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So what happens if we feel the CSM does not represent us?

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Steelshine
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#141 - 2011-09-07 20:05:38 UTC
Flamespar wrote:
With all the chest beating that is going on from the CSM, and their constant claims to speak for the playerbase even though they can only claim to represent a subset.

And with all the the constant anti-CCP drivel (some justified, some wild speculation) that they feel free to spout to whomever will listen. I want to know:

What happens if the CSM is abusing it's privilage? If subscriptions are down, is it also not possible that CSM is complicit due to the damage that they are doing to EVE through interviews like the Mitanni has been doing?

Can we, the players that they claim to represent, ask them to step down?


Hello, CCP upper management alt!
Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#142 - 2011-09-07 20:05:49 UTC
pussnheels wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
To all who voted for me: I hope I've represented you well! Feel free to contact me to discuss issues you'd like represented.

hugs and kisses,


The guy who won the election.


Ididn t vote for you, the candidate i voted for didn't got elected but i am not complaining that is democracy
But i just can t help it feeling that you and the other delegates are more interested in putting your own alliance with its people in a advantage aslong you are a CSM delegate, and i am not the only one thinking this

Don t get me wrong you have my respect all of you for giving up your spare time and time in your favorite hobby to be a CSM delegate, but as i mentioned in my previous post the majority CSM members only represents a minority of all eve players all because the big majority never bothers to vote or is unaware of what the CSM is



Amount of mails I've received by people trying to get their voice heard or issue raised? 3.


You gotta meet us half way. I trolled the **** out of people in this thread because they obviously only posted to try and troll us. I can do it back. That's the way it works and their voices are ignored, as they should be because they are only trying to throw punches instead of get the game fixed. Screw them. They are unimportant and I don't have to care about them. I'm busy representing people who care about this game and want it to be what we remember it could be.

However if you contact me with a real issue and want it addressed I will work with you no matter if you are 0.0, lowsec, empire or wormhole based. If I'm not an expert in your area I'll work with people who have the knowledge necessary to develop a coherent argument to bring to CCP to get things fixed. I take this seriously and will do what I can to represent you.

If however, you're just going to post some throwaway post taking cheap shots? Well don't whine when I don't act like I'm supposed to revere your horrible post as if it's some sacred thing that needs to be mined for a potential vote by some campaign manager cause I obviously don't represent you.


Tethys Atreides
The Audacity of Huge
#143 - 2011-09-07 20:13:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Tethys Atreides
Vile rat wrote:

Amount of mails I've received by people trying to get their voice heard or issue raised? 3.


You gotta meet us half way. I trolled the **** out of people in this thread because they obviously only posted to try and troll us. I can do it back. That's the way it works and their voices are ignored, as they should be because they are only trying to throw punches instead of get the game fixed. Screw them. They are unimportant and I don't have to care about them. I'm busy representing people who care about this game and want it to be what we remember it could be.

However if you contact me with a real issue and want it addressed I will work with you no matter if you are 0.0, lowsec, empire or wormhole based. If I'm not an expert in your area I'll work with people who have the knowledge necessary to develop a coherent argument to bring to CCP to get things fixed. I take this seriously and will do what I can to represent you.

If however, you're just going to post some throwaway post taking cheap shots? Well don't whine when I don't act like I'm supposed to revere your horrible post as if it's some sacred thing that needs to be mined for a potential vote by some campaign manager cause I obviously don't represent you.


This is the first substantive post I've seen from one of you guys in a long time.

Thank you.

If I may make a suggestion:

Ignore the trolls and deal with us in this manner all the time. It will garner you respect, and quite possibly repeat trips to the great white north...
White Tree
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#144 - 2011-09-07 20:21:34 UTC
Tethys Atreides wrote:

This is the first substantive post I've seen from one of you guys in a long time.

Thank you.



We're all like this. If people ask us genuine questions and come to us with genuine concerns then we're only too happy to help you. Seriously.

Former member of CSM6.
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#145 - 2011-09-07 20:21:57 UTC
Some of you may be wondering what kind of things we get up to in our internal forum discussions with CCP.

A summary of prior and currently ongoing CSM/CCP discussion topics is now available on the wiki.

Your tax ISK at work, etc.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery
triplleboy
Malum Mortuus
#146 - 2011-09-07 20:24:35 UTC
Tethys Atreides wrote:
Vile rat wrote:

Amount of mails I've received by people trying to get their voice heard or issue raised? 3.


You gotta meet us half way. I trolled the **** out of people in this thread because they obviously only posted to try and troll us. I can do it back. That's the way it works and their voices are ignored, as they should be because they are only trying to throw punches instead of get the game fixed. Screw them. They are unimportant and I don't have to care about them. I'm busy representing people who care about this game and want it to be what we remember it could be.

