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EVE Online: Retribution 1.0 Feedback

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Syri Taneka
NOVA-CAINE
#961 - 2012-12-07 02:45:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Syri Taneka
At this point and time, there are only 2 major beefs I have with this expansion: removal of divisions from corp hangars on carriers/orcas/etc, and the new targeting reticules.

Since I haven't played with sound in literally years, the new sound issues don't effect me at all.

I also haven't used heavy missiles much in a while, either. Mostly HAMs (Sacrilege/Drake) or Rapid Lights (just about everything else). Oh, and Torps for bombers. Yay torp DPS going up a little!

The new dessies look shiny, as do the rekits of the cruisers. I'm actually a tad disappointed with the effectiveness of the t1 logi cruisers; I hope the t2's are going to get a buff at some point to justify their existence as something other than less-squishy than the t1 variants (seeing as both my chars are level 5 logi pilots).

The sensor strength skills make sense, in that, "where have these things been since I started playing?" sort of way.

Haven't tried out the salvaging drone yet, doesn't really make sense for the way I rat, but it looks cool at least.

The corp hangars... well... I have two issues with this, though they chain off each other. 1) I like to sort my stuff. I like to have my things, and fleet loot, and personal loot, etc. in different places. While you can still do this with the new can system, the cans also result in, 2) Static sized compartments. If I designate a can in my fleet hangar as being for My-Stuff-that-isn't-loot, and I put only 50m^3 of stuff in it, I'm now wasting 950m^3 of my fleet hangar. I now have only 9km^3 left for other stuff, which may or may not include another can which may or may not be kept full and thus used optimally. See what I'm getting at?

Solution: Do away with these new freight cans and implement a Folder system for the fleet hangar. Allow each ship pilot to name their divisions, and control how many there are. These divisions would also maintain the flexible sizing the old system did. For security, a simple toggle or two on each folder allowing or not allowing access by corp/fleet/anyone except the pilot would be enough, though you could of course go as deep as allowing access by character name. (I have similar security concerns with the ship hangar; since I use my carrier as a mobile hangar and ship bay, I often have stuff in it I'd rather not allow everyone in my corp or fleet to access, but do want to allow my other char to access... there is no way to do this with the current system (ETA: without changing the settings every time you fleet up with other people).)

Targeting... so, I turned off all the fancy new UI overlay bits, but there's still that obnoxiously large circle. Issues with that are as follows: Way too faint around ships that are locked but not selected. I often can't tell whether or not something actually is locked until I click on it and see that big circle light up. Umm, also, as opposed to today's patch, reticule flickering on locked targets is NOT fixed. I don't have a video taking program and of course you can't see flicker on a screenshot, so I can't show you, but I got it happening twice today. In both cases, the target was a frigate, and the ship doing the targeting was a Thanatos. Fighters were on the field, and I did have two clients on. Full gfx options, GFX card utilization under 50%. Another annoying bit similar to that - the triple blink when targets that have been locking finish? EXTREMELY annoying and actually somewhat disorienting. Please make that stop. (ETA: Within a day or two of this post, the blinking targets bug became fixed. Don't know if it was a stealth fix or an issue with my cache not updating properly and causing glitchiness.)
Oraac Ensor
#962 - 2012-12-07 02:45:58 UTC
Ehdward Spengler wrote:
Or you could just use Foobar, Winamp, WMP, iTunes, Spotify, Rdio, VLC, Songbird, Media Monkey, etc.

But not if you like to have login mu . . . oh, wtf, it's been said too many times already.
Coyotefugly
Tachyon Limited
#963 - 2012-12-07 03:01:11 UTC
Never thought id be one of those guys because EvE is one of those sweetass games, but im considering just not logging in except to change my skills the next 2 days or so. Eve is unplayable at the moment for me, some bits of freezing on my client make pvp not a good option and mission running in lowsec is kind of ridiculous with the amount of drone hate pumping out. The ui and wtfsafetyswitch? give me heartache as well. We'll see what kind of repairs CCP does i guess and go from there.
Kurai Okala
Okala Corp
#964 - 2012-12-07 03:02:18 UTC
It seems to me that the NPC AI changes (or at least their aggression towards drones) should have been implemented at the same time as a complete mission revamp (fewer more powerful enemies) and/or a substantial revamp to drones in general.

