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A little scalability issue for Jita
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#21 - 2013-01-20 20:58:30 UTC
Grey Azorria wrote:
Or CCP can just perma 10% TiDi the place and be done with it.

I support this. Shocked

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#22 - 2013-01-20 21:00:03 UTC
I hope they can increase the cap as well, but not for the sake of jita. I'd just like to see a system be capable of holding 4000 players.

I personally want to see more trade hubs open up instead of see jita just keep getting bigger.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#23 - 2013-01-20 21:15:51 UTC
Natsett Amuinn wrote:
I hope they can increase the cap as well, but not for the sake of jita. I'd just like to see a system be capable of holding 4000 players.

I personally want to see more trade hubs open up instead of see jita just keep getting bigger.


That's due to a simplified simulation that does not take into account "diminishing returns" (I know, many are against this and flame me but still...). I.e. doing everything in Jita only got the relatively minor issue of paying a lot for an office, a feature not really needed by most. If taxes started to rise or people started having to pay to enter Jita after say 2000 are already in, then there'd be some more drive to sell stuff at Dodixie and the other hubs instead of just bringing everything to the One Hub.

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Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#24 - 2013-01-20 21:43:56 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
INo, I can't bring the stuff nearby, nobody is going to buy megatons of materials off Jita.


This is extremely true. Whenever I buy or sell stuff, in Jita's region, I literally do not spend a single nanosecond looking at the prices in the other systems in the same region. I filter them out.

And I'm sure most other traders do the same. Off-Jita trade, near Jita, really only makes sense in terms of pre-agreed deals, where seller and buyer know each other, and know each other's needs pretty well. And since we're all greedy capitalistic bastards, such negotiated deals are very difficult.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#25 - 2013-01-20 21:46:56 UTC
Athena Themis wrote:
Never, ever log out of jita during peak hours. You won't get back in.


That used to be true, until maybe a year or two ago. But nowadays, I routinely log out while docked in Jita 4-4, and I have never had any problems logging back in again. Not for the last 12 months anyway.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#26 - 2013-01-20 21:57:06 UTC
As VV hinted, tools that CCP already has at their disposal to put pressure on the "most favoured trading location" status of Jita could include raising broker fees and sales taxes for stations that receive "too much" traffic.

One idea that I'd like to see CCP explore is limitations on the volume of junk that can accumulate inside stations, limitations on the number/tonnage of ships that can jump through a gate per hour, limitations on the number of docking bays, etc. That is, alter the mechanics of the game to discourage people making congested systems even more congested.

Jita serves fine as a technology demonstrator for TiDi and hardware capacity testing, but simply pursuing "bigger, faster" is not a worthy goal IMHO.

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flakeys
Doomheim
#27 - 2013-01-20 22:27:26 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


When I have to bring in 20-30 freighters full of stuff it gets quite old to be stuck at the gate and spam warp for minutes.

.



I needed to go there with the freighter 6 times today and all ttimes i jumped in within 10 seconds of spamming.FPS fingers have an advantage at jita VV Blink

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
flakeys
Doomheim
#28 - 2013-01-20 22:29:26 UTC
Salpad wrote:
Athena Themis wrote:
Never, ever log out of jita during peak hours. You won't get back in.


That used to be true, until maybe a year or two ago. But nowadays, I routinely log out while docked in Jita 4-4, and I have never had any problems logging back in again. Not for the last 12 months anyway.



I had it every time i logged in one of my freighter boys in jita the last 2 weeks , so at least 10 times.

I don't mind if i get reshipped to perimeter , though it aint funny if you are reshipped there in your freighter with the stuff that needs to go in still in the jita station Roll

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#29 - 2013-01-20 23:12:14 UTC
flakeys wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


When I have to bring in 20-30 freighters full of stuff it gets quite old to be stuck at the gate and spam warp for minutes.

.



I needed to go there with the freighter 6 times today and all ttimes i jumped in within 10 seconds of spamming.FPS fingers have an advantage at jita VV Blink


Today I had an additional constraint, because the freighter that did the runs was not alone but in a fleet (guess why)

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Captain Tardbar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#30 - 2013-01-22 20:05:50 UTC
Hrm... Jita is full. Maybe they need to either raise the numbers of people who can get in or kick out the people who are bots.

Seriously, do you think those people copy and paste their messages 24/7?

Looking to talk on VOIP with other EVE players? Are you new and need help with EVE (welfare) or looking for advice? Looking for adversarial debate with angry people?

