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Crime & Punishment

 
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Crimewatch is Rubbish
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Karrl Tian
Doomheim
#121 - 2012-12-02 05:17:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Karrl Tian
Blackcamper wrote:
I think it is going to be a good thing.

I live in low sec and are looking foreword to more players in low sec .

And i like that gankers in hi sec now have a harder time can flipping, but as always there epic tears on the forum at they mite have to think and adapt to some new game tactics.



Yeah... the highsec pvpers are coming down to lowsec en masse to play the "Who has more ships?" game. And all those FW alts are not going to disappear when that isk faucet is plugged, either.
Aurelius Valentius
Valentius Corporation
Valentius Corporation Alliance
#122 - 2012-12-02 19:42:07 UTC
Sir Marksalot wrote:
Aurelius Valentius wrote:
I felt a great disturbance in the Whhhhaaaa... as though millions of griefers where crying out and then where suddenly podded...


I personally find it awesome with the new bounty system as well.

1. I can put a bounty on anyone [or everyone in local and corp and every other channel I can get my mitts on] and dump 100,000K for the fun of postering "WANTED" on all of EVE. and then I get love notes they got blown up, that is so WORTH 100K ISKies.

2. I am however dissappointed in that I can't still [while in my mack] mining away and some ret comes in and starts to mine my rocks, unload 5 Hob IIs or Hammer IIs [def would get hammers for this if I could do it] and blow his face off for messing with my rocks... and on-site engage any Catalyst or whatever... hell get rid of sec all around make it a FREE-FIRE ZONE!!!... I like it... bloody pooftahs!!!

... ahem...

3. I like this, heck... bait rets anyone? i can see this being so much fun I can't stand it... oh oh... OMG.. YES!!!.. ahem... I might need a cig and a change of robe... was it good for you too?

and now for more griefer tears, and a ganker with three-buttocks.


EDIT.. Oh and:

to OP - U mad Bro?


Jesus Christ you're incoherent. This update has dumb things in it, but it's not going to end my ability to shoot your ****** untanked mackinaw. (seriously, why do you mine ice? It's terrible income)


.. I tank my Mack, and I don't mine ICE... what? you stupid broh-man-dude? *puts on his helmet and drools*... derp derp derp...
Sephiroth Clone VII
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#123 - 2012-12-02 20:13:08 UTC
If you blow someone up in highsec you have to have a alt loot the wreck anyway in a different ship because gankers get concored regardless.

Having a criminal flag for stealing is a non-issue and logical. Don't be a thief if you don't like consequences, You expect to be a criminal in highsec and be safe from crime yourself in not being shot for stealing wreak, or having other theives steal from 'your' loot with equally legitamate claims in eye on concord.
Rolstra
Moo's Mudpit
#124 - 2012-12-02 23:42:51 UTC
The truly sad state of affairs when the criminal element gives up cause doing crime is 'too hard' whine whine whine.

Jesus wept so you use your Zero Tanked cheap ass machine to gank your intended target, Alt B creates a can and flips the loot into it getting popped by local alt B local alt B scoops loot and warp off having fulfilled his role as protector of high sec.

Jees you really should stay in school. your too dumb for crime.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#125 - 2012-12-03 00:05:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Surfin's PlunderBunny
Rolstra wrote:
The truly sad state of affairs when the criminal element gives up cause doing crime is 'too hard' whine whine whine.

Jesus wept so you use your Zero Tanked cheap ass machine to gank your intended target, Alt B creates a can and flips the loot into it getting popped by local alt B local alt B scoops loot and warp off having fulfilled his role as protector of high sec.

Jees you really should stay in school. your too dumb for crime.


Most criminals aren't too smart though... I had someone break into my Kia Rio (the manliest car ever made) I was driving around 4 years ago to steal a $50 GPS that looked like a little CRT monitor all while leaving a $2000 laptop that was on the backseat and $10,000 worth of scuba equipment that was in the trunk (or boot to you british weirdos).

