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[Odyssey Feedback Request] Team Super Friends - Probe Scanning and You

First post First post First post
Author
AtomYcX
Perkone
Caldari State
#561 - 2013-05-10 17:07:53 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
things


<3 ..apart from the DSPs.
Kadl
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#562 - 2013-05-10 17:13:48 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey all.

Lovely feedback. Keep it coming.


Thank you for the update. It seems like the plan is to replace the deep space probe with the sensor overlay. I hope that the Five-O group knows this and can come up with a sufficient replacement.

Who should we be talking to for putting the sites identified by the sensor overlay on the system map?
Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus
#563 - 2013-05-10 17:16:15 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:

Most people seemed to be using 7 probes. Additionally, that number lends itself much better to isometric shapes which are easy to identify and assemble. Fixing it at 7 probes was done to simplify things for less experienced players and reduce micromanagement of probes. The overwhelming consensus in this thread is that you want the 8th probe back, so we are now working on putting it back.



You gave part of the reason why people predominantly use(d) 7 probes. Ease of assembling the setup. Time is often a factor that can be more important than using the perfect setup resolution-wise.

With predefined configurations time will be a non-issue and assembling difficulty will be a one-time investment, so people will aim to use the most efficient setup. (Which IMO would be two tetrahedrons with different scan ranges and main direction, btw :))
Beaver Retriever
Reality Sequence
#564 - 2013-05-10 17:16:35 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey all.

Lovely feedback. Keep it coming.
You've identified several defects and made us rethink some of our design decisions. This is what the test server is all about.
Paradox has a list of the known issues in the OP: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2995203

Some examples of what the team has been discussing based on this thread:

Quote:

Deep Space Probes??!?

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.

Quote:

The 8th probe

Most people seemed to be using 7 probes. Additionally, that number lends itself much better to isometric shapes which are easy to identify and assemble. Fixing it at 7 probes was done to simplify things for less experienced players and reduce micromanagement of probes. The overwhelming consensus in this thread is that you want the 8th probe back, so we are now working on putting it back.

Quote:

Copy results as table

Switching the probe result UI from raw table to a progress bar meant that we lost this much loved functionality. We are working on getting it back.

.... cont

Good replies, but in general I just want to say that it seems you're operating from a philosophy where if players aren't using something, you remove it and simplify things instead of making more current things viable.

To put it this way, if the ship rebalancing team had followed this philosophy, they would just remove 3-4 ships from each ship line instead of rebalancing them all.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#565 - 2013-05-10 17:16:55 UTC
Also what about keeping our skills as is, they work fine no real need to change how they work.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.

Olari Vanderfall
Perkone
Caldari State
#566 - 2013-05-10 17:17:07 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.



This was not the only thing. Deep probes and combats could be arranged in a pattern where the deep probe is 2 sizes larger than the combat (8/2; 4 /1; 2/0.5) so that when you resize one type of probe when they are all highlighted they will maintain this relationship. This is an advanced technique to scan in WH.



Sulvorati Kunoki
Sunstrike Enterprises
#567 - 2013-05-10 17:17:17 UTC
The forum won't let me post this as a reply.../

The functionality of DSP's is not replicated by the new system so far on the test server.

Leave them alone!!.

Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
#568 - 2013-05-10 17:17:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Kitanga
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey all.



Deep Space Probes??!?

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.




The overlay does not give all the intel that a single DSP at 256au gives you. does the overlay show ships? player owned structures? anything other than cosmic/gravimetric/anomalies? as far as i understand it, and with the testing i have done, the answer is no. please acknowledge that you as a team will rethink this further.
Utremi Fasolasi
La Dolce Vita
#569 - 2013-05-10 17:23:05 UTC
Ciba Lexlulu wrote:
I was playing around with the new probing mechanic and trying to find Radar (new Data) and Magneto (new Relic) sites. Unfortunately only can find Relic sites. Unless something is broken, out of 4 Relic sites in Null and Low in Sisi, there are no 'cans' to be hacked/analyzed with the new Relic analyzer.

Has this been seeded in Sisi?


Yes I found a Data site very quickly in Orvolle when I signed in.
Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus
#570 - 2013-05-10 17:24:48 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Also what about keeping our skills as is, they work fine no real need to change how they work.


Since they sem to be moving away from the limitation of using exactly 7 probes, reverting the skill change would be an option, true.

On the other hand, I just finished Astrometrics V because of the nice skill boni it will give :) (I'd be ok with only getting the 8th probe, though)
CCP Paradox
#571 - 2013-05-10 17:25:27 UTC
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Also what about keeping our skills as is, they work fine no real need to change how they work.


Since they sem to be moving away from the limitation of using exactly 7 probes, reverting the skill change would be an option, true.

On the other hand, I just finished Astrometrics V because of the nice skill boni it will give :) (I'd be ok with only getting the 8th probe, though)


Skill changes are final.

