These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

New dev blog: Capital ship balancing

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Shin Dari
Covert Brigade
#2141 - 2011-10-15 10:16:28 UTC

Thinking further about it, I have come to the conclusion that SC should only be allowed to field bombers. However as compensation they should get several manufacturing lines.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#2142 - 2011-10-15 10:55:01 UTC
Shin Dari wrote:

Thinking further about it, I have come to the conclusion that SC should only be allowed to field bombers. However as compensation they should get several manufacturing lines.


All ships in the game should be replaced by the Ibis.
Sangard
Bunny Industry Group
#2143 - 2011-10-15 11:16:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Sangard
Ganthrithor wrote:


Fighter EHP is fine. The other day, a hostile carrier sitting on a station deployed fighters to shoot an anchorable bubble of mine 100km off the undock. I proceeded to kill three of his fighters in my battleship before he could recall them, while my mate in a cruiser picked off another. If a measly two ships can take out 40% of a carrier's offensive capabilities in the time it takes him to recall his fighters, I doubt fighters "need an ehp nerf."

Don't punish carrier pilots for peoples' general lack of competence.


Lack of competence is exactly your business, mate :)

Don't compare your one-time experience with fighters to the overall mechanics. Your example is just pointless, Docking games and station camping is not the real pvp serious players focus on.

fyi:
Einherji stats:
Shield: 2,750 HP
Armor: 3,250 HP
Structure: 3,750 HP
Peak Passive Recharge Rate: 26.40 HP/s

Stabber stats:
Shield: 1,485 HP
Armor: 1,250 HP
Structure: 1,289 HP
Peak Passive Recharge Rate: 2.85 HP/s
BRICKS4BALLS
Freelancer Union
Unaffiliated
#2144 - 2011-10-15 11:33:39 UTC
Why shouldnt Super-capitals' have some sort of means to defend themselves from smaller ships for a short period of time at least.

Some people have played this game for an awful long time and have accumulated lots of isk/skills etc, and decided to never stay in smaller alliances/corps. At the same time some of these smaller groups may have a few supercaps, this change will take away those players ability to ever use these ships, knowning the increased chance of being pinned down now with no way to defend yourself. Some of the smaller corps/alliances simply wont ever have the numbers playing to have proper support.

Yea sure, I am aware that in the real world small organizations would'nt own massive ships like this.

The changes may work well to prevent big alliances blobing, but I'm sure they restrict smaller groups using them at all now.

Giving them an ability to field fewer drones than fighters/bombers may have been a better option, so at least a single HIC cant keep them pinned down for 30mins or so whilst they get a fleet together.

Also if someone goes to the trouble of baiting a frigate or cruiser so they drop a titan in to use the doomsday, then why not? Surely acts like this are humouous.
Rhaegor Stormborn
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2145 - 2011-10-15 12:13:28 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Sad but determined, ELITE PVPER Needa3 is dedicated to using his titan as it should be used, as God meant it to be used, right to the end.

The game and everyone who plays it will be poorer when stories - no, let us say legends - like this can no longer be written in it.

Godspeed, sir.



You still butthurt from all the times BE has raped whatever pathetic excuse for an alliance you belonged to? Lol
FHM
Doomheim
#2146 - 2011-10-15 12:19:32 UTC
Zomg Panties wrote:
@FHM

normally I wouldn't speak in a foul mannor on a forum post but you have got to be the most ******* ******** person i've seen post in this thread PERIOD!

supercarriers are not a ******* support ship they are like the titan and dread MASSIVE ******* DPS SHIPS the super carrier is a ship that does dmg with drones, the titan is a ship that has the highest dps in the game and has a ultimate weapon to do a massive burst of dmg, and the dread was supposed to be MASSIVE dps gunboat - the incomming changes will put their role back into check - DO NOT EVER CALL A SUPER CARRIER A SUPPORT SHIP AGAIN YOU ******** DUMBASS

a carrier is a support ship, a falcon is a support ship, a curse is a support ship, those are all support ships, ****.

titans should not be able to hit anything sub battleship and even then hardly at all, so yes incomming nerfs in that respect all fine and dandy, but taking away drones from a ******* drone boat? and only giving it max 25 fighters OR bombers?