As they are now, drones are a terrible choice for a primary weapon system for PVE due to their high cost, limited capacity for reserves and new-found vulnerability which severely limits their range and ability to inflict damage.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#965 - 2012-12-07 03:10:31 UTC
Riazal wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:


As someone that makes just over a billion isk within a 48 hour period, frequently, I can assure you that there are still ways to make money. Just because it isn't "easy" doesn't mean you can't find a way to make it easier. Besides, EVE was never meant to be easy.


why do i feel like your one of the jita scammers.....


I reside in Halle and have never scammed anyone. I'd say your feelings are a bit paranoid.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#966 - 2012-12-07 03:14:11 UTC
Having a lot of fun with the camera tracking. I'm sure the pilot vid producers will get a lot of mileage out of it.

Friend is telling me that after he had a bounty placed on him his whole session has started lagging. He couldn't describe it exactly, but key response seemed to slow down and fps dropped. He swears he was fine up until the bounty hit, then it was like a switch. All of this in one login session.
Oraac Ensor
#967 - 2012-12-07 03:24:29 UTC
Yonis Kador wrote:
There has to be a way to have bounties still present a tempting-enough target to others, while also being a negative development for bountied players.

In RL, folks only get 'Wanted' stamped across their picture if they commit an offence.

Why not the same in EVE?

The injured party should be able to place a bounty on the offender within the period of whatever timer comes into effect when the offence is committed.

No offence - no bounty. That would stop all the stupid nonsense that's happening at the moment.
Salnarin
Auron Systems
#968 - 2012-12-07 03:45:27 UTC
Thanks for ruining my mining Osprey. With the replacement of 2 of the turret slots with missile slots, I can no longer use it as a secondary miner while waiting for my friend's hulk to harvest enough ore for me to switch back to a hauler.

And your replacement mining frigate can only hold 2 turrets, which makes it far less optimal (not to mention you didnt exactly give me a free one to replace my Osprey, which means I have to spend more money to get back to less than what I had before this new "upgrade").
Joelleaveek
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#969 - 2012-12-07 03:55:44 UTC
Salnarin wrote:
Thanks for ruining my mining Osprey. With the replacement of 2 of the turret slots with missile slots, I can no longer use it as a secondary miner while waiting for my friend's hulk to harvest enough ore for me to switch back to a hauler.

And your replacement mining frigate can only hold 2 turrets, which makes it far less optimal (not to mention you didnt exactly give me a free one to replace my Osprey, which means I have to spend more money to get back to less than what I had before this new "upgrade").


It has a 100% yield bonus and a per level bonus and holds way more ore then your osprey every would have. They have also never given free ships in this manner for any reason so why would they start now? (you can get one free in the tutorials btw)
Joelleaveek
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#970 - 2012-12-07 03:56:20 UTC
I feel like there should be a "next page" button in the bounty office window.
BigSticky Nuggets
Caldari State
#971 - 2012-12-07 04:11:16 UTC
Is it intended that players now get FULL room aggro in missions?

For example:

The mission is The Assault Level 4 (Angel Cartel version)
Upon warping into the first room, you see 1 group of ships 4 more warp in a different distances.

Normally: Group 1 will auto aggro you. Group 2&3 do not aggro until attacked, same with group 4&5. Allowing you to grab aggro of smaller groups.

Post Patch: Upon warping in you see 1 group, 4 more warp in and every single ship in the room with no provocation or moving decides to aggro you.

Is this going to be fixed or should I start selling off my mission ships?
Farlig Ekorre
United Mining and Hauling Inc
The Initiative.
#972 - 2012-12-07 04:44:41 UTC
Got two loggies and a marauder popped today in nullsec plexes, not to mention countless drones. I've lived in wormholes and am familiar with the sleeper AI... but the AI seems to be reacting way quicker. Of course in nullsec you cannot dock and repair eadily which compounds the frustrations. Doing the same 7, 8, 9 and 10/10s I was last weekend for no greater reward, far more peril and vastly slower doesn't add up.

