EVE General Discussion

do we really have to look up all the threads made by devs and players ,to show you ,that that is already tried?

Not really. She changed what I said to something completely different in a very ad hoc way of implying her argument could be reversed and make sense.

Example, WiS is alien to EVE. FiS is not. She implied you can substitute one for the other and imply both are equal. Not so.

They don't even have equal importance in a more day to day sense. One could throw Incarna in the trash and still have a functional game tested and proven to be a viable product to sell. In the reverse if you deleted FiS and made the game only WiS, you wouldn't have a game at all. Definitely not with its current minimal depth and feature list.

The argument comes down to telling the players of EVE that they are in the wrong for wanting EVE to stay EVE and not become 50% of the game in it's mid life where a new untested & unfinished layer of WiS becomes the remaining 50%. Along with that, the development time required to even get Incarna to that equal 50% would mean the EVE playerbase is paying a sub with content relegated to upgrades and improvement to the WiS portion.

I'm sorry, but I've seen people suggest on two different occaisions that someone voicing a contrary opinion to there's was doing something "dangerous."

You do realize this a game, a forum for a game, players are posting their opinions and making suggestions which may or may not be ignored in part or in full right? Either way, I think dangerous is about as over the top as suggesting the computer you are on is going to detonate with a 100 megaton blast and destroy the city you live in because you just posted.

She really didn't change it completely. In fact, she hardly changed it at all.

WiS may be a small part of Eve, and the FiS part is more important because of sheer volume. You could get rid of the Incarna part and it wouldn't be missed much, but that's because there is no content in it. That's what we're asking for here... content.

FiS is already fleshed out. It works, and has enough content to keep the player-base who want FiS stuff happy indefinitely. And if you don't think it does then your probably playing the wrong game. If you think putting development time into something new is somehow wrong, then you could argue that we will never need any more FiS features either... Don't need anything new, right?

Also, you don't know what the players want, your are just saying that they want FiS because it suits your argument. We, the players, want WiS. And there are a lot of us who want it. I would wager a very large amount that more of us want it than wanted a FW upgrade, which a very small portion of the player-base uses.

See, the question isn't "do players want WiS?", the question is "do players want WiS more than FiS?". CCP is betting pretty firmly that the answer is "no" (hint: they're right). You simply cannot hold this conversation in a vacuum - whether CCP can fully realize WiS in any kind of acceptable form without compromising FiS has to be a prime consideration, and they've already said they cannot, so they 're not going forward as of now.

You're argument is flawed in that you are generalizing players sharing your own position with regard to an argument which clearly has 2 or more sides as represented by a small portion of the playerbase. You can't possibly argue effectively on that logic, when you are suggesting the people you are arguing with share your position with regard to the subject of the argument.

Only if they were lying, would that be possible.

On the other hand, CCP does do surveys and I'm sure this was included in them, and that some portion of the playerbase responded one way or another, so they probably have some information to base these decisions on. Of course, that can easily be outweighed by the threat of massive bad press like the Jita Statue Murder.

Whether they accept it or not, carebears need the people you call "nutjob psychopaths." That's because Eve was designed to work that way.

If a person quits over losing at Eve, I won't miss their whining anymore than they'll miss getting ganked by me.

That seems pretty quid pro quo to me.

I'll try to write clear, with replays because I do not know very well English. I am not against space exploration and space crafts, and any improvements, I just want to support those who for Incarna, as pent up, so for a long time does not change. Discussions with developers is not as complete as we would like. Quite a lot of those created on Incarna, a lot of arguments and disputes, but almost nothing specific they are not, or is, but only distant blurry replica. Flying in space are made and completed long ago, recently issued only patches. The patch is not content. But look, what arguments and discussions are about the little things in space. We discuss everything loud intrusive. But, as regards space. If Incarna not come up if an Incarna no one ever said, if it were not promised .... But it came up with its promised long done, done, done so little that even insulting. The fact that there is now a beautiful quarter, very detailed, I have it turned on at all times. But that's it! It was written that the team Avatar is working WIS, then that does not work, because we need to focus on the space flight. But why? Why is not promised, but just decided to change the current practice? But do not do what needs to be done long ago? After all the players want! Long wanted and waited. And you CCP can not even imagine how it hurts to read about that development is suspended, or allowing increased. Since I'm not good at English but tried to read all the threads, I realized how people are fighting fiercely for what she still came out in all its glory!. Yes, there are those who are screaming that they do not need it. So what then? Will be guided by them? After walking around the stations, this niche is unoccupied, this feature is for you to CCP, there is no game more beautiful than Eve, but it lacks the Incarna. I love this game, and I hope that in the near future there will be at least some sort of information about it. I often repeat, excuse me, I would want that all was clear what I mean. Incarna should be, or not to strive for.

EDIT:
The above was written, if I understand correctly - what we want? I can not answer for everyone, but I can say what I need. Now test server removed DEDcomplexes. Here it is the first possible step to start doing that for so long waiting. Of hangar I mentioned there that can do so that players began their adventures from there, well, there is a meeting in the hangars and CQ. And here is where they can interact with? In DED complexes. As the video from Fanfest. In large areas to fight the enemy, long time to go to the goal, to search and produce modules and enhancements to their ships. Here it can be the starting point of the room, which is already tired.

Agreed, we want WiS content. What exactly is your point?



That question, "do players want WiS more than FiS?", is largely irrelevant. Because we already have FiS, so it's not an "either/or" choice. We can have both. As for compromising, they are already doing that at the expensive of taking Eve in the direction of new things. Rehashing old content is fine whilst it needs it, but they can't keep doing it without everyone getting bored.

Besides, if we ran a poll asking whether players wanted to put a small team to slowly work towards WiS content, or not. Your answer would probably be yes, they probably do. Three devs working on it wont detract hugely from FiS anyway. Im not holding this debate in a vacuum. I am considering whether people want it or not, and I strongly believe they do. Check through all the WiS related threads and count the fors and againsts.

Except they managed to make a pretty cool little prototype with only two devs. I would happily leave those two on it over the course of a year to see what they could do. Would that really impact on FiS that much? I doubt it.