I understand the point of making so you can defang a super but holy **** a 10 man fleet can defang a carrier in less than 30 seconds and then a 200 mill fleet kills a 15 billion dollar ship, how the **** is that fair? especially if they take a month and a half to build - your lack of intelligence is absolutely enlightening.

I remember when I was in 9th grade too but god damn.

titans and supercarriers should not be able to be killed by 10 man fleets, (subcaps) i dont even think 20 man fleets should be able to - it's a capital ship you are supposed to run away from it - and I really dont care if it's unfair to smaller alliances, they can get on the same page as everyone else there is always small alliances to pick on go **** them up and steal their **** grow larger as a alliance then take on the biggest alliance in eve.

what you are saying is that a 50 man alliance should be able to take a system from Raiden alliance because YOU WANT subcaps to kill a supercarrier that took a month to build in 5 minutes, and you want to do it with a 10 man fleet and not lose a single ship LOL you so mad bro.

it's so easy to kill a super carrier as it is now lol all you have to do is get a hic point on it with 10-20 high dps ships and 4 minutes later POP, anyone can do it - most alliances take 15-20 minutes to respond to a carrier tackle anyway, especially if you catch a super ratting - anyone who thinks otherwise doesnt live in null sec, or doesnt have supers in their alliance - it's plain and simple.

super carriers are easy enough to kill - now should they be abe to hold 5 million drones in their bay? hell no!

but the best super carrier pilots dont hold that many drones in their bay anyway, most just have an assortment of ecm drones a set of lights mediums and heavies and maybe sentries for pos shooting + 20 fighters and bombers.

IF a super carrier is using it's drones 1 of 2 situations has occured. 1) you're a ******** noob alliance roaming into a big boy system and you lack the skill to even warp away LMAO 2) they are DESPERATELY trying to break 3 or more hic tackles.

as it stands now if you tackle a carrier and a super warps in to help it, IT WONT HAVE RR on it only fail baddies put rr on a super, it'll be there to either use ecm on you or try to pew pew - but most pvp ships can out run any drone from a super cap LOL which makes me think you are even more fail.

if you can't kill a supercarrier you are just terrible at pvp - go back to high sec scrub

i can prolly do a search on battleclinic to show you 400+ kill mails within the last 3 months of supers being killed with less than 30 ships, but i'm not gonna spoon feed you l2play spaceships then come post on the big boy forums.



This just shows how stupid and arrogant super capital pilots really are. Super Carrier is a big useless ship that is used as fleet support to carry extra ships to fights, and provide DPS to kill a Capital or Super Capital ship and not sub capitals.

If super capitals have any means of defense against sub capital ships than we are just giving power to stupid noobs in alliances like Goonswarm, Raiden, PL, WN etc. Who are to noob to sit in a sub capital and face his opponents on equal grounds but require a super capital to kill a lone frigate you are pathetic.

Also yes show me the 400+ killmails where less than 30 ships killed a super capital. ... You are stupid man you are really stupid.

SUPER CAPITAL SHOULD NOT HAVE ANY MEANS OF DEFENSE AGAINST SUB CAPITALS NO MATTER THE COST RATIO.

It is not a SOLO ship IT DEPENDS on having sub capital support to defend it against OTHER SUB CAPITAL ships if you solo in a SUPER CAPITAL SHIP you deserve to DIE. IF we left SUPER CAPITALS have any means of getting DAMAGE ON TO SUB CAPITAL SHIPS than we will never STOP THE SUPER CAPITAL BLOB warfare.

The nerf would not be needed if these ships were RARE or if not every alliance would be able to REIMBURSE 100s of such loses EVERY DAY whit EASY. That is just STUPID. Look at WN they said oh we will just turn 100 of our SUPER CARRIER pilots to 100 TITAN PILOTS if nerf is 2 BAD for SUPER CARRIERS.


The END is that SUPER CARRIERS nerfs have been confirmed and are FINAL apart from the HEL so is the Fighter nerf so you can now stick you SUPER CAPITAL BLOB up your A S S H O L E. It is not OK that 1% of game population makes it impossible for 99% to enjoy their game.

