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Dev blog: Introducing the new and improved Crimewatch

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Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#861 - 2012-10-08 12:43:37 UTC
Daioh Azu wrote:

Please read again. I am aware that in your scenario the baiter can't point his target without a Concordoken until the target fires first. However the taget can't fire first without a Concordoken if the baiter hasn't already been flagged for theft. That is flag to which I refer in my musings.

Precisely how can everyone in local come for the free gank? Isn't this baiting taking place in a mission dead space, whether it be gated or not gated? Unless everyone in local are all in the same fleet, they will have to scan the mission site down, just as you did. Generally I can't get most people to talk in local, let alone get them to join my fleet.


You say "Help. Tackled. In Belt. Pls Hurry"

Then you invite the first person who responds to your fleet.
If they can move faster than an Orca, you've got your white knight.
I'm perfectly OK with that as it could lead to interesting fights beyond executing the carebear who shot at you.

But none of that will ever happen, because after CW baiting will be essentially dead.

I'm not OK with is simultaneously rendering ninjas impotent with a stupid overreaction.

Greyscale: "Carebear shot you because he wanted to fight a frigate with his faction fit CNR. You are now required to oblige him."
Roll
Roime
Shiva Furnace
#862 - 2012-10-08 12:54:19 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:

And I think that's a lesser problem than the essentially invulnerable state of the current Ratting Carrier.

First Line of Defense: Local Flashing and Updating before the new person loads grid.
Second Line: 10s Scan Timer.
Third Line: Warp Time
Fourth Line: Being ~100km off the Warpin of the site. (Luv You Sentries)
Fifth Line: Even if all the other lines of defense fail, simply log off before the Interceptor finishes landing on grid. 60s later, *poof*

What about a 5 minute timer that's extensible like the PC aggro timer? Reduces the wait before logging in normal circumstances while removing people's ability to Loggoffski to prevent being caught while their pants are down and they're grasping their ankles.


5 minutes extensible sounds much better.

Also local should update only after the newcomer breaks gate cloak, if there really needs to be local in null for whatever reason.



.
Pipa Porto
#863 - 2012-10-08 14:06:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Roime wrote:
5 minutes extensible sounds much better.


It does have to be something reasonably long so that people who try to use it to escape get caught, but I do grant that inconveniencing those without access to a POS would be unfortunate.

What I really don't see is why it shouldn't be extensible no matter what the starting length. If you catch something due to its owner's incompetence, you should be able to kill it. And incompetence it will be with the giant yellow symbol in the top left to tell you your timer.

Quote:
Also local should update only after the newcomer breaks gate cloak, if there really needs to be local in null for whatever reason.


I would say local update with grid load. At least to start. That way both pilots become aware of each other at the same time. Or maybe local updating when breaking gate cloak, but no local until you break cloak (though that hamstrings scouts, so ehhh).


And there is a need for local in Null. It's the main thing that makes it different than WHs.

But that's probably best for another thread.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Esker Sheep
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#864 - 2012-10-08 15:19:41 UTC
I must say that I like the way this is going. Lots of nice tears to be had.

I'd like to see a change to the NPC timer though. Allow it to be changed to a PVP timer, and therefore able to be extended, if someone can aggress it before it expires.

As to the complaints about the timer being too long and removing an exploit that they had been using. You're using an exploit, consider yourself blessed that you've able to get away with it thus far.

I predict far more lowsec gate camping with fast lockers and lots of alpha. This will require a change in tactics, and more cooperative play, to overcome. On the negative side it may stop more people venturing into lowsec unless the rewards really are worth it.
Tsukinosuke
Id Est
RAZOR Alliance
#865 - 2012-10-08 15:20:29 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:


And there is a need for local in Null. It's the main thing that makes it different than WHs.



you are pretty wrong. 0.0 is home of pirate factions. so actually "It's the main thing that makes it different than" emperial regions(gallente/caldari/amarr/minmatar).

anti-antagonist "not a friend of enemy of antagonist"
Pipa Porto
#866 - 2012-10-08 16:24:50 UTC
Tsukinosuke wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:


And there is a need for local in Null. It's the main thing that makes it different than WHs.



you are pretty wrong. 0.0 is home of pirate factions. so actually "It's the main thing that makes it different than" emperial regions(gallente/caldari/amarr/minmatar).