CCP Paradox | EVE QA | Team Phenomenon

Space Magician

Olari Vanderfall
Perkone
Caldari State
#572 - 2013-05-10 17:29:16 UTC
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:


With predefined configurations time will be a non-issue and assembling difficulty will be a one-time investment, so people will aim to use the most efficient setup. (Which IMO would be two tetrahedrons with different scan ranges and main direction, btw :))


This is the configuration you could use with deeps and combats. For speed they would be planar, but still highly effective.
Ischie
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#573 - 2013-05-10 17:29:23 UTC
Deep Space ProbesQuestion


Deep space probes give info on ships, signatures, and structures. Please tell me that the new system scanner gives the same info and also has a range of 64+ au and you can remove deep space probes. if not, you will be removing a feature that works well within the game currently and it will just make wormhole god Bob mad.
Sulvorati Kunoki
Sunstrike Enterprises
#574 - 2013-05-10 17:34:23 UTC
Ischie wrote:
Deep Space ProbesQuestion


Deep space probes give info on ships, signatures, and structures. Please tell me that the new system scanner gives the same info and also has a range of 64+ au and you can remove deep space probes. if not, you will be removing a feature that works well within the game currently and it will just make wormhole god Bob mad.



Currently NO. I hope wormhole god Bob has more influence than me.
Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
#575 - 2013-05-10 17:34:58 UTC
Kitanga wrote:
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey all.



Deep Space Probes??!?

The purpose of Deep Space Probes is to give you a quick scan of the solar system before you start probing things down. The new system overlay already gives you this information without needing probes so Deep Space Probes are no longer needed.




The overlay does not give all the intel that a single DSP at 256au gives you. does the overlay show ships? player owned structures? anything other than cosmic/gravimetric/anomalies? as far as i understand it, and with the testing i have done, the answer is no. please acknowledge that you as a team will rethink this further.



or at least acknowledge that it is indeed your fully conscious intent to nerf this intel gathering ability, so that i can move on to considering my monthly subscription instead of posting here.
Jack Ogeko
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#576 - 2013-05-10 17:41:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Ogeko
i use dsp, and my opinion is, if you wish to make scaning more common and easy for ppl by removing deep space probe and give sensor overlay, for giving ppl faster way to use dps method of scaning, that ppl not must wait for make astrometic 5, is ok, but then sensor overlay must work like dps or better, doing from sensor overlay something like on board dsp scaner.

i don't realy care abaut skill points adavantage, becouse this is not advantage, you can buy 100mil sp char and still skill your barbie char and problem is solved

but if you nerf dsp scaning method by nerfing functionality, by not move all futures of deep space probe, to sensor overlay then is very not nice
Kadl
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#577 - 2013-05-10 17:41:56 UTC
Ischie wrote:
Deep Space ProbesQuestion


Deep space probes give info on ships, signatures, and structures. Please tell me that the new system scanner gives the same info and also has a range of 64+ au and you can remove deep space probes. if not, you will be removing a feature that works well within the game currently and it will just make wormhole god Bob mad.


The new system scanner does not give the same info, but it does have an infinite range.
ArmEagle Kusoni
Knights of Nii
The 20 Minuters
#578 - 2013-05-10 17:42:53 UTC
The 'problem' with the sensor overlay, is that you don't have the information available at a glance.

Since you now make anoms (and grav sites) more easily available, heck, even signatures can been pinpointed quite well without using probes; using DSPs would give a very clear list of changes in your system. A perfect defensive mechanism.

The DPSs and the System Scanner lets you easily filter out all the things that you trust. But with the Sensor Overlay you have to keep panning around and around, to see whether a new wormhole opened up, meaning there's a possible threat.

Yes, I am talking about W-space.

Removing DSPs makes things a lot harder actually. Sure, new players don't have the skills to use them. But I trained a very long time to be able to use them, making it easier to see what's going on in our W-system. And now you take that away.


The Sensor Overlay looks really nice. I'm not sure how Fozzie(?) described the wish for it; more realistic? But nothing beats having a single list with results. And that's how I'd see it when I'd be in a space ship too, on some panel, or a 3d-hologram of the system;; the System Scanner.
Utremi Fasolasi
La Dolce Vita
#579 - 2013-05-10 17:46:25 UTC
Kitanga wrote:
[quote=Kitanga]


or at least acknowledge that it is indeed your fully conscious intent to nerf this intel gathering ability, so that i can move on to considering my monthly subscription instead of posting here.


Your stuff I can haz?
Sulvorati Kunoki
Sunstrike Enterprises
#580 - 2013-05-10 17:48:04 UTC
Kadl wrote:
Ischie wrote:
Deep Space ProbesQuestion


Deep space probes give info on ships, signatures, and structures. Please tell me that the new system scanner gives the same info and also has a range of 64+ au and you can remove deep space probes. if not, you will be removing a feature that works well within the game currently and it will just make wormhole god Bob mad.


The new system scanner does not give the same info, but it does have an infinite range.


Infinite? No.