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[Odyssey Feedback Request] Team Super Friends - Probe Scanning and You

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Penny Ibramovic
Wormhole Engineers
#581 - 2013-05-10 17:50:57 UTC
Probes are launched around your ship, but appear around the star in the system map. This is confusing, as it can convince players that the probes are already in a certain position. Making the probes appear around the ship in the system map too also allows for them to be moved directly upwards more easily, so that they can be hidden from d-scan quickly.

A scan result of 75% or higher gives a green bar, which gives the wrong visual indication that the scan is complete when it isn't.

The 'spread' formation has significant gaps in its coverage. The probes really still need to overlap to avoid this.

The pinpoint formation should perhaps have the default range of 8 AU. Unless I'm mistaken in my understanding, sites can appear up to 4 AU from planets, and wormholes farther, so if the 4 AU pinpoint pattern is centred on a planet it could still result in fuzzy spheres or rings from signatures near their placement limit.

Sorting the results by distance is good. Sorting the results by type is useful too.

There are no time limits displayed on probes. I presume this is because they no longer have a time limit. But they can't last forever, or a scout that is killed with probes launched will leave space debris everywhere. Will probes in space be deleted every downtime?

The range overlay when moving probes is useful, but less so when no numbers are visible, either on the concentric rings of the overlay or on the probe sphere for its current range.
Olari Vanderfall
Perkone
Caldari State
#582 - 2013-05-10 17:51:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Olari Vanderfall
I'm not so concerned about the DSP removal for Intel. Drop 2 or 3 combats around for system coverage.

My concern is I used DSP in a 4/4 layout with combats to great effect. To replicate it, I would like the ability to set probe sizes in formation that maintain their relative sizes when increasing /decreasing probe sizes.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#583 - 2013-05-10 17:54:08 UTC
Olari Vanderfall wrote:
I'm not so concerned about the DSP removal for Intel. Drop 2 or 3 combats around for system coverage.

My concern is I used DSP in a 4/4 layout with combats to great effect. To replicate it, I would like the ability to set probe sizes in formation that maintain their relative sizes when increasing /decreasing probe sizes.

I thing as a group, our point is we all have reasons for the DSP and removing them hurts us all.
The DSP is not being made obsolete by the new scanner overlay.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Chandaris
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#584 - 2013-05-10 18:00:19 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.


DSP Probes DO have other uses that CCP may not realize.

PLEASE see my thread in F&I and consider not removing them from the game. They are used in various aspects of both offensive, and defensive PVP and fill a niche other probes cannot provide.

Link to F&I discussion thread https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=233911&find=unread
Kadl
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#585 - 2013-05-10 18:01:36 UTC
Sulvorati Kunoki wrote:
Kadl wrote:
Ischie wrote:
Deep Space ProbesQuestion


Deep space probes give info on ships, signatures, and structures. Please tell me that the new system scanner gives the same info and also has a range of 64+ au and you can remove deep space probes. if not, you will be removing a feature that works well within the game currently and it will just make wormhole god Bob mad.


The new system scanner does not give the same info, but it does have an infinite range.


Infinite? No.


Infinite is Fozzie's wording not mine. It is clear that he intends the sensor overlay to show all anomalies and signatures within a system no mater how far away.
Olari Vanderfall
Perkone
Caldari State
#586 - 2013-05-10 18:02:17 UTC
I honestly don't think it matters. Sounds like they want to ditch the DSP.

With probe formations individual style of probe placement becomes irrelevant because before you needed to balance your skill at laying out probes as quickly and efficiently as you could. That was part of the skill component. If I can click a button and have optimal probe arrangement everyone will have this same layout. Now the only skill will be how fast you can center your group on a sig.
Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
#587 - 2013-05-10 18:05:36 UTC
Chandaris wrote:
CCP Tallest wrote:

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.


DSP Probes DO have other uses that CCP may not realize.



I want CCP to acknowledge that they DO REALIZE the pvp usage of DSP and are tossing them away anyway. Let me know CCP Tallest.

i hope i am wrong....
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#588 - 2013-05-10 18:08:21 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:

Quote:

Copy results as table

Switching the probe result UI from raw table to a progress bar meant that we lost this much loved functionality. We are working on getting it back.


If you can't make it a table which can be C&Ped from, how about a button which just dumps the information to the clipboard? (Might be the easier option anyway) 'Just' match the sorting from the display. It's not /quite/ as good, as you'll always get all of it. But that's better than nothing.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Tarsas Phage
Sniggerdly
#589 - 2013-05-10 18:14:33 UTC
Chiming in to say that I too am dismayed at the surprise deprecation of DSPs. Please keep them, in as close as their current functionality as possible.
Tzar Sinak
Mythic Heights
#590 - 2013-05-10 18:42:42 UTC
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

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Mimiru Minahiro
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#591 - 2013-05-10 18:43:50 UTC
I for one am glad to see the 256AU enhanced d-scan go away.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#592 - 2013-05-10 18:44:55 UTC
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

The skill effects are being reduced, to half if what they currently are. Logging on to Sisi will tell you this.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Olari Vanderfall
Perkone
Caldari State
#593 - 2013-05-10 18:45:59 UTC
Consider the DSP dead.