There was no alarm on the car, also he made off with some burned CDs of gothic industrial music that no one's ever heard of Ugh

That's right, he passed up on $12,000 worth of crap for a $50 thing that was so out of date by the time he took it he'd be lucky to get $5 for it.

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny
Rolstra
Moo's Mudpit
#126 - 2012-12-03 00:18:44 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Rolstra wrote:
The truly sad state of affairs when the criminal element gives up cause doing crime is 'too hard' whine whine whine.

Jesus wept so you use your Zero Tanked cheap ass machine to gank your intended target, Alt B creates a can and flips the loot into it getting popped by local alt B local alt B scoops loot and warp off having fulfilled his role as protector of high sec.

Jees you really should stay in school. your too dumb for crime.


Most criminals aren't too smart though... I had someone break into my Kia Rio (the manliest car ever made) I was driving around 4 years ago to steal a $50 GPS that looked like a little CRT monitor all while leaving a $2000 laptop that was on the backseat and $10,000 worth of scuba equipment that was in the trunk (or boot to you british weirdos).

There was no alarm on the car, also he made off with some burned CDs of gothic industrial music that no one's ever heard of Ugh

That's right, he passed up on $12,000 worth of crap for a $50 thing that was so out of date by the time he took it he'd be lucky to get $5 for it.


Wow some days you can be amazed. Similar incident for me was the Radar detector off the dash, broke the window on an unlocked car to steal it.
I just figure anyone with the wherewithal to boot a PC handle the updates and other complexities required for playing this specific game that they would probably find the simplest workaround for a little aggression virus. Probably should add that Ganking as a profession seems rather prosaic. But hey if that's what floats their boat, it is possible that all they can imagine.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#127 - 2012-12-03 00:20:16 UTC
"Crime" in highsec where suicide ganking isn't involved isn't a profit driven enterprise, in fact it's generally a at best a zero-sum game. You don't do it to make money you do it because you find it enjoyable. If changes to game mechanics make it so that people can't do crime in a way that they derive enjoyment from then they're going to stop doing it.

It's not like crimewatch exactly opens up a whole bunch of new opportunities to criminals, just more severe punishment for existing ones.
loyalanon
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#128 - 2012-12-03 01:02:18 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
"Crime" in highsec where suicide ganking isn't involved isn't a profit driven enterprise, in fact it's generally a at best a zero-sum game. You don't do it to make money you do it because you find it enjoyable. If changes to game mechanics make it so that people can't do crime in a way that they derive enjoyment from then they're going to stop doing it.

It's not like crimewatch exactly opens up a whole bunch of new opportunities to criminals, just more severe punishment for existing ones.


Freighter killmails beg to differ that it isnt profitable.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#129 - 2012-12-03 01:16:06 UTC
loyalanon wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
"Crime" in highsec where suicide ganking isn't involved isn't a profit driven enterprise, in fact it's generally a at best a zero-sum game. You don't do it to make money you do it because you find it enjoyable. If changes to game mechanics make it so that people can't do crime in a way that they derive enjoyment from then they're going to stop doing it.

It's not like crimewatch exactly opens up a whole bunch of new opportunities to criminals, just more severe punishment for existing ones.


Freighter killmails beg to differ that it isnt profitable.


Usually if 2 miners dropped from a hulk a miner gank made profit P

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny
loyalanon
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#130 - 2012-12-03 01:23:44 UTC
Usually if 2 miners dropped from a hulk a miner gank made profit P[/quote]

Exactly
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#131 - 2012-12-03 01:36:28 UTC
loyalanon wrote:
Freighter killmails beg to differ that it isnt profitable.

Did you even read my post?
loyalanon
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#132 - 2012-12-03 01:40:18 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
loyalanon wrote:
Freighter killmails beg to differ that it isnt profitable.

Did you even read my post?


qq more noob
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#133 - 2012-12-03 02:52:00 UTC
What a compelling argument.
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#134 - 2012-12-03 04:04:36 UTC
Vims, don't bother. Give it up. The west is no longer wild. We have to go find a game that *does* value emergent, cutthroat game play.

CCP got what they wanted out of us. They got some good stories to tell prospective customers. We're not wanted here anymore.

Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity
Capt Starfox
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#135 - 2012-12-03 06:05:07 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
It's not like crimewatch exactly opens up a whole bunch of new opportunities to criminals, just more severe punishment for existing ones.



This actually is true, just have to be more careful... as the suicide ganker terrorist... . I'm not too worried about it though, gank random-minerX, warp pod back to safe spot, warp salvage alt at 0 meters (doing this while gankbear alt is entering warp is better, saves time), loot/salvage as fast as possible all while keeping an eye on overview, grid and scan, warp salvage alt back to safespot and cloak. And of course, use common sense per situation.. If there are a lot of miners in that belt with 39284621983 combat drones flying around, might want to skip that loot. Or if when you get back to loot/salvage on your salvage alt and a butt load of people in frigs-BC's are there, skip that loot too. Or be ballsy and hit your MWD and see what happens. Can still salvage though... unless that's changed?

By the way, can you still look at the loot and not become suspect?

Abandon all hope ye who x up in fleet
Aurelius Valentius
Valentius Corporation
Valentius Corporation Alliance
#136 - 2012-12-03 18:29:35 UTC
Personally I don't get the big cry-me-a-river thing over this...

Gank-Ships is dirt cheap [even now days]

Get your ISK maker, do something for a couple hours [unless you don't have an ISK maker - which wouldn't suprise me with some people that gank as they seem to be rather stupid and unable to do anything that requires something beyond basic motor-skills, but I digress...]

Make some ISK, mining, missions, taking your mother wallet and charging up a plex, whatever....

Get a pile of cheap ships, sorry for you gankers - SUPER expensive catalysts... rather like paying for a titan I know...

Then go blow them up in fun... wait, this isn't fun now... sorry, I forgot, nothing really changed, you lose the ship then, you lose the ship now... what is the difference... hence, I think it's just the fact that now you might have to do some work for you fun, or steal you mom's credit card of something... but then that has punishments also... hmmm... yep you all is screwed.
Minister Man
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#137 - 2012-12-03 18:59:17 UTC
loyalanon wrote:
So I have been reading up on the new Crimewatch updates coming out in the next expansion and so far all I can say is it looks total ****.

Picture 1

Picture 2

What is your take on it?

How can gankers profit from ganking?

lets visit the following scenario -

Player A shoots Player B and player B blows up.

Player B's wreck drops, now when you loot that wreck you are freely attackable by everyone,

CCP have given into the carebears demands and given into the demands of Miners wanting to AFK mine without fear of being ganked by buffing the EHP on all mining barges, with the upcoming crimewatch changes to be implemented this to seems as a way to give in to carebear demands.

They have now pretty much effectively given into remove all forms of unprovoked aggression in high sec.

When I first started playing eve, I played due to the nature of eve, and how you are never safe when undocked and you can partake in non-consensual pvp with other players.

Now it seems that this game while promoting piracy and doing bad deeds to people in-game, it is effectively ruined to cater to the highsec carebears demands of a safer playground for them to mine in. but yet CCP are still promoting it as a Combat Zone that anyone can be a part of.

Whats next? will low sec pvp also be outlawed because carebears cant pvp safely?

While this may seem like a rant, I would appreciate your thoughts on the above. While CCP is a business and needs to make money, they have ruined and lost sight of what makes eve a great game.



Now I only read your post and no one else's but this is what I took from it.

You are whining that you can no longer play with no risk because of some care bear complaints that they can not play with no risk?

Seems to me these alleged care bears still have the same risk, there was no further protection put in place for them.
The only change appears to me that you, the ganker killing the unarmed ship, are no longer perfectly safe. Who really is the care bear here?
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#138 - 2012-12-03 20:10:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Renier Gaden
Recipe for High Sec Solo PVP

1) Undock in a high speed manoeuvrable ship such as a Vagabond or Cynabal, or a destroyer or frigate depending on the ships in the area.

2) Steal from a can or wreck to globally flag yourself.

3) Wave a red flashy cape in front of the crowds like a matador and wait for people to aggress you.

