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Dev Blog: Fast Forward

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Weitkunat
Moira.
#201 - 2012-10-22 22:18:19 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Weitkunat wrote:
This is going to be awesome, especially after the proposed NPC changes. Faction warfare should be about (gasp!) warfare, not farming the system to hell and back for ISK.
Did I say otherwise?

Defensive much? I said your opinion of the CSM is wrong, then I went on to praise the patch.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#202 - 2012-10-22 22:19:22 UTC
Bad Messenger wrote:
War Kitten wrote:
Bad Messenger wrote:

I am not really raging anything just saying ... as we know already CCP favors always gallente/minmatar block.

You're right, conspiracy theories aren't always full of rage. But if they go un-medicated, they will develop into rage.

guess who is trying to make tier 5 lp dump today

Not me. GL fellas, see you on the other side of the fence.
Khoul Ay'd
The Affiliation
#203 - 2012-10-22 22:19:43 UTC
DexterShark wrote:
What happens if there's no real tears and everyone just shrugs and agrees this change is for the best? What then? Can we get some folks to come in and roleplay some tears?


Hire some ice miners, I hear the folks at www.minerbumping.com have been training them just for this occasion. Lol

The things we do today we must live with forever.... Think about it
Rengerel en Distel
#204 - 2012-10-22 22:19:57 UTC
There is a stunning lack of tinfoil in this thread, so i just want it to be known that the reason the duality mass test was cancelled today was so that the devs could farm plex all day instead.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#205 - 2012-10-22 22:19:59 UTC
Garr Earthbender wrote:
OK, so here's a question I have. It's based out of a lack of knowledge in the 1st place.

Is there a currently a cap on how over-contested a system can be? And if there is no cap, will there be a cap in this new system? Currently it's an effort in futility to try and decontest a vulnerable system. I think.


This patch will stop payouts when vulnerable, when Retribution comes it will also end "overplexing" and remove the ability to create a big buffer that the defender has to chew through.

Since there isn't any more market spiking and your WZC is dependent on owning systems, there's really no advantage to overplexing after this patch. The best thing a militia can do is take and hold the system, there's no advantage to letting the enemy have it.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Garr Earthbender
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#206 - 2012-10-22 22:20:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Garr Earthbender
*Edit* thanks Hans. Bust the bunker or risk the enemy deplexing.

-Scissors is overpowered, rock is fine. -Paper
Theaty Chelien
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#207 - 2012-10-22 22:22:24 UTC
Worst suprise ever Sad
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#208 - 2012-10-22 22:23:26 UTC  |  Edited by: X Gallentius
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
LP Gain = Base value of plex * (Contested percentage of the system/100) * 0.75
if this is true then potentially each minor plex is worth 7.5k LP * 2-4k isk/lp = 15-30 million isk/plex.
5-6 plexes/hour = 75 to 180 million isk/hour. Not bad for a 1 day old alt. Try doing that with your high sec mining alt.

There won't be 23/7 farming like there is now, but there will still be plenty of "farming of opportunity" or "low intensity, high reward" farming.

Farmers are gonna farm.
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#209 - 2012-10-22 22:27:15 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
LP Gain = Base value of plex * (Contested percentage of the system/100) * 0.75
if this is true then potentially each minor plex is worth 7.5k LP * 2-4k isk/lp = 15-30 million isk/plex.
5-6 plexes/hour = 75 to 180 million isk/hour. Not bad for a 1 day old alt. Try doing that with your high sec mining alt.

There won't be 23/7 farming like there is now, but there will still be plenty of "farming of opportunity" or "low intensity, high reward" farming.

Farmers are gonna farm.


The point is, effortless work for reward is bad however you slice it. Doesn't matter if you're taking space or earning LP, I don't believe AFK work has a place in FW, period. There should be risk in every activity, including defensive plexing.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Soon Shin
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
#210 - 2012-10-22 22:28:48 UTC
I personally think the current tier system encourages conflict. Why not change everything BUT the tier system?

The new upgrade system is good, there are now measures to stop overplexing, and now gunless frigate noobs will no longer easily do them.

The current tier system will make it so that militias will have to go in fierce fighting to get better rewards.


I forsee the value of FW LP to be pennies. The problem I saw was that it was too easy to do for the amount you could make.
Nex apparatu5
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#211 - 2012-10-22 22:28:59 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
LP Gain = Base value of plex * (Contested percentage of the system/100) * 0.75
if this is true then potentially each minor plex is worth 7.5k LP * 2-4k isk/lp = 15-30 million isk/plex.
5-6 plexes/hour = 75 to 180 million isk/hour. Not bad for a 1 day old alt. Try doing that with your high sec mining alt.

There won't be 23/7 farming like there is now, but there will still be plenty of "farming of opportunity" or "low intensity, high reward" farming.

Farmers are gonna farm.