Where was I comparing Nullsec to Empire? Try reading all of the words in the line you quote.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Ghostwarden
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#867 - 2012-10-08 16:59:51 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Ghostwarden wrote:
Why not instead of bringing an Orca with an additional ship you instead just have the other character in a combat ship that CAN break the PVE tank waiting cloaked to come in once you have a point on the ship? Seems to me that what you really want is to have the ability to pick a fight single-handed and have whatever ships you need to johnny on the spot in a way that the PVE player cannot, its not advisable to bring an orca into a mission so that I can have my spare combat ship after all. Once again it sounds like you just want an uneven playing field.


Because that's not how CONCORD works.

HS mechanics force these fights to be single handed on the part of the baiter.



I do understand how the mechanics work. What I'm trying to point out is that currently doing the orca swap is something that was not intended but is none the less viable. People have been using this tactic and making bank at at. My previous statement about people just wanting to have multiple ships on hand to perform their gank still stands. Players could just as well fit a warp scrambler on their pvp ship (and yes I know that they would have to give something up to do it but they can do it none the less). The changes that they are making will nix that. I also understand that people feel that this will kill the ability to gank mission runners in high sec, but I'd like to point out that before the Orca was ever in the game players were ganking carebares in missions (I know because it happened to me) without it and they will continue to do so in the future. But it will be a little more dangerous to do so given that they are exposing themselves to attack from anyone.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#868 - 2012-10-08 17:18:22 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
OT Smithers wrote:

Bart,

Respectfully, you do not understand the whole situation. As bad as the problem is in high sec, it is FAR worse in low. The reason people have been hesitant to elaborate is because we already deal with this crap enough without posting it on the forums.

Ultimately what it comes down to is this: Certain players are risk averse. They want the excitement of the kill, they love the tears, but they insist on immunity for themselves. Whether we are talking about ganking miners or haulers, baiting mission runners, or parking a mach and a carrier in the station superstructure in low, the goal is the same.

Those who defend these exploits (and justify their use of them) love to say things like "Eve is a harsh place" and "Don't undock what you can't lose," but they say them unaware of the taint of hypocrisy clinging to their words. They are the ones most afraid of losing. Baiting mission runners is like an adult man heading to the local Kindergarten looking to pick a fight with a five year old -- and insisting that you need this ship swapping nonsense is like that same adult managing to find a fiesty five-year-old... then panicking and pulling out a gun because the little guy put of a fight.

CCP is changing it to where you will no longer be able to pull that gun. You can still head to that school, you can still pick on the little kids you find there, but now, finally, you are going to have to risk not only that kid kicking your ass, but the adults stepping in to help them.


First, you stated a falsehood - "the only reason people would do this is to save their ship".
Thats what I spent two pages going around with Tippia about.
High sec ninjas don't care about 'saving' anything. We just need a way to bring additional DPS to bust PVE tanks, after we've killed their drones and have them scrammed and webbed.

Crimewatch makes them even safer, as all they need to do is call out in local, fleet with a willing vigilante that can outrun the Orca to the site. In addition to this, new NPC AI makes all of this more unpredictable and more difficult to pull off.

Don't be so quick to take the carebear's side.

We aren't talking about picking on some 5 day old noob in a LVL 1 mission....
We are talking about mission runners in faction fit CNRs.
We are talking about Marauders.
We are talking about carebears with years of mission running under their belt, not 'kids'.

