library....That includes dust 514.


A picture of 10,000 hoses more like. :P

Considering that Dust runs off the Unreal engine and the engine can run on literally anything, I don't think it wouldn't be too difficult to port Dust to PS4. Just an FYI.

PS. Use Imgur like civilized people. Thank you.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Royaldo
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch.
Clever Use of Neutral Toons
#336 - 2013-09-03 13:22:26 UTC
People seem to forget this is Chris Roberts.

Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#337 - 2013-09-03 13:45:45 UTC
Royaldo wrote:
People seem to forget this is Chris Roberts.



Who? Oh, the game designer who is best known for the Wing Commander franchise and who dabbled in film producing and film directing with less than stellar results.

What of him?

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#338 - 2013-09-04 00:25:08 UTC  |  Edited by: digitalwanderer
Alpheias wrote:


Why not? Same thing can be said about Star Citizen to be fair.

I think Star Citizen can do a lot worse. It can be a glorified Freelancer 2.0 with prettier graphics with a arcadestyle-like combat and its only real competition would the X series, Rebirth being released in November too.



Arcade style combat using real physics and the most Advanced graphics engine on the market?....


Quote:

A picture of 10,000 hoses more like. :P


Bought a lot more fittings to clean it up along wwith adding more hardware overall, including the new HD9000 cards from AMD next month, assuming they're much faster than anything out now....


Quote:

Considering that Dust runs off the Unreal engine and the engine can run on literally anything, I don't think it wouldn't be too difficult to port Dust to PS4. Just an FYI.

PS. Use Imgur like civilized people. Thank you.



Well since the PS3 uses sony's own CPU, and it's a RSIC style processor, along with a DX9 class GPU called the RSX which is a rebaged G70 processor from Nvidia( think GTX7800/7900 era from 2005), and the new consoles use an X-86 style CPU from AMD, it means recompiling the game to use the different instruction set, and if you want to make it look better, also reworking the graphics to use DX11 while they at it, as the GPU is built within the CPU die.


Does CCP have the means to devote the time and effort and money to do it, and would sony allow it?....
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#339 - 2013-09-04 02:44:21 UTC
Alpheias wrote:

Who? Oh, the game designer who is best known for the Wing Commander franchise and who dabbled in film producing and film directing with less than stellar results.

What of him?


the dogs bark, but the caravan goes on
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#340 - 2013-09-04 03:04:11 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
digitalwanderer wrote:


Does CCP have the means to devote the time and effort and money to do it, and would sony allow it?....


lol... Its actually funny how CCP wanted to play their playerbase into buying ps3's and the ps3 players into coming to EVE, and they're the ones who ended up being played by Sony into putting their game there instead of competing with Planetside 2 on PC. Kind of a backfire shot there...