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Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#31 - 2013-01-22 20:38:25 UTC
So far, upgrading Jita has only lead to an increase in population there.

If you don't like going to Jita, move to a different area of space, and use a different trade hub.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#32 - 2013-01-22 23:57:07 UTC
Xindi Kraid wrote:
So far, upgrading Jita has only lead to an increase in population there.

If you don't like going to Jita, move to a different area of space, and use a different trade hub.


Reinforcing and upgrading nodes has only increased the size of PvP blobs.

Do you also tell them to move to a different area of space? Or do you tell that since EvE unique feature (besides being 1 shard) is to allow massive numbers then a solution should be found for Jita too?

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Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#33 - 2013-01-23 02:18:45 UTC
What I am saying, is to stop complaining about a problem you have a part in causing.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#34 - 2013-01-23 02:23:39 UTC
Captain Tardbar wrote:
Hrm... Jita is full. Maybe they need to either raise the numbers of people who can get in or kick out the people who are bots.

Seriously, do you think those people copy and paste their messages 24/7?


Did you know you can cycle through your previously posted messages in a channel by holding Ctrl and pressing the up and down arrows?

Last time I needed to sell a faction tower I actually sat there and did that. t's not too hard.

I even had other entertaining conversations on the side.

The Drake is a Lie
Shamus O'Reilly
Candy Cabal
#35 - 2013-01-23 05:58:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Shamus O'Reilly
I've never had an issue getting into Jita. All one needs to do is time your jump to an outbound player. when you see the gate fire hit jump. if you're the only one timing it right you get right on in ahead of others. Basically you cut the line and the line can't do anything about it Cool

Though seeing a solid 2300 in Jita for a good 4 hours daily is insane..... Oh well time to expand it into the rest of The Forge region. Maybe make The Forge a market hub in itself? Lol

"I swear there are more people complaining over "nullsecers complaining" then actual nullsec people complaining."
Yim Sei
Ontogenic Achronycal PLC
#36 - 2013-01-23 10:00:49 UTC
What if............

...they dont want to increase the cap?

I mean looking at the report on the Chinese server EVERYONE is using Jita.

Personally I think numerous trade hubs are better for the game.

Heres an Idea - why dont npc stations increase tax on items belonging to another race.

For example - In Jita the sale of a minmatar, gallente or amarr ship has an increased tax bracket.
This could even be extended to ship manufacturing corporations

Wouldnt this spread the wealth through the other major trade hubs and ultimately end in a more active economy and release load on the Jita node?

Sure people will whine about it, but mainly because everyone wants easy mode.

Post with my main? This is my main - I just overtrain and overplay my alts.
Samroski
Middle-Earth
#37 - 2013-01-23 13:59:43 UTC
I like the idea of correlating jita local numbers with subs and players online, to get an idea of where we are heading. May gather some data and do it, though it would be nice to have some official numbers. With a cap on the numbers atm, getting accurate data is next to impossible anyway.

It is a pity that the QEN has stopped coming out. The last couple of issues had enough information to do the analysis, but already too old to be of much value.

Looking at the way Jita has progressed as a hub, and seeing how the local numbers there have increased in recent years, it is futile to think of alternative ways to sort the issue. Jita will continue to grow, and probably exponentially. CCP need to increase the ability to handle numbers much larger than 4000.

Maybe this is why CCP hasn't come up with decent expansions in recent years. Had the subs continued to grow as they had been, Jita would be a real mess. Note the wonderful linear relationship in the image linked.

Any colour you like.
Zol Interbottom
Blimp Requisition Services
#38 - 2013-01-23 14:07:09 UTC
Diesel47 wrote:
I can get into jita during peak hours with no problems what so ever.

If you want I can teach you... for a fee.


Confirming I Aldo know a way in

"If you're quitting for the 3rd time you clearly ain't quitting" - Chribba
Zaknussem
Everybody Loves Donuts
#39 - 2013-01-23 15:06:58 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
When I have to bring in 20-30 freighters full of stuff it gets quite old to be stuck at the gate and spam warp for minutes.

Any idea?


Err... don't go to Jita during peak hours? Go there at a another time?
Xenuria
#40 - 2013-01-23 18:26:37 UTC
This IS a serious problem and one of the many caveats to the whole "one persistent world" "single shard" selling point of eve online.

The technology has to exist, and if it does not then freaking build it. Jita of all places should never have a cap in the first place, it's a trade hub. Eve is supposed to be a sandbox, not several different sandboxes with lines to get in.

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