And as it is, they only fall for stuff like this....occasionally. You generally need to scan down a lot of bots and Drakes before you find someone who will dance with you.
The bait that is dangled before them is a 'PVP' kill against an annoying 'weak' ninja frigate.
They think 'LOL easy kill on a Heron'
When they take it, and the Heron turns the tables on them, why shouldn't they be put at SOME kind of risk?
Why should the ninja be expected to have to kill the CNR in a Heron (impossible), or allow the target 60 seconds to escape (will happen 99.5% of the time)? Remember, the CNR shot first....

Besides. the most dangerous thing we can even haul into a mission with an Orca is a BC sized ship. It shouldn't be too hard to get enough help after CW 2.0 to deal with a lone Plated Neut Hurricane. (Roll Oh wait, those got nerfed too.)I thought THAT was the point of Crimewatch - putting security in player hands.....not completely hamstringing the criminals to the point where they don't even bother anymore....


I'll acknowledge that CW2.0 changes make mission baiting harder... but so what.... you can still get plenty of PvP with the upcoming changes...

1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...

2.) Send out fake S.O.S.'s.... and gank those that come...

3.) Finding fights will be easier.... it doesn't matter if everyone CAN shoot you, only a small percentage of highsec players WILL shoot you.... so quit acting like the sky is falling... this is a BOOST to your PvP.... become a suspect, get some attention of vigilantes... and you'll get lots of fights!!!

4.) Newb PvP'ers are much, much, much more likely to get into PvP now.... They don't have to can flip and hope to get a response.. instead they can become vigilantes and chase down suspects. How is this NOT good for beginner PvP'ers???

Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#869 - 2012-10-08 17:41:32 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...


Yeah, try killing a faction fit Passive Rattlesnake with a Vexor. Let me know how that works out for you.

And getting fights with vigilantes in T2 cruisers and Drakes is all well and good, but it misses the point:

Killing heavily tanked, expensively fit Battleships is the goal, not skirmishing with Rifters.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#870 - 2012-10-08 18:00:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Gizznitt Malikite
Bart Starr wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...


Yeah, try killing a faction fit Passive Rattlesnake with a Vexor. Let me know how that works out for you.

And getting fights with vigilantes in T2 cruisers and Drakes is all well and good, but it misses the point:

Killing heavily tanked, expensively fit Battleships is the goal, not skirmishing with Rifters.


It won't be easy.... and you'll probably fail until you learn how to do it... but I'm sure it's possible...

most ships have a weakness... exploit it!

*edit*
The new vexor gets an extra mid and low (but loses a highslot)... it gains more PG and CPU... and a significant EHP boost.... One medium neut is often enough to destabilize a passive tanked RS.... and two will probably do the trick just fine. With Drone Damage amps, the vexor can put out 400 dps with drones alone, which is more than enough to take out a RS that has it's hardeners turned off... The hardest part will be declawing the RS... which typically fields sentries that won't hit worth crap when you orbit close... In short, you can still beat the mission runner, but it will be much harder... also, if it becomes "easier" for the mission runner to win... then they are more likely to engage you....
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#871 - 2012-10-08 18:25:06 UTC
Sounds like it's time to dust off the bait Hyperions

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Raigir
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#872 - 2012-10-08 18:59:43 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Raigir wrote:
So given the information from the ever so pretty charts: Low Sec gate guns won't engage you if you start attacking someone?
I ask: Do you get a criminal after destroying your target or are you still just a suspect? Else is the criminal timer only for pods (speaking low sec)?

Given what I deduced, unless we pod kill, pirates no longer have anything to fear from gate guns. (which I won't exactly complain about to be honest Twisted)


If you attack someone who is not a legal target for you, you take a sec hit.

If gate guns see you take a sec hit, they'll engage.


In high sec, you'll get a criminal flag, and get concorded.

In lowsec you'll get a suspect flag (unless it's a pod. then it's a criminal flag).


Not according to their chart on consequences. Gate guns only engage criminal flaged targets. Since engaging a ship in low sec only applies a suspect flag, gate guns will not attack. The only time someone criminal flaged in low sec is for attacking a pod.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#873 - 2012-10-08 19:03:45 UTC
Raigir wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Raigir wrote:
So given the information from the ever so pretty charts: Low Sec gate guns won't engage you if you start attacking someone?
I ask: Do you get a criminal after destroying your target or are you still just a suspect? Else is the criminal timer only for pods (speaking low sec)?

Given what I deduced, unless we pod kill, pirates no longer have anything to fear from gate guns. (which I won't exactly complain about to be honest Twisted)


If you attack someone who is not a legal target for you, you take a sec hit.

If gate guns see you take a sec hit, they'll engage.


In high sec, you'll get a criminal flag, and get concorded.

In lowsec you'll get a suspect flag (unless it's a pod. then it's a criminal flag).


Not according to their chart on consequences. Gate guns only engage criminal flaged targets. Since engaging a ship in low sec only applies a suspect flag, gate guns will not attack. The only time someone criminal flaged in low sec is for attacking a pod.


Read the Botom Row

So, everything that gives you a sec hit gets you gate gun aggro.....

Then Read the Sec Satus Penalty Column
OT Smithers
Did he say Jump
Dock Workers
#874 - 2012-10-08 19:56:10 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Daioh Azu wrote:
Given that you're relying on the naivety of your mark to engage after you have stolen from him, you might find that an unguarded can of his coveted salvage works just as well.
Except that mission runners don't loot with their mission ship.

Quote:
"orbit the idiot until Downtime." Now that's an interesting point to explore. Since your flag for theft lasts only 15 minutes should you keep a target pointed until the flag expires what happens? I imagine your coexisting aggression would keep already active modules from alerting Concord, but what about newly activated modules. In any case, orbiting the idiot until downtime is only a consequence should you choose to maintain the stalemate by keeping your point, or you could just warp away. Warp disruptors aren't typical on a PVE fit since mission rats don't try to escape.


Wrong flag. You (as the ninja) can only point someone after they have shot at you.

That's the problem. The Missionbear will be able to shoot at the interloping frigates with impunity because they know the Frigate can't break their tank, the ninja can't switch to something that can shoot, and even if the ninja does manage to make the switch, everyone in local can come for the free gank instead of having to rely on previously formalized social contacts (corpmates).



So... get better?

Why would you feel entitled to harrass these folks, steal their stuff, then kill them with absolutely no risk to yourself? You have every possible advantage going in: you can search for the ship you want to go after, you can check the character age, you know exactly how they will be tanked, you know what kind of damage they will likely be dishing out, you know that they do not have a point or neuts, you know that even if everything goes completely wrong the worst that will happen is that you might lose a bait frigate.

In other words, you want everything handed to you on a silver platter. You want the risk and skill free hrassment and slaughter of players who, by their choice to play in high sec, have indicated that they are not currently interested in PvP.

And now your tears are flooding this forum. You are going to lose one advantage. Whatever. Get over it or cancel.

OT Smithers
Did he say Jump
Dock Workers
#875 - 2012-10-08 20:17:25 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...


Yeah, try killing a faction fit Passive Rattlesnake with a Vexor. Let me know how that works out for you.

And getting fights with vigilantes in T2 cruisers and Drakes is all well and good, but it misses the point:

Killing heavily tanked, expensively fit Battleships is the goal, not skirmishing with Rifters.


Here's a thought...

Maybe it's time for you to leave the kiddie pool and head out to either low sec or null. Seriously, unless you are a new player, high sec baiting is lame. I'm sure you are very good at it, but it's lame. It's way past time for you to get your pirate on. Come join us in low sec. You'll lose more often, but you will damn sure have a hell of a lot more fun.
Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#876 - 2012-10-08 20:37:13 UTC
OT Smithers wrote:
Bart Starr wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...


Yeah, try killing a faction fit Passive Rattlesnake with a Vexor. Let me know how that works out for you.

And getting fights with vigilantes in T2 cruisers and Drakes is all well and good, but it misses the point:

Killing heavily tanked, expensively fit Battleships is the goal, not skirmishing with Rifters.


Here's a thought...

Maybe it's time for you to leave the kiddie pool and head out to either low sec or null. Seriously, unless you are a new player, high sec baiting is lame. I'm sure you are very good at it, but it's lame. It's way past time for you to get your pirate on. Come join us in low sec. You'll lose more often, but you will damn sure have a hell of a lot more fun.


Missing the point again.
How many faction or deadspace fit CNRs are in lowsec? How much ISK do yo make blowing up T1 Ruptures in lowsec?
How many tears are collected from killing a pilot in lowsec who is looking for a fight in a cheap insured ship?
You realize that without ninjas, LVL 4 Mission runner ships are almost completely without threat in highsec?

And no, a even a buffed Vexor isn't going to kill a bling Passive Rattlesnake - even if you convince one to shoot at a Vexor.
Even the pre-nerf, stock ninja Plate/Neut Hurricanes struggle to crack them because of reload cycles on autocannons.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#877 - 2012-10-08 21:02:24 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
OT Smithers wrote:
Bart Starr wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


1.) Mission baiting can still happen... but your tactics need to change some.... instead of baiting with a heron, you need to bait with a ship that can actually win the fight (use a vexor or whatever instead). Or, you can still bait your opponent with a heron, but hold them there until they pay you a ransom.... (or get help). Your suspect flag is only 15 minutes, and isn't extended...


Yeah, try killing a faction fit Passive Rattlesnake with a Vexor. Let me know how that works out for you.

And getting fights with vigilantes in T2 cruisers and Drakes is all well and good, but it misses the point:

Killing heavily tanked, expensively fit Battleships is the goal, not skirmishing with Rifters.


Here's a thought...

Maybe it's time for you to leave the kiddie pool and head out to either low sec or null. Seriously, unless you are a new player, high sec baiting is lame. I'm sure you are very good at it, but it's lame. It's way past time for you to get your pirate on. Come join us in low sec. You'll lose more often, but you will damn sure have a hell of a lot more fun.


Missing the point again.
How many faction or deadspace fit CNRs are in lowsec? How much ISK do yo make blowing up T1 Ruptures in lowsec?
How many tears are collected from killing a pilot in lowsec who is looking for a fight in a cheap insured ship?
You realize that without ninjas, LVL 4 Mission runner ships are almost completely without threat in highsec?

And no, a even a buffed Vexor isn't going to kill a bling Passive Rattlesnake - even if you convince one to shoot at a Vexor.
Even the pre-nerf, stock ninja Plate/Neut Hurricanes struggle to crack them because of reload cycles on autocannons.



If they are officer fit.... combine it with a suicide gank to get it over the regen threshold... it will often still be worth it....
Or just hold them in place until they pay you to leave.... you may not get the ship kill... buy you can still make isk.....
Or start experimenting... its adapt or die time, and I'm positive all worthy gankers will still find ways to gank mission runners. And when it becomes more rare, and more difficult, you'll find emboldened carebears that still make tasty treats....

If you can't adapt to these changes, then you probably need to find a new profession...

This system, so far, is so full of awesomesauce that I really don't understand your opposition...
CCP Masterplan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#878 - 2012-10-08 22:16:23 UTC
Kitsune io wrote:
Greetings

I may have missed a post about this or I am just pedantic.

I have a concern about the wording "Targeting and offensive module against an illegal player target". Should it not read "Activating an offensive module against an illegal player target"? If one has the 'Auto target back', x targets ticked, just being targeted by another player will cause your ship to target theirs, apparently incurring the same criminal flag?