However if you contact me with a real issue and want it addressed I will work with you no matter if you are 0.0, lowsec, empire or wormhole based. If I'm not an expert in your area I'll work with people who have the knowledge necessary to develop a coherent argument to bring to CCP to get things fixed. I take this seriously and will do what I can to represent you.

If however, you're just going to post some throwaway post taking cheap shots? Well don't whine when I don't act like I'm supposed to revere your horrible post as if it's some sacred thing that needs to be mined for a potential vote by some campaign manager cause I obviously don't represent you.


This is the first substantive post I've seen from one of you guys in a long time.

Thank you.

If I make make a suggestion:

Ignore the trolls and deal with us in this manner all the time. It will garner you respect, and quite possibly repeat trips to the great white north...


^^ long time no see ^^
Jita Alt666
#147 - 2011-09-07 20:25:04 UTC
I thought this thread would have been put to bed by now:
The CSM represent the people who voted for them. They are representing them well. If they are not representing you, put the time and energy into promoting/helping the candidates who you feel will represent you.

If the candidate who represents your views makes the CSM you will have a mandate to express views on their representation.
If the candidate who represents your views fails to make the CSM accept that you are a lone voice bemoaning a system and that no one cares.
Tethys Atreides
The Audacity of Huge
#148 - 2011-09-07 20:29:26 UTC
White Tree wrote:
Tethys Atreides wrote:

This is the first substantive post I've seen from one of you guys in a long time.

Thank you.



We're all like this. If people ask us genuine questions and come to us with genuine concerns then we're only too happy to help you. Seriously.


There is a perception, which is reinforced by threads like this (and your replys), that the CSM is at odds with the player base. It becomes a game of one upsmanship. Unfortunately, by participating you (the CSM) lose. You are supposed to be above the slings and arrows. The perception becomes the reality, and the shitstorm never ends.

You will all be seeing an email in your boxes from me in the next few days (after I put some polish on the issues that concern me most).
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#149 - 2011-09-07 20:30:07 UTC
Two step wrote:


You started playing less than 6 months ago and you are already this bitter? Wow.


Yeah you CSM guys have had a hell of an impression
Im guessing youd rather I came into game an kept my head down so I wouldnt know what you guys are planning rather than joining the forums and getting informed?

glad to dissapoint you.

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Jita Alt666
#150 - 2011-09-07 20:33:12 UTC
Richard Hammond II wrote:
Two step wrote:


You started playing less than 6 months ago and you are already this bitter? Wow.


Yeah you CSM guys have had a hell of an impression
Im guessing youd rather I came into game an kept my head down so I wouldnt know what you guys are planning rather than joining the forums and getting informed?

glad to dissapoint you.



The Eve Online forums are the worst place to get informed on how the Eve Universe works. The General Discussion threads are the worst place on the Eve Online forums to garner information. If you haven't figured this out over a 6 month period....
The Mittani
State War Academy
Caldari State
#151 - 2011-09-07 20:34:53 UTC
We rarely make serious replies to troll threads; most of us have quite solid bases of support, which means that we're under no obligation to come to random droolers with our hats in hand. However, it's a new forum, so some actual concerned players might be reading this.

If you want to influence your CSM, send them evemail. These forums are only used by a tiny minority of the playerbase, though I suspect they'll improve now that they have the new forum software. Most of us hang out and are far more active on third party forums like Failheap or Kugu.

If you think that the CSM ~will never represent you~, vote or organize to vote in the next go round. That's literally your only recourse. That said, Wormholes have an obvious representative in Two Step, Lowsec is represented by Meissa, and Trebor looks out for hisec. Elise Randolph represents non-sov PvPers. White Tree is mostly a 'Gallente' candidate. There's a fair amount of diversity, even though the CSM is undeniably dominated by nullsec.

~hi~
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#152 - 2011-09-07 20:35:14 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
I trolled the **** out of people in this thread because they obviously only posted to try and troll us.



its funny how little moderation this thread is getting. Wonder why

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Vin Hellsing
#153 - 2011-09-07 20:37:05 UTC
The Mittani wrote:
We rarely make serious replies to troll threads; most of us have quite solid bases of support, which means that we're under no obligation to come to random droolers with our hats in hand. However, it's a new forum, so some actual concerned players might be reading this.

If you want to influence your CSM, send them evemail. These forums are only used by a tiny minority of the playerbase, though I suspect they'll improve now that they have the new forum software. Most of us hang out and are far more active on third party forums like Failheap or Kugu.

If you think that the CSM ~will never represent you~, vote or organize to vote in the next go round. That's literally your only recourse. That said, Wormholes have an obvious representative in Two Step, Lowsec is represented by Meissa, and Trebor looks out for hisec. Elise Randolph represents non-sov PvPers. White Tree is mostly a 'Gallente' candidate. There's a fair amount of diversity, even though the CSM is undeniably dominated by nullsec.