Ant that is what you are supporting, 99% of eve population disagrees whit you go over this forum topic you will find that the wast majority thinks these nerfs are not good enough that they need to be more severe for Titans.
FHM
Doomheim
#2147 - 2011-10-15 12:32:48 UTC
BRICKS4BALLS wrote:
Why shouldnt Super-capitals' have some sort of means to defend themselves from smaller ships for a short period of time at least.

Some people have played this game for an awful long time and have accumulated lots of isk/skills etc, and decided to never stay in smaller alliances/corps. At the same time some of these smaller groups may have a few supercaps, this change will take away those players ability to ever use these ships, knowning the increased chance of being pinned down now with no way to defend yourself. Some of the smaller corps/alliances simply wont ever have the numbers playing to have proper support.

Yea sure, I am aware that in the real world small organizations would'nt own massive ships like this.

The changes may work well to prevent big alliances blobing, but I'm sure they restrict smaller groups using them at all now.

Giving them an ability to field fewer drones than fighters/bombers may have been a better option, so at least a single HIC cant keep them pinned down for 30mins or so whilst they get a fleet together.

Also if someone goes to the trouble of baiting a frigate or cruiser so they drop a titan in to use the doomsday, then why not? Surely acts like this are humouous.


No that is exactly what needs to happen if you are 2 stupid to go and do something SOLO whit a FLEET SUPPORT ship whitout sub capital backup you deserve to die. The time when you did that and then got caught and log-offed and survived is over.

NO MORE BLOB WARFARE - NO MORE SOLO SUPER CAPITALS
Anyways Super Carrier and Fighter nerf is final and you can cry about it all you want. 20B does not buy you immunity or ability to kill everything in game. You had your fun for 2 years NOW IT OVER go SUCK A LEMON.

Also the argument saying you are bound to that ship or that you need a holding toon is compleate bullshit all Super Capital pilots can leave their ship and go to market or go fly sub capital ship for a moment. Thats why we have Capital Hangars and password protected POS where you can jump out of it and go do what you need to do.

So all following argmuents:
- They cost 20B ISK
- They cant be docked
- They took 1 month more to train than a ordinary carrier
- They need to be massive DPS ship
- They need to be unkillable
- Super Capital blob warfare needs to stay
- They need 500m3 drone bay at least
- They need to be able to defend them selves against sub capital
- They need to be SOLO and FLEET ships

All those arguments are beyond STUPID and GAME BRAKING none of those arguments are valid not enough to even consider not implementing this nerf. Support skills you need for Super Capitals do not apply and are not valid you need the same skills you need for a carrier only you need carrier 3 meaning you did not spend any extra time for these ships training support skills is completely you decision and since these skillls apply to other ships as well they are not a valid argument nor will they be reimbursed.

SOLO SUPER CAPITALS AND SUPER CAPITAL BLOB are OVER
FINALY SUPER CAPITALS NEED TO RELY ON SUB CAPITAL SUPPORT TO DEFEND THEM AGAINST OTHER SUB CAPITALS



DEAL WHIT IT
Oljud Zork
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2148 - 2011-10-15 12:38:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Oljud Zork
Posting in a +100 page thread... Roll

Well first off, the loggoff timer was needed and I have to quote Molle on this "Fear of loosing your ship makes you weak"

Yes I am one of the 3k SC pilots in game and I actually agree with Shadoo´s posting on page 3.

Shadoo wrote:
The only change that was needed -- was the logoff timer, now that even the biggest whiners had figured out how to force the enemy to avoid committing supercaps without support fleet.

So, good change with logoff timer.

The ehp reduction will not work the way you intended. It will simply encourage more people to move to Titans and ensure whoever has more titans will always win the engagement since no one will want to risk third of their fleet being wiped by DDs on the first jump in.

There was nothing wrong with supercapital EHP, except it was hard to kill them in a lagged system with the logoff timer. All your EHP reduction now does is make titans even more king than before. Was this your intention?