Probably closer to 500 isk/LP, which is more like 20m/hr, which you can do with a hisec mining alt.
Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#212 - 2012-10-22 22:30:44 UTC
I would argue that simply BEING in lowsec is more risky then all of missioning.

Watch me live for all your Empyrean news and analysis!

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#213 - 2012-10-22 22:33:29 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Susan Black wrote:
The defensive/offensive idea Hans is talking about is making it so that you have to shoot rats in defensive plexes as well. I think this is in response to some concern about the ability to farm defensive plexes without the risk of NPC interference.
If someone wants to farm defensive plexes, more power to them. The payout is pretty ****, per Fozzie's equaltion.

LP Gain = Base value of plex * (Contested percentage of the system/100) * 0.75

They payout strictly from the T2 base (modified downwards by contested percentage) ... there is no warzone control scaling. So the ISK/hour potential is very low. Thus, there is no real problem here.


That formula is to calculate the payout in relation to offensive plexing. All activites that generate LP for the faction militias will be scaled based on faction tier at this time.

We'll be watching defensive plexing carefully and if it gets overfarmed it's trivial for us to adjust the formula. We chose that calculation with ease of adjustment in mind.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Weitkunat
Moira.
#214 - 2012-10-22 22:33:30 UTC
Soon Shin wrote:
I personally think the current tier system encourages conflict. Why not change everything BUT the tier system?

The new upgrade system is good, there are now measures to stop overplexing, and now gunless frigate noobs will no longer easily do them.

The current tier system will make it so that militias will have to go in fierce fighting to get better rewards.


I forsee the value of FW LP to be pennies. The problem I saw was that it was too easy to do for the amount you could make.

Honestly I'd stay in FW even if there was zero reward. PVP is fun.
Soon Shin
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
#215 - 2012-10-22 22:33:37 UTC
Ashterothi wrote:
I would argue that simply BEING in lowsec is more risky then all of missioning.


From how I see it the big issue was the simply the silly noob frigate farmers doing the plexes with ease.

But now that is gone, it takes effort to do them.

The Current tier system is fine, it is a true conflict driver between factions.

The new tier system is not so much, all it does is cause LP inflation and reduces the value of LP to the point where it does become worth much.
Soon Shin
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
#216 - 2012-10-22 22:34:40 UTC
Weitkunat wrote:
Soon Shin wrote:
I personally think the current tier system encourages conflict. Why not change everything BUT the tier system?

The new upgrade system is good, there are now measures to stop overplexing, and now gunless frigate noobs will no longer easily do them.

The current tier system will make it so that militias will have to go in fierce fighting to get better rewards.


I forsee the value of FW LP to be pennies. The problem I saw was that it was too easy to do for the amount you could make.

Honestly I'd stay in FW even if there was zero reward. PVP is fun.


I personally think PVP involving local is not "PVP". Wormhole space is true pvp.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#217 - 2012-10-22 22:35:28 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
LP Gain = Base value of plex * (Contested percentage of the system/100) * 0.75
if this is true then potentially each minor plex is worth 7.5k LP * 2-4k isk/lp = 15-30 million isk/plex.
5-6 plexes/hour = 75 to 180 million isk/hour. Not bad for a 1 day old alt. Try doing that with your high sec mining alt.

There won't be 23/7 farming like there is now, but there will still be plenty of "farming of opportunity" or "low intensity, high reward" farming.

Farmers are gonna farm.


i think you missed the part where you cant speed tank anymore you actually have to kill the npc to take the outpost...

though if you are talking about defence plex farming... then yeah... there is potential for that but... hanz idea of having npc's switch depending on who took it over would defeat this from hapening...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Weitkunat
Moira.
#218 - 2012-10-22 22:35:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Weitkunat
Soon Shin wrote:
Weitkunat wrote:
Soon Shin wrote:
I personally think the current tier system encourages conflict. Why not change everything BUT the tier system?

The new upgrade system is good, there are now measures to stop overplexing, and now gunless frigate noobs will no longer easily do them.

The current tier system will make it so that militias will have to go in fierce fighting to get better rewards.


I forsee the value of FW LP to be pennies. The problem I saw was that it was too easy to do for the amount you could make.

Honestly I'd stay in FW even if there was zero reward. PVP is fun.


I personally think PVP involving local is not "PVP". Wormhole space is true pvp.

I agree. But that's a whole other can of worms.
Louis deGuerre
The Dark Tribe
#219 - 2012-10-22 22:41:57 UTC
This is a suprise. A good suprise mind you.
I actually expected this to go much further of the rails before a reaction.
That said, it is not good enough. I'd try to get some priority on those items you've put on the backlog.
Keep up the good work.
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#220 - 2012-10-22 22:43:40 UTC
Cool, I might actually want to go in to FW now. However, I am surprised by the lack of rage in this thread.

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet