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[Winter] Changes to NPC AI

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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2012-09-20 12:40:08 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Habakuk
Dev blog: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73413

In summary we have gone through and upgraded all NPC in the game to the new level one AI making them smarter. It is important to note that their damage output and EWAR capabilities have not changes. The biggest difference will be that they target switch.

If you can it would be greatly appreciated if you played through a couple missions, especially with multiple people/accounts and gave us some feedback.

We are aware that currently the navy in high sec is shooting everyone, and giving them GCC, and then letting CONCORD pile on. We have a fix internally for this already. Fixed.

Update 2012/10/17:

Hey guys,

This weekend Duality will be coming back online with a focus of testing the new NPC changes. I will personally be online for as much of it as possible, especially during the day on Monday to help people with the testing, to do the testing myself, and to get your feedback.


  • Duality will be online starting Friday October 19th.
  • It should be online by 13:00, although to be honest I hope to see it online a lot sooner.
  • Duality will remain online until the morning of Tuesday October 23rd.
  • If you are going to be on Duality join the channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


Unfortunetly I will actually be out of the office on Friday during the day though. :(

To connect to Duality:
Quote:
To access Duality copy your main Eve install to a different folder.
Then create a shortcut to that folder's launcher (eve.exe).
Right click on that shortcut on the desktop, go into "Properties" and in the "Target" field put a space after the last entry in the field and type /server:87.237.38.60 to force the launcher to point towards Duality.
Once you run that shortcut the launcher will download the most recent patch for Duality and get you ready to connect.


MASS TEST!
On top of this we would like to run a mass test on Monday, October 22nd, at 14:00 EVE time. During this time we would like to test the performance impact of the new AI having been applied to everything. To do this properly we will need as many people as possible running missions in one of the following systems:

  • Motsu
  • Dodixie
  • Ordion
  • Emolgranlan


Those who complete a minimum of 10 missions in one of those four systems between the hours of 14:00 and 18:00 on Monday October 22nd will receive 2 million SP on both Buckingham and Duality. Both CCP Bettik, myself, and other members of team Five 0 will be online during this time. Again, please join the Duality chat channel during this mass test and we will do whatever we can to help assist you in testing missions.

CCP FoxFour

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#2 - 2012-09-20 13:12:08 UTC
This is an epic step towards a better player experience...
In the future we can all hope for fewer, stronger NPC's with improved bounties to challenge players with improved ships available

(However I know thats a big change to all missions, complexes and similar and I assume the belt rat mechanics have to be edited too for that to come through).

Question: What about aggro mechanics? Will mission groups still watch their comrades getting slaughtered without interfering?

Pinky
Hosedna
FumbleFamily Corp
#3 - 2012-09-20 13:15:50 UTC
How will NPC aggro toward drones be managed ? Will they hate drones as much as sleepers do, or will it still be possible to use drone boats for missionning ?
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#4 - 2012-09-20 13:21:37 UTC
Hosedna wrote:
How will NPC aggro toward drones be managed ? Will they hate drones as much as sleepers do, or will it still be possible to use drone boats for missionning ?

Give this just a bit longer and the dev blog will answer it. I really didn't want to post this until after the dev blog, but I wanted a link here in the dev blog. Stupid chicken or egg. :/

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Hosedna
FumbleFamily Corp
#5 - 2012-09-20 13:23:50 UTC
Ok, I'll wait for the Dev blog then :)
Latjla
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-09-20 13:24:41 UTC
Complex NPCs included? Everyone needs to be able to tank citadel torps in Mazes and Blood Naval Shipyards? Shocked
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#7 - 2012-09-20 13:25:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Ill have to wait for you to fix high sec before i test. But: I do fly in W-space which has the target switching AI. As a drone user, its a big problem. A Sleeper site does not have very many NPCs and they are quite valuable, so catching drone aggro can be accepted.

But in a mission? This will be a severe nerf to all drone specialists. Gun users do not have to worry about their guns catching aggro and getting destroyed unless they spend 30 seconds recalling them every 2 minutes. Maybe consider:

Right now the target switching AI will always switch targets once every 2 minutes irrelevant of the treat of targets. If there is a Tengu and one Warrior I on the field, it will switch to the Warrior as its the only other available target. Maybe that should be changed: Have the treat assessment of which target to go after include the current target.

Edit: I go caught by the "chicken or egg" issue too. Ill wait to see the blog, and better yet, test myself.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#8 - 2012-09-20 13:42:35 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Ill have to wait for you to fix high sec before i test. But: I do fly in W-space which has the target switching AI. As a drone user, its a big problem. A Sleeper site does not have very many NPCs and they are quite valuable, so catching drone aggro can be accepted.

