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Dev blog: Hacking in Odyssey

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Kimentor
Gallifrey Industries
#321 - 2013-05-30 11:35:12 UTC
I feel like the spew mechanic is alot more of a punishment then a reward, it's frustrating and should be the result of a failed hack, not a successfull one...
Caldain Morrow
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#322 - 2013-06-01 01:44:05 UTC
I've played around with the new hacking on Sisi a bit and I got to say (after just two sites) the mini-game is cool and shows great potential. I'd like to see cooperative hacking (two people same board different ends double teaming a computer would be awesome I think) and there is a potential, if it's as modular as you claim, to really go hog wild with it. (hacking POSes or SOV structures: WIN!) Hell, make SOV structures hackable and destructible but hard enough to hack thatit requires a small gang of hackers. Sounds pretty interactive to me!

The part that I hated within 10 seconds was the bloody can spooge that happens when you "win". I explore solo, I explore BECAUSE it's solo. It's how I make money to fund my other endeavours. Eve and dust are the only MMOs I play and quickest way to get me to log off dust is a squad invite! So far, the best solution I've read is to have the can bukakke but the cans don't disappear. Then it comes down to "do I take the time to chase them all down or do say to hell with it?" Yes, let them drift. Yes, let the other bastards in the game steal them!, Hell! It's the equivalent to ninja salvaging or can flipping GO TEAM! I just really despise being told be fat or get nothing. Make it "be fast, or waste a lot of time chasing cans" running sites in a frig means more cans faster but more risk of getting blown to hell. I've yet o meet a pirate who saw me, scammed my ass then said "you know what, you're too small. Move along" it usually goes more like lock, point, clone express home. Have a nice day.
blue dehazon
Stonegard Arrows
#323 - 2013-06-04 01:10:20 UTC
ccp are making a silly child game for age 6-10 that wat i think after the online intreduction.been more fun whid fast flaying pink pigs to shoot at that droped random loot,and a perfect game for the hacking hawe exsisted for manny years.the mine swep game that coms whid most pc.think they will hawe a hard time making enny thing that will fit better to the hacking game than that,migth be to challanging actually hawe to juse your brain !!! Lol
blue dehazon
Stonegard Arrows
#324 - 2013-06-04 02:25:25 UTC
MiKasha Duan wrote:
Though I am very interested in how these changes will actually work in game play and what, if any, emergent play will blossom from them, I am concerned that one of the few activities in game that could be undertaken by a solo pilot is being forced into a group activity. Will there be skills that will help a solo hacker grab the goodies or are we looking at the death of solo hackers?

Are the cans that are jetted after a successful hack available for anyone, including neuts not in fleet, to take? Or does that action make them suspect? The aspect that I am worried about is after taking the time to play the mini-game, not only can I lose cans if I can't pick them all up in time but some random dude camping the site can reap the benefits of my efforts. If stealing in this manner at least provoked suspect Id have the opportunity to fight for what I earned. If it doesn't, I'll have to sit idly by and watch as my goodies are carried off by someone else.

from 1 of the presentaitions online som comment from some of the ccp gawe more than just a hint that the dont give a dam about solo players team up or gett screwed.and most of the odessy update tells us that the biggist boost was given to gankers.so better join them then banging our heds in the wall.(trained for mining invention t2 hawe more than 105 different BPO sun finnished,and productins skill+PI give it all up whid this update),odessy=gankers heawen Evil
XmonkTad
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#325 - 2013-06-04 03:06:25 UTC
If there is a "consensus" here it is that "spew sucks, please make it stop" which I wholeheartedly agree with. While breaking the loot into multiple containers is a good idea (letting ninjas grab them), the system is bad for new players, annoying for old ones, and really honestly truly can't possibly work towards the goal of making exploration more cooperative.

But I have a few other things to say:
1) Why is the salvage tackle rig so much lower calibration than the Emission Scope/Memetic Algorithm Bank (50 vs 200)? For comparable modules, they have vastly different requirements.

2) Could we have T3s, which have bonused probing, also get bonused "hacking power" like the T1/T2 vessels? And the Gnosis as well!

3) I really really like the idea of other players making exploration dangerous (I'm a lowsec explorer), which is why this minigame is so great. Before, I would sit there and wait for the mod to cycle and spam D-scan, and now I can't really do that.

4) What about implants? The Poteque Prospector line already has a few units in my head, what will they be good for now? A decrease to hacking module cycle time is actually a bad thing to have now!
EnsHui Yongong
NoTone Ltd.
#326 - 2013-06-04 20:50:47 UTC  |  Edited by: EnsHui Yongong
After my first successful hacking attempt (quite disappointing, just some mindless button mashing, looks more interesting than it actually is) I tried to catch the floating pieces with the help of some filters from the system overview. Because such a filter doesn't seem to exist I set the overview to "ALL" (where they also where not shown). The overview was screwed after this: Hard to describe "how" exactly it was screwed, basically objects becoming randomly transparent in a very unpredictable and shifting way. Surely a bug that has to be investigated.
EnsHui Yongong
NoTone Ltd.
#327 - 2013-06-04 20:55:49 UTC  |  Edited by: EnsHui Yongong
Moving the whole group of scanner probes works with left mouse button now instead of shift+LMB before. I don't say it's a bad thing but if you change some long used habits you really should give some hints somewhere on such small little details. Or does it already exist and I missed that one?
Cap Delta
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#328 - 2013-06-05 03:24:45 UTC
Well what can I say regarding the changes on the old (magnometrics)Cry
With the new hacking system it is impossible to open every container. If you do manage to open it you can only get a fraction of the containers contents. The hacking system is so ridiculous - at times no matter where you click a virus appears, they surround you and you have no way out. The amount of Virus Coherence you get is so low not even enough to fight 2 of the viruses. And the boosters you get is just a joke. I think that after training for years to be an explorer it not not worth it anymore. I think the only way is to go shoot rats in belts + anomalies :( And if I knew these changes would come id rather train a cap pilot for rats. CCP if you have any feelings left for us " regular humans " - please reconsider this whole magnometrics change) at least allow us to get all of the contents inside each container. We spend so much time flying, searching and in the end you get only a fraction of what you used to.

On the positive note scanning has became one click less - you don't have to throw out probes to see whats in the system Pirate

Please hear our prayers!
Galatea Galilei
Nihilistic Mystics
#329 - 2013-06-05 06:28:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Galatea Galilei
Well, hacking has become a fun little minigame I love. Unfortnately, looting has become an arcade game requiring substantially better speed and hand/eye coordination than I possess. It's really frustrating watching a whole fleet of cans go poof while you only get three or four if you're lucky. One thing I used to like about EVE was that it was really more of a strategy game than an arcade game. I can't do the latter... and now I can't really get much reward from exploring either... :(

At least get the little darn cans on the overview so that I can actually click on them. They're way too small to click on quickly in space, even if the were stationary, which they aren't... or get something like tab-targeting in other MMOs working here. Nearly everything in the in-space view uses icons too small to be clicked on quickly with the mouse. The overview is what makes the game playable in the absence of tab-targeting. If the cans don't show up there, there's no way anyone who isn't good at arcade games can get more than a fraction of them before they poof. Or make them last long enough that you can get more than three or four before they disappear...
Dieter Rams
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#330 - 2013-06-05 12:42:16 UTC
How long does the loot stay in space and how many friends do you need to get it all? Also, how close do you have to be in order to tractor the stuff?

Thanks
Shatterdoof
HAL Institute for Criminally Insane Robots
#331 - 2013-06-05 18:46:26 UTC
Galatea Galilei wrote:
Well, hacking has become a fun little minigame I love. Unfortnately, looting has become an arcade game requiring substantially better speed and hand/eye coordination than I possess. It's really frustrating watching a whole fleet of cans go poof while you only get three or four if you're lucky. One thing I used to like about EVE was that it was really more of a strategy game than an arcade game. I can't do the latter... and now I can't really get much reward from exploring either... :(

At least get the little darn cans on the overview so that I can actually click on them. They're way too small to click on quickly in space, even if the were stationary, which they aren't... or get something like tab-targeting in other MMOs working here. Nearly everything in the in-space view uses icons too small to be clicked on quickly with the mouse. The overview is what makes the game playable in the absence of tab-targeting. If the cans don't show up there, there's no way anyone who isn't good at arcade games can get more than a fraction of them before they poof. Or make them last long enough that you can get more than three or four before they disappear...


I can't echo this enough. Especially if you're playing on a machine with a touchpad (i know...) i barely get 1-2 cans per hacking success.

I don't mind the minigame, but the "hurry up and double-click on all the cans as you try rotating in space" sucks.
Freeky
Creative Productions
#332 - 2013-06-06 10:46:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Freeky
why make the cans disappear. the exploding part ok but setting a time limit is down right stupid.

cans no time limit and make them show up on your overview.

Also why try and dumb down the scanning part so a 5 yr old can do it. eve should be about a certain amount of skill with a hint of luck thrown in.
Nao as Guerras
New Eden Research Department
#333 - 2013-06-07 10:33:02 UTC
Yep, difficulty went up, compensation went down, at least in 0.0.
So, why do these sites in fleet when you you can do combat sites that pay more?

The exploration sites are not something that were or will be done in larger fleets, that makes no sense to start with.
My guess is that most small fleets that were doing exploration were main-alt combinations to kill the rats.

I do like the chance element that was added to the hacking and analyzing, but why bother if the rewards go poof........
'll take my alt and do lvl 8-10's where rewards are way better.....

I believe prices for for example intact armorplates and powercirquits are going up as we speak.

That was not the intention if i understand correctly...

Also, in a future expansion i'd like to see my clone enter the object to hack (like in the captains quarters), get lost in a maze and get blown up together with the ship if the hack is unsuccesfull and i cannot get back in time.
At least it would be exciting .......
Kusum Fawn
Perkone
Caldari State
#334 - 2013-06-15 16:22:39 UTC
CCP hasnt responded to this thread.
Must mean everything is ok now.

Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#335 - 2013-06-17 15:38:27 UTC
So yesterday I was involved in my first participation of hacking/analysing. It was in a relic site in a wormhole. I didn't do the actual hacking, I was one of the picker-uppers.

My observation is that it changes the dynamic of hacking in a wormhole in a surprisingly positive way:

Previously, hacking was left to one poor sod who had to stay behind after the sleepers were killed and salvaged while everyone else went and did something more interesting. Often this was done on a second account while the main was sleeper-killing in the next site.

Now a number of people have to stick around and if they do, the overall rewards from (at least a cat 5) relic site are magnificently increased, making it worth the time.

It gave us a chance to have a bit of downtime between sites, chatting, checking d-scan etc before engaging in the comedy click-fest once the hacker finished with the container.

One relic site yielded 2 or 3 intact jobbies and at least 6 malfunctioning ones. So that's a couple of hundred million just for having a chat with my mates.

So, at least from my perspective, the hacking changes are ok. I probably wouldn't bother to go to lowsec to do this though.

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#336 - 2013-06-24 17:45:57 UTC
Quick update.

We found a nullsec connection and because there weren't many of us about, we decided to try this hacking lark in 0.0

It turned out to be a bit of a laugh actually - checking d-scan, scouting gates, waiting for the hacking guy to either hack or blow up the can. It was quite tense and again surprisingly enjoyable. A few of the guys did this while a few others went off scouting for wormholes and sites to see if we could gank someone.

It didn't yield a lot of money, but I can imagine that hacking these sites will be a fun way to encourage a 0-sec skirmish, which is always a fun way to lose some of the stupendous amounts of ISK we make in wormholes.

I stand corrected. The hacking does not suck. It's actually ok.

/MC

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
SportBilly
GHOSTS OF THE FIRST AND ONLY
#337 - 2013-06-30 05:34:19 UTC
Cap Delta wrote:
Well what can I say regarding the changes on the old (magnometrics)Cry
With the new hacking system it is impossible to open every container. If you do manage to open it you can only get a fraction of the containers contents. The hacking system is so ridiculous - at times no matter where you click a virus appears, they surround you and you have no way out. The amount of Virus Coherence you get is so low not even enough to fight 2 of the viruses. And the boosters you get is just a joke. I think that after training for years to be an explorer it not not worth it anymore. I think the only way is to go shoot rats in belts + anomalies :( And if I knew these changes would come id rather train a cap pilot for rats. CCP if you have any feelings left for us " regular humans " - please reconsider this whole magnometrics change) at least allow us to get all of the contents inside each container. We spend so much time flying, searching and in the end you get only a fraction of what you used to.

On the positive note scanning has became one click less - you don't have to throw out probes to see whats in the system Pirate

Please hear our prayers!

I couldnt agree more , i also explore solo, only to spend more time button punching instead of actualy exploring! To then get nothing of value, waste of time.

The other thing ive noticed the probes changed back to spread pattern when you use the list to change range but not if you grab a probe in space (map view) and reduce its range.

Not an improvement to the game over all.
RoAnnon
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#338 - 2013-07-01 14:37:04 UTC
Our wormhole corp has, for the most part, stopped hacking/analyzing any data/relic sites any more. The relic sites used to be the big money makers for us, but they are no longer. It is now more efficient on an isk/hour basis to just run the site escalations and move on to the next site. Most of the folks I know that are in other wormhole corps have said they are doing the same. We anticipate that the price of T3s are going to skyrocket based on scarcity. If they do, at that point the sites may become isk efficient again. But since it seems that all of CCPs changes lately are geared toward higher prices, it would appear everything is working as intended.

So, you're a bounty hunter. No, that ain't it at all. Then what are you? I'm a bounty hunter.

Broadcast4Reps

Eve Vegas 2015 Pub Crawl Group 9

Houston EVE Meet
Kronthar Lionkur
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#339 - 2013-07-02 10:31:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Kronthar Lionkur
Galatea Galilei wrote:
Well, hacking has become a fun little minigame I love. Unfortnately, looting has become an arcade game requiring substantially better speed and hand/eye coordination than I possess. It's really frustrating watching a whole fleet of cans go poof while you only get three or four if you're lucky. One thing I used to like about EVE was that it was really more of a strategy game than an arcade game. I can't do the latter... and now I can't really get much reward from exploring either... :(

At least get the little darn cans on the overview so that I can actually click on them. They're way too small to click on quickly in space, even if the were stationary, which they aren't... or get something like tab-targeting in other MMOs working here. Nearly everything in the in-space view uses icons too small to be clicked on quickly with the mouse. The overview is what makes the game playable in the absence of tab-targeting. If the cans don't show up there, there's no way anyone who isn't good at arcade games can get more than a fraction of them before they poof. Or make them last long enough that you can get more than three or four before they disappear...



Agree with Galatea, new hacking system it's ok for me and hopefully may be expanded and improved in the future, but really, cans not showing up on the overview? why was this exception allowed to happen?
Gal Caldarius
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#340 - 2013-07-15 02:57:43 UTC
I don't see what all the great things you are saying about the new hacking system.
I could have killed a number of C4 anoms in the time it has taken me to hack these cans.
Will be the last relic site I open till we have a surer way of maximizing my time/profits