4a) If you find you are up against something you don’t think you can handle, then run away or dock up. (Only the 1 minute PVP flag triggered by aggressing someone keeps you from docking.)

4b) If a likely target aggresses you, try to separate it from the herd and kill it. Kite it away from the rest or warp somewhere and hope just a few of them follow you.


The key is to give your marks the confidence that comes with strength in numbers, and then get them to charge after you and get out of range of the others. The other key will be skill at manual flying and knowing other ships well enough to exploit their weaknesses.


Or how about this. You have a friend in the same ship type as you and you both get yourself globally flagged. Your friend waits at the Sun. You setup a bookmark between the Sun and the Station. Then go to the station, get someone to aggress you, then burn out of point range (if pointed) and warp to your bookmark. They warp to the sun thinking that is where you went and attack your friend thinking it is you (you are both flashy and in the same ship). Then you and your friend both have Limited Engagement rights toward the guy(s). Add in some logistics pilots and you should be able to take on a good sized crowd.

[Edit: Have plenty of your friend in the T1 support coursers. Repping you will flag them. Anyone who engages them gives them the right to shoot back, so they can then warp to station (with or without their cheep T1 support cruiser intact) and come back in a combat ship. Likely anything that kills a Support Cruiser will be worth more than the cruiser was.]

There has got to be plenty of ways that a skilled pilot can find PVP under the new system. Pirate
Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#139 - 2012-12-03 20:28:53 UTC
loyalanon wrote:
So I have been reading up on the new Crimewatch updates coming out in the next expansion and so far all I can say is it looks total ****.

Picture 1

Picture 2

What is your take on it?

How can gankers profit from ganking?

lets visit the following scenario -

Player A shoots Player B and player B blows up.

Player B's wreck drops, now when you loot that wreck you are freely attackable by everyone,

CCP have given into the carebears demands and given into the demands of Miners wanting to AFK mine without fear of being ganked by buffing the EHP on all mining barges, with the upcoming crimewatch changes to be implemented this to seems as a way to give in to carebear demands.

They have now pretty much effectively given into remove all forms of unprovoked aggression in high sec.

When I first started playing eve, I played due to the nature of eve, and how you are never safe when undocked and you can partake in non-consensual pvp with other players.

Now it seems that this game while promoting piracy and doing bad deeds to people in-game, it is effectively ruined to cater to the highsec carebears demands of a safer playground for them to mine in. but yet CCP are still promoting it as a Combat Zone that anyone can be a part of.

Whats next? will low sec pvp also be outlawed because carebears cant pvp safely?

While this may seem like a rant, I would appreciate your thoughts on the above. While CCP is a business and needs to make money, they have ruined and lost sight of what makes eve a great game.

It changes nothing, on the test server I could still kill hulks and macks in nados and talos just fine. Tested this several dozen times as an outlaw. Everything is the same as it was before just has more information on what is happening. They didn't buff or nerf anything. The safety switch makes it easier to gank people more then anything. I can't say on can flipping because I haven't done it in years but they did make suicide ganking a lot more fun with no popup's getting in the way. No more fighting the UI for committing a crime.
loyalanon
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#140 - 2012-12-04 22:41:32 UTC
Aurelius Valentius wrote:
Personally I don't get the big cry-me-a-river thing over this...

Gank-Ships is dirt cheap [even now days]

Get your ISK maker, do something for a couple hours [unless you don't have an ISK maker - which wouldn't suprise me with some people that gank as they seem to be rather stupid and unable to do anything that requires something beyond basic motor-skills, but I digress...]

Make some ISK, mining, missions, taking your mother wallet and charging up a plex, whatever....

Get a pile of cheap ships, sorry for you gankers - SUPER expensive catalysts... rather like paying for a titan I know...

Then go blow them up in fun... wait, this isn't fun now... sorry, I forgot, nothing really changed, you lose the ship then, you lose the ship now... what is the difference... hence, I think it's just the fact that now you might have to do some work for you fun, or steal you mom's credit card of something... but then that has punishments also... hmmm... yep you all is screwed.


What did you lose?