Great ideas though, should ruffle a few gangster feathers Big smile

Kit

I've think you've misread something (since I can't find that exact quote in the blog).
"Targeted offensive module" means a module that performs an offensive action against a single item that you have targeted when you activate it. (As oppose to a non-targeted offensive module such as a smartbomb)
The simple act of just locking someone is never considered an offensive action.


Noslen Nosilla wrote:
What happens between members of the same corp doing inter corp duels for fun? Twisted
Do they get concorded?Cry
Shot at by gate guns?Cry

No penalties for shooting your own corp mates (excluding NPC corps obviously) apart from whatever consequence your corp mates will provide.

Marrano Cardosa wrote:
Great job. While it doesn't make the system simple it does allow me to see clearly what consequences there are for my actions. It should make low sec fights at gates interesting.

I also like the changes to logi mechanics. No more insta-dock at station when the logi gets in trouble (and I like that even thought I do fly logi upon occasion).

But I do have one question about logi that isn't clear from either the blog or the posts I have read so far. This involves high-sec wars and neutral logi. Its clear that the neutral logi won't be able to dock at will, but will have a weapon and pvp flag that could have a timer of as long as 1 minute (for the weapon) and 15 minutes (for the pvp).

What's unclear is if and when the neutral logi become legal targets for the WTs of the ships they are aiding. Right now (or rather the last time I was involved in a high sec war which was some months ago), neutral logis only became valid targets when they had repped a ship I had already done damage to. This was less than desirable as various ships were only valid targets to a subset of the fleet (and did on at least one occasion result in Concord getting involved).

Our current thinking on this is something like:

Assisting your own corp mates* in a Limited Engagement is always legally allowed (it won't be punished per se, but you'll still inherit any W/P/S/C flags they have)

But this is still something we're discussing
* Excluding NPC corps, and assisting Outlaws in high-sec

Kumbu Valley wrote:
To be honest, I dont expect CCP to make it easier for gankers but also that they dont make it impossible from now on. Ganking was always a part of the game (remember the days when BPO and BPC became visible within cargo scan, combined with "Yarr" by CCP). If it is not intended anymore then pls announce openly and does not leave it to the mechanics.

Secondly and more important looting wrecks needs to be possible! How the ninjas shall feed their families? Just kidding but really, what about wrecks in faction warfare, in official war declaration? What is the mechanics here? You cant go suspect with looting the wreck! Without making them blue for the aggressor/killer/war oppnent whatsoever, it is not possible to loot them anymore from what I read. That cant be the intention. Therefore I would appreciate clarification and leave it not to find out in December. Thanks.

From the dev blog:
"If I can legally attack the owner of a container, then I can legally take from the container."
If you kill a war target (including an FW target), since you are legally allowed to attack them you are also legally allowed to take their stuff.

"This one time, on patch day..."

@ccp_masterplan  |  Team Five-0: Rewriting the law
CCP Masterplan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#879 - 2012-10-08 22:16:52 UTC
Komen wrote:
I just want to say if I ever meet you Masterplan, I'm buying you a beer. I like the 'no logging off if you're ratting to save your ship's ass from PvP gank squads. I like the 'no ejecting if you have fired weapons to save skill points/pod' thing. Of course this means many people are going to be even more hesitant about committing to combat, but that's Eve for ya.

I'm sure we'll all adjust.


See you at Fanfest '13?

"This one time, on patch day..."

@ccp_masterplan  |  Team Five-0: Rewriting the law
CCP Masterplan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#880 - 2012-10-08 22:17:48 UTC
McDarila wrote:
My big question is are wreaks containers? If so the next burn jita event will be truely epic. Not from the concord responce but from the players as they all start turning killable with out concord responce.

As far as Crimewatch is concerned, yes, wrecks and containers are basically the same thing

"This one time, on patch day..."

@ccp_masterplan  |  Team Five-0: Rewriting the law