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[Odyssey 1.1] Heavy Assault Cruisers - round two

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Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#1061 - 2013-07-31 19:47:48 UTC
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Always wanting to have the largest guns and full tank without using fitting mods.



Makes no sense for anyone to buy a car and once you get it you just figure out you can't do more than15 miles with, so you buy and extra tank and fix it at the baggage place, that's it but now you can't go anywhere your fuel tank aloud you because you can't take any baggage.

That's pretty much the CCP balance god mode here. Lol

That's not the good comparison : your are asking your car to be able to sustain tank fire, to fire back and to still be as fast and cheap as she already is. When it's possible, it's illegal.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#1062 - 2013-07-31 19:49:44 UTC
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Sal Landry wrote:
Cearain wrote:
BTW: where do you get that statistic?

It's from CCP Rise in this exact thread

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3414487#post3414487



Thanks. That posts suggests that the vaga is used about as much as the omen in pvp. I knew the vaga wasn't used often but I didn't think it was that bad.

You underestimate the usage of those ships. The Omen is incredible



I haven't seen an omen in a pvp setting since the changes so I couldn't really over or underestimate it.

Where is everyone flying omens in pvp these days?

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1063 - 2013-07-31 19:54:05 UTC
Harvey James wrote:
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Harvey James wrote:
Kais Fiddler wrote:
It's too bad that CCP probably won't deign to fix the Deimos. The vagabond gets the velocity bonus baked in but the deimos won't get the cap bonus? Ridiculous. I was hoping to actually fly one after it got buffed.


I was hoping to fly an blaster eagle but alas ....


Will probably survive longer than Diemost to catch reps and can also spew blaster ammo at almost double optimal Deimos range.


well maybe ... but being slower and doing diddly squat damage won't be worth the bother either way.

The damage is inline with the range, but the Deimos fall off bonus kinda makes the range on bonus on the Eagle kinda underwhelming. If the falloff bonus on the Deimos was changed to a tracking bonus they would both be very useful as both blaster or rail platforms.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#1064 - 2013-07-31 20:03:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Harvey James
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Harvey James wrote:
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Harvey James wrote:
Kais Fiddler wrote:
It's too bad that CCP probably won't deign to fix the Deimos. The vagabond gets the velocity bonus baked in but the deimos won't get the cap bonus? Ridiculous. I was hoping to actually fly one after it got buffed.


I was hoping to fly an blaster eagle but alas ....


Will probably survive longer than Diemost to catch reps and can also spew blaster ammo at almost double optimal Deimos range.


well maybe ... but being slower and doing diddly squat damage won't be worth the bother either way.

The damage is inline with the range, but the Deimos fall off bonus kinda makes the range on bonus on the Eagle kinda underwhelming. If the falloff bonus on the Deimos was changed to a tracking bonus they would both be very useful as both blaster or rail platforms.



The lack of low slots also hurt the eagle...2/4 is mags just too get 370 dps at 15km with null at lv5 HAC i might add doing about 1600m/s with a massive sig and only 2 slots left for a choice of either nano/TE or damage control... for 200mil i mean come on its taking the **** when a Talos can do 900dps at 15km and what 1700m/s for a overall shorter training time and and half the price..

Again with the tracking bonus on Deimos is pointless as the thorax or brutix navy issue can do the exact same thing at least as a mini durable talos that can armour tank or shield tank well and is much more mobile than the talos it has a useful role and some uniqueness rather than a T2 thorax

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
J A Aloysiusz
Risk Breakers
SONS of BANE
#1065 - 2013-07-31 20:24:30 UTC
Diemost needs PWG buff.

It's silly that it can't fit its guns with a 1600 plate and its *bonused* MWD. Let alone trying to fit rails on that thing. Not that you would, since rails already track like a drunk chick looking for the toilet, and they're about to be made worse, in that respect.
glepp
New Caldari Bureau of Investigation
#1066 - 2013-07-31 20:26:30 UTC
The Deimos, which I love so much, needs to have the MWD bonus baked into it's cap and replaced with a tracking bonus if you're going to pidgeonhole it into a rail boat like you are atm. Removing the HPs on the HAC with the biggest sig really makes it a tough sell as a close range brawler.

So three options, one of which would imo would bring it on par:

1. Remove gun slot, increase damage to compensate granting a utility high.
2. Replace cap bonus with tracking bonus (needed for both blasters at close range and rails) and increase innate cap.
3. Give it back it's freaking HP, dude. It needs it since it can't sigtank like the Zealot.
Diesel47
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1067 - 2013-07-31 20:28:17 UTC
Vagabad needs PWG buff.

I want to use arties/425mm on it.
Sigras
Conglomo
#1068 - 2013-07-31 20:30:20 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:

With the exception of the Rook, all the Combat recons are amazing and are completely worth the cost.

i do admit they are used. but as heavy tackle not as e-war platforms.

might aswell just get rid of the e-war aspect and make them heavy interceptors then.