Dronebays -- fine, but I'd consider allowing every class of a supercarrier to store one flight of BOTH fighters and fighter bombers.

Siege Timer -- good, will make small ninja stuff viable.

ECM Burst -- good, seemed like a bug to begin with tbh.



I would have much rather personally seen a complete redesign of the supercapital shipclass and taken them off the battlefield. This one will simply buy you a bit of time, without really addressing the issue at all. It will stealth boost titans, and make entities who can regularly field 30+ of them more overpowered than before.


The longer you prolong the titan issue, the bigger problem you face when you finally face up to the fact they need a no-combat role and you have to somehow make 2k+ titan accounts worthwile in a non-combat role.



SC don't need to be nerfed, the reason they got buffed last time was that they were to vulnerable alone, remember it is still a carrier and carriers can field a truckload of drones. End of discussion, by removing all but the Fighters and FB's then they will be rather limited in its use...

Sad

Instead buff the Dreads to a certain level that they justify to be brought on to the battlefield, for example for every Dread in the same fleet let their eHP expand with a few % and when fielding lets say 20 or more dreads then their eHP exceeds what a focused DD can do in damage?

Don't remove content by nerfing what the older players have spent so much time and money on to get, instead tweak, fine tune and add content to resolve the issue...
2003 players will always have more SP, experience and isk than 2011 players regardless a metric-fekk-ton of postings on E-O claiming that the game is broken. The only difference now are that the bees shows up in Canes instead of Rifters...

Lol


Anyone who remember when the Danish corp X-13 killed the first Mothership in lowsec? Or how about when the BoB/GBC fleet smashed a "billboard" during the travel fleet on the way to the Max Damage campaign? Or when ASCN lost the first Titan ingame? Nothing in EvE are impossible, you just have to find a way to do it!


I am looking forward to see how the changes will look like when the winter expansion hits TQ, in the end its back to mr Darwin's theory:

"Evolve or die, those who refuse to adopt will become victims of Evolution."


Regards // Zork
FHM
Doomheim
#2149 - 2011-10-15 12:45:31 UTC
Oljud Zork wrote:
Posting in a +100 page thread... Roll

Well first off, the loggoff timer was needed and I have to quote Molle on this "Fear of loosing your ship makes you weak"

Yes I am one of the 3k SC pilots in game and I actually agree with Shadoo´s posting on page 3.

Shadoo wrote:
The only change that was needed -- was the logoff timer, now that even the biggest whiners had figured out how to force the enemy to avoid committing supercaps without support fleet.

So, good change with logoff timer.

The ehp reduction will not work the way you intended. It will simply encourage more people to move to Titans and ensure whoever has more titans will always win the engagement since no one will want to risk third of their fleet being wiped by DDs on the first jump in.

There was nothing wrong with supercapital EHP, except it was hard to kill them in a lagged system with the logoff timer. All your EHP reduction now does is make titans even more king than before. Was this your intention?

Dronebays -- fine, but I'd consider allowing every class of a supercarrier to store one flight of BOTH fighters and fighter bombers.

Siege Timer -- good, will make small ninja stuff viable.

ECM Burst -- good, seemed like a bug to begin with tbh.



I would have much rather personally seen a complete redesign of the supercapital shipclass and taken them off the battlefield. This one will simply buy you a bit of time, without really addressing the issue at all. It will stealth boost titans, and make entities who can regularly field 30+ of them more overpowered than before.


The longer you prolong the titan issue, the bigger problem you face when you finally face up to the fact they need a no-combat role and you have to somehow make 2k+ titan accounts worthwile in a non-combat role.



SC don't need to be nerfed, the reason they got buffed last time was that they were to vulnerable alone, remember its a 20Bil ship. It is still a carrier and carriers can field a truckload of drones. End of discussion, by removing all but the Fighters and FB's then they will be rather limited in its use...

Sad

Instead buff the Dreads to a certain level that they justify to be brought on to the battlefield, for example for every Dread in the same fleet let their eHP expand with a few % and when fielding lets say 20 or more dreads then their eHP exceeds what a focused DD can do in damage?

Don't remove content by nerfing what the older players have spent so much time and money on to get, instead tweak, fine tune and add content to resolve the issue...
2003 players will always have more SP, experience and isk than 2011 players regardless a metric-fekk-ton of postings on E-O claiming that the game is broken. The only difference now are that the bees shows up in Canes instead of Rifters...

Lol


Anyone who remember when the Danish corp X-13 killed the first Mothership in lowsec? Or how about when the BoB/GBC fleet smashed a "billboard" during the travel fleet on the way to the Max Damage campaign? Or when ASCN lost the first Titan ingame? Nothing in EvE are impossible, you just have to find a way to do it!


I am looking forward to see how the changes will look like when the winter expansion hits TQ, in the end its back to mr Darwin's theory:

"Evolve or die, those who refuse to adopt will become victims of Evolution."


Regards // Zork




Titans will after nerf be only good against capitals and super capitals. Enetitys that will move SC pilots from SCs to Titans will gain nothing due to those ships being unable to lay damage to sub capitals. Meaning BLOB Warfare whit Titans ends here. SC nerf is badly needed 20B is no money today.

20B when you can make that money in 10-15 Days, or in 1 Day is no valid argument. We reached a point where 20B is really puny ISK amount. Yes the SUPER CARRIERS were BUFFED because they were not strong enough "ALONE" but finally CCP realized these are not SOLO ships so BYE BYE.
leich
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#2150 - 2011-10-15 12:54:57 UTC
Ive still heard alot of people saying the fighter nerf is still going through even though dev has currently said it wont.

People have said that not nerfing fighters is pandering to care bears This is BS.

If the nerf were to go through Rorq's would be better at pvp the carriers.

Argument over you can all fo home now.
Bluemelon
ElitistOps
Deepwater Hooligans
#2151 - 2011-10-15 12:55:49 UTC
FHM

You are a moron.

'Nuff said

For all your 3rd party needs join my ingame channel Blue's 3rd Party!

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=365230&find=unread
Max Khaos
Republic Military School
#2152 - 2011-10-15 13:14:26 UTC
Quote:
SOLO SUPER CAPITALS AND SUPER CAPITAL BLOB are OVER
FINALY SUPER CAPITALS NEED TO RELY ON SUB CAPITAL SUPPORT TO DEFEND THEM AGAINST OTHER SUB CAPITALS



DEAL WHIT IT


Typing in caps still doesn't stop you looking like an idiot.

Look at the game designers own description of the Thanatos and then the Nyx and then come back with a silly argument why the Nyx shouldn't be able to do anything the Thanatos can do and more.
_______________________________________________
Kleg Nighthawk
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2153 - 2011-10-15 13:29:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Kleg Nighthawk
The fighter change needs reworking. Every single class of ship in the game iwns the class smaller it and can also bring a significant portion of it's damage agains ships two classes smaller

A battle ship is only two classes of ship smaller than a super carrier so the super should be able to hit it.

My solution would be to increase the Sig resolution of the fighters as the update sugests BUT actually make it a larger figure approx600-800m. This would make fighters totaly useless agains Cruiser and smaller hulls.
Now to compensate for this and to keep a portion of their damage against BC/BS optimal range and tracking need to be altered to have fighters able to hit them, currently their optimal and tracking make them suck at it.

This in conjunction with the removal of drones would reduce a super carriers ability to engage all sizes of ship while not just limiting them to attaking Capitals. Saying that though I think removing the regular drones is reducing their capabilities in too many places in one hit.

When fault finding change one thing at a time. If you **** around with all variables in one hit you have no idea what you're going to end up with and more mportantly even IF you get the desired effect you dont actually know why.
FHM
Doomheim
#2154 - 2011-10-15 13:37:23 UTC
Max Khaos wrote:
Quote:
SOLO SUPER CAPITALS AND SUPER CAPITAL BLOB are OVER
FINALY SUPER CAPITALS NEED TO RELY ON SUB CAPITAL SUPPORT TO DEFEND THEM AGAINST OTHER SUB CAPITALS



DEAL WHIT IT


Typing in caps still doesn't stop you looking like an idiot.

