EVE General Discussion

Is that a gender thing, or a personality thing? We've all seen the incursion runners whose bios have some large amount of damage their artillery inflicted on some Sansha NPC, and those are presumably not all women.

I don't PVP in WoW either--when I actually remember I have WoW, which is about once every other month. My destruction warlock got a rash of duel requests from hypercaffeinated teenagers who could go from eager to frustrated to LAME, BORED NOW in about the time it took me to decide whether I felt like accepting. Not my scene. In fact, one of the things I prefer about EVE is that there's very little twitch gameplay. Even the PVP is (relatively!) slow paced.

On the other hand, my wife found herself in a PVP game within Guild Wars 2 quite accidentally, and she completely got into it. She has a competitive streak a mile wide, so that didn't surprise either of us. She's since gotten into the high-end PVP in that game. I've asked her about EVE, and the response was, "I am not a spaceship." She's OK with the PVP, leery of how backgrounded the story is, but no avatar gameplay means no sale. That's fine; EVE can't appeal to everyone, and it shouldn't lose itself trying. But she doesn't feel that way because she's a woman. There are obviously women who enjoy EVE as is. She's part of the 50% or so of gamers of either gender who want to be able to identify with their in-game avatars.

And that gets back to the point that although EVE-the-game can definitely stand a few more rounds of polish, and CCP should definitely continue to iterate on improving the game for the sake of improving the game, the main problem is outside the game. Much of it is even outside gaming altogether. It's not a small problem, but it's a solvable problem.

And the danger of appealing "to women" is that women are individuals with wildly divergent tastes. Appealing to some perceived social norm (in an international game? good luck!) isn't going to work either, because women just might fire up an imaginary character in an imaginary universe to get the hell away from all that for a while, just as men often do.

No, I didn't live back then, but that hardly disqualifies me from discussing the topic. Also, you may want to notice that most of things you mentioned, are racial issues, not gender ones. Although I have no idea what Earned Run Average has to do with any of this.

Furthermore, the kind of bra-burning misandrist rhetoric that abounded back then is entirely out of place here. Also, what mistakes? Repeating history by doing what?

Anyway, my comment was made to highlight the irony of you calling me a dinosaur, then using a term that was dated before I was born. Weren't you the one telling me to get with the times? Anyway, moving on.

Malcanis, though he and I do not always agree, has a much more realistic set of numbers than yours.

500k to 5mil? Complete hyperbole.

500k to 530k? Legitimately achievable.

Now, this is the part I do take exception to. 51% of gamers are not female. I mentioned this before, but that statistic is completely trumped up. If you even pretend to play at real statistics, the number is closer to 10%. This is because you can't count Facebook and mobile "gaming" as actually being gamers (of which, btw, some 75-80% or so are female). Those people don't, and won't, play EVE in numbers of enough significance to make them a demographic worth targeting. That's like putting out an ad campaign aimed at Latvian immigrants to Canada.

Do those people buy and play a lot of games? Sure. Are they gamers? No, they're Facebook'ers. They're IPod'ers. If they even consider EVE, and most of them won't, they will all go back to their old staple games. Just like WoW players, another demographic that we should not be wasting our time on targeting.

Right on the mark. The overt vocal sexism is annoying, but ignorable. It's the "Ohh, a girl! I gotta help them out. They're naturally inferior, obviously they need a man's help to get by in this man's game. Nevermind said girl has been playing EVE since beta..."


I've seen it plenty of times, though...Killboard a mile long, feminine voice on comms, and "Ohh who helped you with that?"

It really doesn't help that there's immature girls out there who take utter advantage of having sex organs on the inside to play the "poor little me" line to get stuff from men. Makes the rest of us look bad.

I'd say it's hard to estimate, myself. THere are some out there who consider the mere mention of "I'm a woman" to be "Grrl gamer taking advantage lol drama!".

Along with that, we have the metagame in EVE, where some gals play the "poor little me" card specifically to take ISK away from marks.

Honestly, I think there are very few "Poor little me I'm a silly GRRL GAMUR help me out and buy me stuff look at my boobies teehee" types out there. It's just, they tend to be loud, annoying, and have a huge white-knight following.


To clarify...there are "Girl gamers", and there are gamers who are girls. The former, girls who just happen to play games. The latter, gamers who just happen to be girls.

I may have engaged in this behavior once or twice. Practicing for future corporate heists. Oh crap...I posted this on my main. Drats!

I have certainly played a girl in games to take advantage of the little nerds thinking whatever it is that they think when giving me stuff.

So I will never pass judgment on a real girl for doing the same thing.

How can you people, who play a game that's all about taking unfair advantage of other players, even entertain the thought that using your gender for gain is a bad or unfair thing? Some serious boobie envy goin' on here.

Mr Epeen

Lol I'm not actually mad. It was just funny to me.

Also, who the hell posts in a thread about sexism and gender disparities with the name "Lady Areola Fappington"

I see what you're saying. I ID as a female, because..well, I am. To me, I see a difference between (corpchat) "Hey man, hows yer girlfriend doing" "it's boyfriend, I'm a girl" vs. (corpchat) "HEY ERRYBODY GIRL GAMER REPORTING IN!"

The banning all women is..honestly a little sad. It's the sexism I was referring to, that makes MMOGs no fun for ladies. There's two parts to all "girl drama", and from my side, it seems to end up being a bunch of desperate guys vying for affection. Sadly, gamer girls can be just as socially inept as male counterparts, and...drama.

You're totally correct on the stable relationship part, too. It's the "OMG I got a chance with this one!" socially inept single guys running into "WOW I'm finally a 10!" socially inept single girls. Those of us past that point just want to get our game on.

C'mon man, simple things for simple minds! Even us chicks can giggle at sophomoric "lol boobies" humor. If it helps, you can call me Rebecca.