Oh now he speaks logic. :)

Stil think Nullsec should have a minority stake in the CSM though. :p
Jita Alt666
#154 - 2011-09-07 20:40:42 UTC
Vin Hellsing wrote:


Stil think Nullsec should have a minority stake in the CSM though. :p


Well put your hand up and start the campaign then. The vast majority of voters in the 2010 elections disagreed with you. I hope that you will actually be standing for something rather than simply standing to stand against something.

Although that worked for George W Bush Junior - "I am not Al Gore"
Tethys Atreides
The Audacity of Huge
#155 - 2011-09-07 20:42:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Tethys Atreides
The Mittani wrote:
If you think that the CSM ~will never represent you~, vote or organize to vote in the next go round. That's literally your only recourse. That said, Wormholes have an obvious representative in Two Step, Lowsec is represented by Meissa, and Trebor looks out for hisec. Elise Randolph represents non-sov PvPers. White Tree is mostly a 'Gallente' candidate. There's a fair amount of diversity, even though the CSM is undeniably dominated by nullsec.



Fair enough. However, I would expect, since you are privey to information we are not, you all to improve the game at large, even at the expense of your "constituents", rather than mindlessly following the party line. I'd like to think that I am voting for a thinking person rather than a static platform.
Vin Hellsing
#156 - 2011-09-07 20:42:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Vin Hellsing
Jita Alt666 wrote:
Vin Hellsing wrote:


Stil think Nullsec should have a minority stake in the CSM though. :p


Well put your hand up and start the campaign then. The vast majority of voters in the 2010 elections disagreed with you. I hope that you will actually be standing for something rather than simply standing to stand against something.

Although that worked for George W Bush Junior - "I am not Al Gore"



One thing I would stand for is proper representation of all issues associated with EVE gameplay without any skewing towards any given issue. What I'd like to see is a much more dynamic nullsec "ecosystem" where there are smaller alliances jockeying for control of a sector, rather than multiple regions. I don't like it when mega alliances get TOO comfortable in their home systems... :)

The local chat removal for nullsec will help make this happen, I think.

P.S. In case you haven't noticed, I am a devil's advocate.
Denidil
Cascades Mountain Operatives
#157 - 2011-09-07 20:45:22 UTC
hmm.. i might run for CSM on the platform of "I'm the professional tester candidate, and i'm here to rip CCP a new one [politely] for lax QA policies"

Tedium and difficulty are not the same thing, if you don't realize this then STFU about game design.
The Mittani
State War Academy
Caldari State
#158 - 2011-09-07 20:48:13 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Zymurgist
Tethys Atreides wrote:
The Mittani wrote:
If you think that the CSM ~will never represent you~, vote or organize to vote in the next go round. That's literally your only recourse. That said, Wormholes have an obvious representative in Two Step, Lowsec is represented by Meissa, and Trebor looks out for hisec. Elise Randolph represents non-sov PvPers. White Tree is mostly a 'Gallente' candidate. There's a fair amount of diversity, even though the CSM is undeniably dominated by nullsec.



Fair enough. However, I would expect, since you are privey to information we are not, you all to improve the game at large, even at the expense of your "constituents", rather than mindlessly following the party line. I'd like to think that I am voting for a thinking person rather than a static platform.


You're welcome to buy into HURRR GOONS WANT TO DESTROY EVE conspiracy theories.

But in reality there's no such thing as a static platform on the CSM; our consensuses have developed naturally because what's wrong with EVE is frankly not that difficult to agree about.

Trolling removed. Zymurgist

~hi~
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#159 - 2011-09-07 20:48:27 UTC
Tethys Atreides wrote:
Fair enough. However, I would expect, since you are privey to information we are not, you all to improve the game at large, even at the expense of your "constituents", rather than mindlessly following the party line. I'd like to think that I am voting for a thinking person rather than a static platform.


And we all do this. EVE is a big enough world that one person cannot know every area, and this is why it is good to have folks on the CSM who know many different areas of the game. Even the "nullsec-only" candidates have experience in other areas of the game (Mittens is very proud of his level 3 mission running Caracal, for example).

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
Jita Alt666
#160 - 2011-09-07 20:49:38 UTC
Vin Hellsing wrote:
Jita Alt666 wrote:
Vin Hellsing wrote:


Stil think Nullsec should have a minority stake in the CSM though. :p


Well put your hand up and start the campaign then. The vast majority of voters in the 2010 elections disagreed with you. I hope that you will actually be standing for something rather than simply standing to stand against something.

Although that worked for George W Bush Junior - "I am not Al Gore"



One thing I would stand for is proper representation of all issues associated with EVE gameplay without any skewing towards any given issue. What I'd like to see is a much more dynamic nullsec "ecosystem" where there are smaller alliances jockeying for control of a sector, rather than multiple regions. I don't like it when mega alliances get TOO comfortable in their home systems... :)

The local chat removal for nullsec will help make this happen, I think.

P.S. In case you haven't noticed, I am a devil's advocate.


Ahh. A Contrarian. The people who it is easiest to ignore in a rational discussion.