Look at the game designers own description of the Thanatos and then the Nyx and then come back with a silly argument why the Nyx shouldn't be able to do anything the Thanatos can do and more.


Thanatos is a capital costs about 1.5B to fit and doesn't have 20+mil EHP, and need to be in triage to have any supporting ability worth mentioning while you loose your offensive ability. So yes it can be solo.

Nyx is a 20B ship that can melt a single BS under 30s and no Logi can repair is fast enough considering most alliances can field 20+ of these they dont need no sub capital support you drop 30 of them on 250 sub capital fleet and they are dead.

Blob warfare whit super capitals is getting abused and it needs to stop and whit this nerfs it will so suck on it. You can cry all you want but they are getting nerfed and the Super Capital BLOB and SOLO Super Capitals are DEAD after this.

If super capitals not just super carriers have any ability to do damage to sub capital ships than game will slowly die since there will be no point in PVPing anymore. Any fleet you take out will simply be matched by a much larger Super Capital fleet.
That is not how things work. SUPER CAPITALS need to be useless against SUB CAPITALS

And all you guys that are super capital pilots have not provided 1 solid argument why this should not go in to effect all i hear is:
- They are worth 20B that is alot even tho we make about 10 Trillion / week
- They needed 1 year of skill training even tho it only take carrier 3 - support skills do not count
- They dont have enough DPS as it is we need more
- They are killable we need to change that
- The log off timer is 2 long i want to disappear 1 second after i log even if i am agrssed
- They need to be able to sit 300km off the gate and just kill everything that passes
- They need to be able to dock
- They need to be able enter empire
- O no my alliance is goining to fail now because we cant field anything other than super capitals
- O no my BOTs are no longer going to work i cannot RMT anymore
- O no i can no longer hog up all the anomaly's anymore
- O no i can no longer be a ****** to my corpmates cuss i now need their support
- No i can no longer kill a sub capital ship - i am in a fleet support ship and i been caught solo without support what now

Those are the only arguments you guys come up whit and they all FAIL.

I have not hear 1 argument that would be valid where it would meet the mutual ground between super and sub capital pilot. All you want to support is an idea of a unkillabe ship, super capital blob warfare and great BOTTING machine.
FHM
Doomheim
#2155 - 2011-10-15 13:43:41 UTC
Kleg Nighthawk wrote:
The fighter change needs reworking. Every single class of ship in the game iwns the class smaller it and can also bring a significant portion of it's damage agains ships two classes smaller

A battle ship is only two classes of ship smaller than a super carrier so the super should be able to hit it.

My solution would be to increase the Sig resolution of the fighters as the update sugests BUT actually make it a larger figure approx600-800m. This would make fighters totaly useless agains Cruiser and smaller hulls.
Now to compensate for this and to keep a portion of their damage against BC/BS optimal range and tracking need to be altered to have fighters able to hit them, currently their optimal and tracking make them suck at it.

This in conjunction with the removal of drones would reduce a super carriers ability to engage all sizes of ship while not just limiting them to attaking Capitals. Saying that though I think removing the regular drones is reducing their capabilities in too many places in one hit.

When fault finding change one thing at a time. If you **** around with all variables in one hit you have no idea what you're going to end up with and more mportantly even IF you get the desired effect you dont actually know why.


Thats exactly the problem Super Carriers and Titans being able to hit ships smaller than BS. You said SC is 2 classes above BS so it should be able to hit them and battle-cruisers. Meaning BS whit no tracking enhancer or web should be able to hit a frig whit 0 sig thats moving at 500 orbit at 5km/s speed.

That is not balanced. If they should be able to hit sub capitals then they should not be able hulls below BS no matter how much they are Target Painted. The end result is to STOP super capital BLOB once and for ALL and for now. SC and Titans not being able to hit SUB CAPITAL ships is the only way to achieve that.

But the most pathetic thing i see is people that are part of alliances that can reimburse any number of super capital loses any time are crying about this. Not to mention so many SC losses get reimbursed by CCP we also have Alliances now sitting on such stupendous amounts of ISK that 20 Billion isk is really crap wallet balance.
leich
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#2156 - 2011-10-15 14:11:53 UTC
I think part of the problem people have have with the supers nerf is that a single Hic could kill a super on it's own.