But in a mission? This will be a severe nerf to all drone specialists. Gun users do not have to worry about their guns catching aggro and getting destroyed unless they spend 30 seconds recalling them every 2 minutes. Maybe consider:

Right now the target switching AI will always switch targets once every 2 minutes irrelevant of the treat of targets. If there is a Tengu and one Warrior I on the field, it will switch to the Warrior as its the only other available target. Maybe that should be changed: Have the treat assessment of which target to go after include the current target.

Edit: I go caught by the "chicken or egg" issue too. Ill wait to see the blog, and better yet, test myself.


Not a problem, sorry for not saying much aside from "wait for the dev blog." :(

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-09-20 13:42:57 UTC
dev blog how soon??

have i got time to put the kettle on?

No Worries
Tsubutai
Perkone
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-09-20 13:44:05 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Hosedna wrote:
How will NPC aggro toward drones be managed ? Will they hate drones as much as sleepers do, or will it still be possible to use drone boats for missionning ?

Give this just a bit longer and the dev blog will answer it. I really didn't want to post this until after the dev blog, but I wanted a link here in the dev blog. Stupid chicken or egg. :/

I very much hope that the fix for this will also stop sentry guns in lowsec from shooting at drones belonging to people with GCC, making it possible to use droneboats while under fire from gate guns.
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#11 - 2012-09-20 13:44:22 UTC
ChromeStriker wrote:
dev blog how soon??

have i got time to put the kettle on?


Like I have submitted it and just waiting for community to press the button. In other words please don't tell them this thread exists. :P

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-09-20 13:47:14 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
dev blog how soon??

have i got time to put the kettle on?


Like I have submitted it and just waiting for community to press the button. In other words please don't tell them this thread exists. :P


Are we talking they have to go through a meeting, or just press a nice red shiny button saying "Post it"?

This is important as otherwise i need to go find some work to do Shocked

No Worries
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#13 - 2012-09-20 13:48:28 UTC
ChromeStriker wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
dev blog how soon??

have i got time to put the kettle on?


Like I have submitted it and just waiting for community to press the button. In other words please don't tell them this thread exists. :P


Are we talking they have to go through a meeting, or just press a nice red shiny button saying "Post it"?

This is important as otherwise i need to go find some work to do Shocked


I shall poke them. :P But you may be best to find some work to do.

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-09-20 13:50:46 UTC  |  Edited by: ChromeStriker
CCP FoxFour wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
ChromeStriker wrote:
dev blog how soon??

have i got time to put the kettle on?


Like I have submitted it and just waiting for community to press the button. In other words please don't tell them this thread exists. :P


Are we talking they have to go through a meeting, or just press a nice red shiny button saying "Post it"?

This is important as otherwise i need to go find some work to do Shocked


I shall poke them. :P But you may be best to find some work to do.


Pff Cry fine, but only because you said so, my boss looking at me funny has nothing to do with it

Thanks tho Big smile

No Worries
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#15 - 2012-09-20 14:11:03 UTC
Blog is up: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73413

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Hosedna
FumbleFamily Corp
#16 - 2012-09-20 14:14:16 UTC
Looks promising, now we will have to be more careful during missions, not bad :) Still a long way to go to have really interresting PVE though :p

The best point is the choice of the target based on hull size, when you bring a noob with you for L4, he'll have more fun battling the frigs !
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#17 - 2012-09-20 14:23:12 UTC

Just wanted to tell you that this is great.

I don't care how many tears come from it. It's awesome.

Where I am.
Rutger Janssen
Chanuur
Goonswarm Federation
#18 - 2012-09-20 14:52:04 UTC
Quote:
and got some of our QA and Bug Hunters to hammer through missions

So that's why bug reports are seemingly not processed anymore?

I guess the change is gonna make things more "interesting" for grouped players; non-drone solo boats won't notice a change I imagine?

This change is gonna suck for (nullsec) miners, can't have 1 player tank(in a hulk) the belts rats anymore and have everyone else fly hulks and haulers.

DG fleet staging point is gonna be a lot harder I imagine with the torpedo, all participating ships need to be able to take a hit from it?
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#19 - 2012-09-20 14:57:36 UTC
Some missions DO still have Elite web/point frigates though, right?
Wonder how difficult they will be to battle hehe
Tanaka Aiko
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2012-09-20 15:02:15 UTC
is the long term goal having less redboxes but more powerfull ships like incursions and sleepers ?

I would really like that, it's a pain killing all these little things who loot nothing and have no chance killing us, and I don't even talk about thinking of salvaging these...

When you kill a sleeper frigate you don't have the impression of losing your time, cause this thing hurt, have lots of scamble, neut or web so it's real dangerous, but it does also loot not bad.
a nullsec frigate however... it may scramble and need to be killed quickly in this case, but you two shot it, and it loot nothing. so you only have the impression of losing your time.
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