I'll just turtle in pos until enough people complain. It's not unlike asking labor to put in more hours at harder tasks for the same pay; whilst Plutocrats who dont have to rat for isk (large null blocks sustained off rent and moon goo) are unaffected. It feels like a deeply regressive tax.
Tekoa Attai
CFOA Strategic Deadspace Operations Division
#973 - 2012-12-07 04:52:03 UTC
I agree with Spc One. I used to be able to do lvl4 missions and loose at most one drone.The last one I did ( not even Extravaganza) i lost 10!! Same with getting perma jammed - without drones 'ur done. Thx CCP for the "FIX" Evil
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#974 - 2012-12-07 05:27:14 UTC
Oraac Ensor wrote:

But not if you like to have login mu . . . oh, wtf, it's been said too many times already.



Unfortunately there are those of us like myself who, if we try to run EvE and another audio program, they do not play nice at all. Basically my choices now boil down to play in silence or be driven nuts by the same music repeating over and over.
Salnarin
Auron Systems
#975 - 2012-12-07 05:27:15 UTC
Joelleaveek wrote:
Salnarin wrote:
Thanks for ruining my mining Osprey. With the replacement of 2 of the turret slots with missile slots, I can no longer use it as a secondary miner while waiting for my friend's hulk to harvest enough ore for me to switch back to a hauler.

And your replacement mining frigate can only hold 2 turrets, which makes it far less optimal (not to mention you didnt exactly give me a free one to replace my Osprey, which means I have to spend more money to get back to less than what I had before this new "upgrade").


It has a 100% yield bonus and a per level bonus and holds way more ore then your osprey every would have. They have also never given free ships in this manner for any reason so why would they start now? (you can get one free in the tutorials btw)


Yeah, you're probably right. I havent even looked closely at the Venture. I just tried to launch my Osprey, and noticed the error messages stating that the extra 2 mining lasers were offline, and had to be removed, and came here to vent. Thanks for the info.
Sin Koraka
Doomheim
#976 - 2012-12-07 05:28:14 UTC
Think ill just stay logged out until something gets done with the drone issue. It is kind of crucial to my bread and butter activity in eve along with exploration. See people losing ships and stuff from other posts and dont want to lose mine. Had a close call an hour ago i dont want to repeat. I'd also love to try out the new mining frigate at some point, but having some weird buggyness with loading grid and client freezing.
Elaine' du'pont
Doomheim
#977 - 2012-12-07 05:58:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Elaine' du'pont
Leonardo Rocha wrote:
CCP Killed the mission runners.


1 ) the UI is really bad for combat. Its difficult to see the bars. And they are really small.
2 ) The Drones got aggro and dies really fast.
3 ) We got FULL aggro everytime
4 ) scram switches within the frigs group. If you kill a scram firg, another starts scramming. This is nasty!
5 ) The overall difficult were increased. The bounties no longer compensate the time/effort to play a mission.

I am very disaponted with the patch.




1. ugly thing, take it off or make it small and transparent at a point we cannot see it anymore :P
2. including salv drones...drone skills become absolete
3/4/5 im not the only one who feel's screwed in this bussiness, more dificult means more reward..no?!



( ps: take all the frekin loot and give us more bounty)

(The ideea is to gives us a good gameplay experience and a good time not chassing all over the place carrying crap bag)
unreasonable reason
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#978 - 2012-12-07 06:25:33 UTC
overall the expansion is mostly good, the new destroyers are nice, ship balancing is a great job and there's actually a use for what was tier 1 and 2 frigs and cruisers now and the changed rats AI makes it a bit more challenging for missions which is alright for most missions. However there's a few things that CCP either seems to have overlooked or just not thought out well enough:

bounties can now be placed on everyone for whatever or no reasons. this can lead to some griefing especially new players who would not know much of how the game works and get scared of a bounty on their head. A minimum age limit of say 30 days old character to be able to have a bounty placed on them provided that they don't have a negative sec status would give the newbs some buffer.

Second is the effect of new rats AI on some missions that were designed to be a bit of a challenge before that now makes them extremely difficult to solo, one example is The Assault, Serpentis. the rats now damps from over 100km away with tons of frigs that you cannot use drones at all and alot of damage incoming, so it's near impossible to lock anything without flying within 5km of it while being held down by loads of webbing and scrambling frigs and eating a storm of rails from the BS rats that likes to shoot from 45km away. the usual method of dealing with them was let out the drones and get them to take out the frigs and then focus down some of the damping elite cruisers and break a window in their damps enough to use guns (or keep using drones for drone boats). now the option to break them is very limited, maybe fof missiles? some missions such as this really need to be looked at so its difficulty won't be out of line with the other missions of same pay.

third is the sound. BLEEP, BREEP BREEP BREEP... it's driving me insane every time a rat locks me/ starts shooting that make a change to that stupid npc aggression timer count down. and after 5 minutes the thing beeps for each second of the last 10 sec of the countdown. and i can't turn it off without muting alot of other stuff as well. why do we need aggression timer for mission npc anyway? we never had it before and was fine without it.

salvage drones is not responding to shortcut key command to engage target, it's annoying to have to right click on them every time, their flight speed could use a bit of boost too.


given the buff alot of cruisers and frigs got, i hope faction cruisers and t2 ships will get a little love soon to maintain the gap between their costs and skill requirements over the t1 ships. navy exequror and deimost are 2 that's in need of attention for a long time now
Haifisch Zahne
Hraka Manufacture GmbH
#979 - 2012-12-07 06:42:05 UTC
Your posts have been dismissed by all who read. I will make no exception to the rule.


Remiel Pollard wrote:
Haifisch Zahne wrote:
I want to just take a step back on this new drone aggression. And, let's just listen to what CCP has told us.

*All* drones now use SLEEPER AI.

What?!!! Even L2/L3 (!!!) mission drones now have SLEEPER AI. (I haven't tried L1 missions.) Hell, I have 8.8M SP in drones, and I lose my drones left and right now in L2/L3 missions. (No chance in hell I'll fly an L4 mission now.) I fly drone boats regularly, and I can't manage them anymore.

And, a new player is suppose to deal with SLEEPER AI.

There is something obviously, seriously, medically wrong with you people.


That's not what they said at all. Does anyone bother to read the dev blogs before posting?
Haifisch Zahne
Hraka Manufacture GmbH
#980 - 2012-12-07 06:49:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Haifisch Zahne
Well, if you don't mind the prospect of losing all your frigate killing drones and getting warp scrammed/disrupted, be my guest. Or losing more than you make? Fine. Go for it.

Myself, I thought paying for a subscription to play was enough to *play*.



Thomas Shaefer wrote:
Haifisch Zahne wrote:
Well, I can't play now. Period. How long I have to wait... my subscription runs out Soon (tm). See?

And, I wouldn't so "fully expect" anything from CCP when it means increased losses of assets, with decreases in income. CCP is on a major roll to sell PLEX. We upset them with Incarna, when they couldn't sell us boots and girdles, so now we get this.



Thomas Shaefer wrote:
Haifisch Zahne wrote:
YES, YES, YES, YES, YES and quite a few more YESes.

This is 100% real Rational Thought. (CCP needs to hire some of this.)


Alice Katsuko wrote:
To be honest, I don't see why drones should draw aggro, since they're nowadays used as primary weapons, not as backup. A drone boat relies on heavy/sentry drones for most of its dps; a non-drone ship uses light and medium drones to attack frigates and cruisers that its main guns cannot hit. Having drones draw aggro is akin to allowing NPCs to take out turrets and missile launchers. It doesn't make much sense from a game balance perspective.

To solve the issue of AFK drone and carrier pilots using drones, simply have all newly-spawned NPCs auto-aggro deployed drones. But after spawning, the NPCs shouldn't target drones at all. That will force drone users to pay attention, or watch their drones get instantly exploded. But it won't penalize drone boat users.




I fully expect CCP to change drone mechanics in some way shape or form. If I remember correctly drones in general are a known issue in EVE. Give it a bit of time I say.



I don't intend to keep on about this but what stops you from playing? Your inability to adjust? I mission in a dominix, I understand issues like this, but that doesn't stop me from playing.