Number of probes for exploring

Pre-Apychropha: 21
Pre-Odyssey: 3
Tzar Sinak
Mythic Heights
#594 - 2013-05-10 18:48:20 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

The skill effects are being reduced, to half if what they currently are. Logging on to Sisi will tell you this.


I'll try again. The skill RANKS not the EFFECTS; will the RANKS be changed?

Hydrostatic Podcast First class listening of all things EVE

Check out the Eve-Prosper show for your market updates!
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#595 - 2013-05-10 18:50:56 UTC
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

The skill effects are being reduced, to half if what they currently are. Logging on to Sisi will tell you this.


I'll try again. The skill RANKS not the EFFECTS; will the RANKS be changed?

Correct the ranks will remain the same, the EFFECTS are being reduced.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Haulie Berry
#596 - 2013-05-10 19:00:08 UTC
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

The skill effects are being reduced, to half if what they currently are. Logging on to Sisi will tell you this.


I'll try again. The skill RANKS not the EFFECTS; will the RANKS be changed?


Jesus christ. How the **** could anyone still not understand that NO, THE RANKS ARE NOT BEING CHANGED. This has been reiterated on damn near every page of this thread now.
Tzar Sinak
Mythic Heights
#597 - 2013-05-10 19:02:54 UTC
Haulie Berry wrote:
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Please confirm that the exploration skill RANKS are not being reduced.

The skill effects are being reduced, to half if what they currently are. Logging on to Sisi will tell you this.


I'll try again. The skill RANKS not the EFFECTS; will the RANKS be changed?


Jesus christ. How the **** could anyone still not understand that NO, THE RANKS ARE NOT BEING CHANGED. This has been reiterated on damn near every page of this thread now.


Why thank you. A straightforward answer to a straight forward question. Was not so hard was it.

Hydrostatic Podcast First class listening of all things EVE

Check out the Eve-Prosper show for your market updates!
Haulie Berry
#598 - 2013-05-10 19:04:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Haulie Berry
CCP Tallest wrote:
...stuff...


Sounds good. I do really think, though, that you guys should seriously consider weakening the strength of many of the PvE signatures.

They're just too easy to find, imo - I basically have to make absolutely no compromises with respect to my ship choice, ship fitting, rigs, or implants to scan down the best sites.

With the introduction of even more ways to increase scan strength, it seems like there is a lot of room to adjust this.
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#599 - 2013-05-10 19:14:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Tonto Auri
CCP Tallest wrote:
Most people seemed to be using 7 probes.

You drunk from yesterday? Most people using 4, 5 or 8. I mean, people who actually know what they are doing and have Astro 5. (Which is why, probably, you refer to 7 probes. Astro 4 is a major stopping point for many who are "kinda into it", but "not too bothered to go that deep".)

> Additionally, that number lends itself much better to isometric shapes

Tetrahedron - 4 probes. Double tetra - 8 probes. Dual cross - 8 probes.

> which are easy to identify and assemble.

You never scanned in your life, are you?

> Fixing it at 7 probes was done to simplify things for less experienced players

It teaches bad habits to new players, complicate things for experienced players, and increase scanning deviation.

> and reduce micromanagement of probes.

Let us save our own presets. Problem solved.

Quote:
The overwhelming consensus in this thread is that you want the 8th probe back, so we are now working on putting it back.

Sheesh...

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison
Zu'ferna
Astral Horizons
#600 - 2013-05-10 19:16:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Zu'ferna
CCP Paradox wrote:



Exploration site signature changes
Unknown sites now display whether it is a Wormwhole or Combat site when you discover the group.
Signature Types have been changed to:
Combat Sites (from Unknown)
Wormhole (from Unknown)
Data Sites (from Radar)
Relic Sites (from Magnometric)
Gas Sites (from Ladar)
Ore Sites (from Gravimetric)



Yes! Just what I wanted! CCP to dumb things down to levels that 4 year olds can understand without thinknig. This is the greatest thing ever! /sarcasm

Seriously, stupidest thing ever, way to go WoW's route. Dumb things down to casual levels. This is a sci-fi game. Let us *Expletive deleted* use sci-fi names for stuff. Keep it up and you will fall into WoW's pace. Good for you.

Also, hate making scanning easier. I took the time to learn to do it, everyone else should too. It's not freaking hard. Launhing probes at once, good. Scanning mods, good. Everything else, bad.