I theroy that is.

Supers have no way to push them off.
FHM
Doomheim
#2157 - 2011-10-15 14:20:18 UTC
leich wrote:
I think part of the problem people have have with the supers nerf is that a single Hic could kill a super on it's own.

I theroy that is.

Supers have no way to push them off.


That is the most stupid argument you can come up whit:

1) HIC could never solo kill a Super Capital
2) Super Capital should not be doing anything on their own
3) If you get caught without sub capital support you are dead period
4) If supers have any ability to damage sub capitals then nothing will be fixed and the Super Capital BLOB will continue to exist

SUPER CAPITALS DEPEND ON SUB CAPITALS TO DEFEND THEM AGAINST OTHER SUB CAPITALS

For super capitals to be able to hit sub capitals makes no sense and i have not heard 1 proper argument against that.
wanking monkey girl
Doomheim
#2158 - 2011-10-15 14:37:49 UTC
FHM you have no idea what will happen after this nurf you are holding to the idea even with the said changes that they will be nothing but the odd ship you see from time to time that will kill all the pos mods sov mods and so on.

what about that the only safe place to have them will be low sec give the ecm mod will get them out of trouble is something happens

you also can't grasp the idea that you buy a ship you need to move it 4 cap jumps to the your home system you think you need to have a full support fleet to move 1 ship 4 jumps and to have a fleet at every point you are not being realistic about any of the suggestions coming forth.

you said you want to have small alliance move to 0.0 and take space from alliance with large super cap fleets at the moment
they have the fleets but they never started out with them every alliance holding space on a large scale have a sub cap fleet that know how to fight and will not just be using the 1 fleet comp but several,he power blocks have large amount of players backing them from several alliances if you think its possible for 1 alliance just starting out in eve to take space from one of the big players then you need to think again after the nurf you may see some change in the way 0.0 is structured but on the most part it will be the same setup.

old eve players that have invested a massive amount of time in to eve deserve some reward from the game not just a kick down from new payers and the people thinking its unfair they can't afford and use some ship types this is just not about supers but also in general.

FHM you can troll all you want


lets try and and salvage the thread for suggestions


ships costing so much in both isk and skill time ccp think about rewarding the hard work of you loyal eve fans and addicts

How to fix a titan by making them remote links stop working on them.
getting impunity for ewar means it should not get any form of help from remote links like tracking and sebo.

nurf changes
hp hit great but not the hel
DD fine
agro timer great

sc
let them have 20 fighter bombers and 20 fighters and a small drone bay with about 500m3 this will cut
if you go ahead with the changes listed then turn them in to advanced carrier and let them dock at lest their going to be used and made after the nurf.

as many have pointed out with the agro timer you will see many more die in the weeks and month that follow..

but also fix the self destruct add so ships in combat can not selfdestruck.

on a side note super carriers in combat cannot refill on stranded drones lock the function with the agro timer.
solo super carrier moving about will be able to deafened itself for a limited amount of time

IF the planed changes are introduced allow them to dock and turn the super carriers in to advanced carriers.
LET advanced carriers DOCK
BRICKS4BALLS
Freelancer Union
Unaffiliated
#2159 - 2011-10-15 14:40:04 UTC
"No that is exactly what needs to happen if you are 2 stupid to go and do something SOLO whit a FLEET SUPPORT ship whitout sub capital backup you deserve to die. The time when you did that and then got caught and log-offed and survived is over."

This is what some muppet wrote in response to my post, to stupid to actually understand my post it seems.

You say on one hand that if use a ship designed for fleet support solo then u deserve to die, well I agree, if you die, then u deserve it. Risk vs reward as always plays an important part in the game.

So if your saying this, then why do we need the nerf??

Answer, we dont, at least not to the extent that it will be implemented, what we perhaps need is more risk for the reward.

If you take away all the reward, nobody will risk their ships.
leich
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#2160 - 2011-10-15 14:52:50 UTC
FHM how many supers have you killed?