WTB non useless Lachesis fit . . .
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#1069 - 2013-07-31 20:33:32 UTC
Diesel47 wrote:
Vagabad needs PWG buff.

I want to use arties/425mm on it.

The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB.

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#1070 - 2013-07-31 20:41:17 UTC
Sigras wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:

With the exception of the Rook, all the Combat recons are amazing and are completely worth the cost.

i do admit they are used. but as heavy tackle not as e-war platforms.

might aswell just get rid of the e-war aspect and make them heavy interceptors then.

WTB non useless Lachesis fit . . .


For roaming its not bad
You slap on a mwd a long point a scram and shield tank.

Then nano the lows and add a dcu ii

Shield extender rigs and fit some missiles/nuets

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Diesel47
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1071 - 2013-07-31 20:48:44 UTC
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Diesel47 wrote:
Vagabad needs PWG buff.

I want to use arties/425mm on it.

The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB.


Talos already exists.
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#1072 - 2013-07-31 20:56:12 UTC
Diesel47 wrote:
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Diesel47 wrote:
Vagabad needs PWG buff.

I want to use arties/425mm on it.

The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB.


Talos already exists.

So does Tornado

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
Diesel47
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1073 - 2013-07-31 21:02:51 UTC
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Diesel47 wrote:
Hannott Thanos wrote:
Diesel47 wrote:
Vagabad needs PWG buff.

I want to use arties/425mm on it.

The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB.


Talos already exists.

So does Tornado


Nobody fits 425mm and medium arties to tornado.
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1074 - 2013-07-31 21:13:18 UTC
hmm


these ships should be good for roaming and smaller gatecamps right?

so make them able to keep pace with cynabal the current fotm roaming ship
--> better align time pls , and maybe if i could go to sniper range and back to gate with my eagle quickly that would help a lot too
Leskit
Pure Victory
#1075 - 2013-07-31 21:33:03 UTC
Still underwhelmed with the Sacrelige and especially Eagle. Sac still needs that 6th low slot, and so does the ishtar. They're both armor ships, right? right? (well, passive ishtar too).

Eagle is probably going to still be useless.

Why take away soooo much hp from the deimos? Did it kill you too many times to let it have some hp left?
AstraPardus
Earthside Mixlabs
#1076 - 2013-07-31 21:36:54 UTC
Amarr: That's nice, capacitor recharge is nice for most Amarr ships, but IMO is too much on a missile boat.

Caldari: That's nice. Blaster Eagle should be more interesting...

Gallente: Semi-buff on the Deimos, me likey. I might fly this again. Ishtar, however...yes...yes!! One of the things that I like most about drone boats is the versatility of the arment. By giving different bonuses to Heavy and Sentry drones, makes this a very compelling new and improved Ishtar!

Minmatar: The Vaga is now that much harder to kill...thanks. -__- Muninn, that's nice.

Overall: Handshakes and stiff drinks are in order.
Every time I post is Pardy time! :3
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1077 - 2013-07-31 21:51:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Naomi Knight
btw ishtar gets lame double bonuses why other ships cant get those?
like 7.5% optimal and tracking for med hybrids instead of 10% optimal /lvl for the eagle?

oh any other bonuses gets implemented into the ship hull
then why cant the 4%/lvl resist bonus put directly into the eagle hull and give it another bonus?
Kais Fiddler
Perkone
Caldari State
#1078 - 2013-07-31 22:08:06 UTC
Naomi Knight wrote:
btw ishtar gets lame double bonuses why other ships cant get those?
like 7.5% optimal and tracking for med hybrids instead of 10% optimal /lvl for the eagle?

oh any other bonuses gets implemented into the ship hull
then why cant the 4%/lvl resist bonus put directly into the eagle hull and give it another bonus?

The resist bonus is far more powerful than the speed or cap recharge bonus.
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1079 - 2013-07-31 22:26:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Naomi Knight
Kais Fiddler wrote:
Naomi Knight wrote:
btw ishtar gets lame double bonuses why other ships cant get those?
like 7.5% optimal and tracking for med hybrids instead of 10% optimal /lvl for the eagle?

oh any other bonuses gets implemented into the ship hull
then why cant the 4%/lvl resist bonus put directly into the eagle hull and give it another bonus?

The resist bonus is far more powerful than the speed or cap recharge bonus.

not at all , i would take that speed bonus over resist anytime for a roaming sniper ship

btw speed bonus if better ,if you sig tank anyway , not only it lowers the chance you being hit/missile dmg, it allows you to control range which is probably the most important part of pvp in eve
M1k3y Koontz
Speaker for the Dead
Stay Feral
#1080 - 2013-07-31 22:32:19 UTC
Blastil wrote:

the vaga is fine with these changes. minmatar ships have the best damage projection of any ship in the game. The reality is that teh vaga applies its dps almost perfectly, compared to a missile or blaster boat, which might do MORE damage on paper, but less actual damage.



You forget that Projectiles lose DPS over range, unlike missiles. At 20-30k half of the Vaga's DPS is lost to range, before tracking comes into play.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.